Blocky artifacts in video, part 2

[The111]

A year ago I made this post and received excellent help:

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/303003-How-to-reduce-blocky-artifacts-in-low-res-lo...60#post1857660

Specifically a guy named poisondeathray held my hand through all my noobery and got me to a functional workflow which I documented very well and continued using successfully for over a year. However, I am now not getting the same results, and I think it might be due to a change in video source.

Originally, I was getting HDV-1080i from a HDVcam (.m2t files). I was editing it in Vegas, outputting an HDV-1080i render, and then taking that into AviSynth, with a script like this:

DirectShowSource("X:\blah\blah.m2t", fps=29.970, audio=false, convertfps=true)
LoadPlugin("C:\MeGUI\tools\avisynth_plugin\TDeint.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\MeGUI\tools\avisynth_plugin\EEDI2.d ll")
edeintted = last.AssumeTFF().SeparateFields().SelectEven().EED I2(field=-1)
TDeint(order=1,edeint=edeintted)
#crop
LanczosResize(1280,720) # Lanczos (Sharp)
#denoise
ConvertToYV12()

I would process that in MeGUI using x264, 2-pass, 2000kbps, H.264 Deblocking 1:1, CABAC, 8 reference frames, and a bunch of other crap that is all greek to me (as is some of what I just listed). Basically I just saved a template of all of the advice I got and kept using it.

However, now I have an AVCHD camera that shoots 1920x1080 with an MTS extension. I rendered from Vegas a "Sony AVC" AVCHD 1920x1080 render with .m2ts extension. I took that into AviSynth and MeGUI, same as I did before, with the same x264 settings, etc... but the end result now is an .mp4 with huge blocky artifact everywhere, that were never present before.

Any ideas? Thanks in advance!!!

[The111]

Here is an example of the blocky video:

http://www.matthoover.com/blocky.mp4

[poisondeathray]

It also looks like it was blend deinterlaced at some point (maybe in vegas?)

Did you check the export from vegas? At what stage do the errors occur ? (i.e. is the vegas export ok, and only after megui problems occur) ?

You can also try updating your programs (x264 , megui) . The settings are a bit different now. Efficiency is a bit better than a year ago

[The111]

It also looks like it was blend deinterlaced at some point (maybe in vegas?)

Did you check the export from vegas? At what stage did the errors occur ?

Thanks for the reply Poison.

Ok, I could have sworn I triple checked that project de-interlacing was turned off (before posting here), but lo and behold I just checked found out it was in fact still on. A very embarrassing mistake to make since that is one of the problems you helped me solve last year. HOWEVER... turns out my problem still exists even once I turn that off. I found a work-around solution for it, but I don't think it is optimal. I will try to walk through the steps. First thing I try is outputting AVCHD 1920x1080-60i from Vegas with Sony AVC codec.

01a_-_VegasOut_-_Sony_AVC_-_AVCHD_1920x1080-60i_(Smart_Resample).m2ts
Video looks great. I use "smart resample" option in Vegas because otherwise the slow-mo looks like crap.
Now I convert in Megui:
01b_-_meguiOut_-_Poison2000_1280x720.mp4
Blockiness ensues.

So I try without "smart resample."
02a_-_VegasOut_-_Sony_AVC_-_AVCHD_1920x1080-60i_(Disable_Resample).m2ts
Video looks like crap, very choppy.
Convert in Megui:
02b_-_meguiOut_-_Poison2000_1280x720.mp4
Still choppy and crappy... still blocky.

So I would conclude that "smart resample" has nothing to do with the blockiness. Also, I used smart resample all the time in the past with my HDV projects (which I rendered from Vegas with MainConcept MPEG-2). So, a third test:

03a_-_VegasOut_-_MainConcept_MPEG-2_-_HDV_1440x1080-60i_(Smart_Resample).m2t
Video looks great.
Convert in Megui:
03b_-_meguiOut_-_Poison2000_1280x720.mp4
Not blocky! (even though I used smart resample)

So now I would conclude that Sony AVC encoder from Vegas results in final video being blocky, while MainConcept MPEG-2 does not. Strange, but my problem is solved? Not really, because I am rendering 1440x1080 from a 1920x1080 source... which seems stupid to throw away pixels (let's pretend I'm not converting to 1280x720 immediately after). So, why would I not find a MainConcept MPEG-2 preset which would allow 1920x1080 render? There is one, called "Blu-Ray 1920x1080-60i 25Mbps"... but it forces .m2v extension, which Avisynth/Megui do not seem to accept, though they take .m2t and .m2ts fine.

So I have a workaround... but I'm still lost. I remember last year you explaining to me that Avisynth was intended to be used as a literal frameserver, and that I was doing things inefficiently by doing a double render (vegas render + megui render). And I understand that concept but since I couldn't get the frameserv thing to work last time I tried, I figured the losses in my double conversion were small enough to ignore, especially considering the end result bitrate/res. But now I'm wondering if I should retry the frameserv thing... but I really have no idea how. Either that or I just keep on with my 1920x1080 -> 1440x1080 -> 1280x720 double conversions... which seems stupid.

Thanks again so much for taking the time to look through this, please have an e-beer on me.

EDIT: Oh, and yes I have latest versions of MeGUI and Vegas.

[jagabo]

Maybe Vegas AVC output uses PAFF/MBAFF but MeGUI decoder can't handle them?

[poisondeathray]

1) I've seen those encoding errors with Sony AVC through vegas. Mainconcept AVC is much more stable. A lossless intermediate would be even better idea (huge filesize, but less quality loss. But I suppose when the end product is 2Mb/s you might not see a big difference)

2) Smart resample blends frames (blurry) , Disable resample duplicates frames (choppy) during speed changes. Neither is great.

3) HDV is 1440x1080 only. That's why you don't find a preset for 1920x1080. Export using Mainconcept AVC. You can change the preset values as well (make sure they match what you are exporting)

4) The blu-ray .m2v is MPEG2. You would use DGIndex to create a .d2v file, then use MPEG2Source("file.d2v"). There is a version of DGIndex in the tools menu of megui, or you can use the standalone version

[jagabo]

I had no trouble with the M2TS h.264 video. I used AviSynth's DirectShowSource() and x264.

[poisondeathray]

Maybe he's using a different directshow decoder ? You're using ffdshow jagabo? He should update his decoder

I would still avoid Sony AVC export from vegas. It leads to random white frames, smeared frames, and blocky frames - all corruption issues

[jagabo]

Yes, I was using ffdshowmt.

[poisondeathray]

Yes, video 01a seems fine decoding and encoding here too (ffdshow as well)

[The111]

Wow, thanks for all the replies guys. Jagabo, I recognize your name also as helping me last year. On my way out the door to work but I will try all the other suggestions mentioned tonight. For now I'll add one thing:

3) HDV is 1440x1080 only. That's why you don't find a preset for 1920x1080. Export using Mainconcept AVC. You can change the preset values as well (make sure they match what you are exporting)

Well, I did find out a way to get 1920x1080 HDV last night. I select the HDV preset, then change "High 1440" to "High" and "1440" to "1920" in the settings. Then it puts out a .m2t at 1920x1080 (1:1 pixels of course)... and it works for the rest of my process.

I did try MainConcept AVC at one point, but I canceled the subsequent Megui operation because it was taking like 5x longer than usual (over half an hour just for my 8 second sample).

[jagabo]

All evidence points to a bad h.264 decoder. I suspect the problem is PAFF/MBAFF.