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  1. Lone soldier Cauptain's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    Some doubts
    NP, you can

    I can make that comparison. HDMI vs Component with both codecs.

    Do you have any preference on how to perform the tests?



    Claudio
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  2. Well for codec settings, for lagarith go with RGB setting (as it doesnīt downsample and uppsample), donīt know about the other one, but i guess rgb there too, donīt know what the source is. If itīs impossible with RGB, capture at Yuv2 or yv12. just so itīs the same Colorspace on both, so itīs really the same thing as in lossless
    Last edited by zerowalker; 7th Aug 2011 at 03:04.
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  3. Lone soldier Cauptain's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    Well for codec settings, for lagarith go with RGB setting (as it doesnīt downsample and uppsample), donīt know about the other one, but i guess rgb there too, donīt know what the source is. If itīs impossible with RGB, capture at Yuv2 or yv12. just so itīs the same Colorspace on both, so itīs really the same thing as in lossless
    My source is PS3. AverTV HD is YUY2 only.
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  4. Okay, well, donīt know what PS3 sends out, but it make such a matter as when encoding itīs always yv12, but ofc you can make it yuv2 and rgb, but i guess itīs more yuv2 than rgb. donīt really know the difference between them, i guess itīs not noticeable;O

    But do it in yuv2 then, Captain Audio
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  5. Hmm, off topic but i realised that virtualdub always decompress as either rgb24 or rgb32, i have selected Auto Select for decompression.
    I tried for example right now, captured with the new codec in Yuy2 mode (i could choose yuy2 and yv12), then opened that file after it was captured, then i cold compress as RGB even with fast recompress, which is supposed to leave things unchanged. Any ideas?
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  6. Analog video (component, s-video, composite) encodes colors (U and V, or Cb and Cr) at lower resolution than the grayscale (Y) image. Every analog capture card captures as YUY2 (or other 4:2:2 subsampling) because the analog signal contains YUV, not RGB. If the card/driver has an RGB option that RGB comes from converting the YUY2 data to RGB while capturing.

    HDMI can be either YCbCr (similar 4:2:2 chroma subsampling) or RGB. If RGB from a broadcast source it almost certainly came from a chroma subsampled source (MPEG family codecs usually use YV12 internally). Video games may be an exception. Graphics are rendered in RGB and can be sent directly to the HDMI port as RGB.

    VirtualDub can now work in any of several colorspaces (you've probably seen the list in Video -> Color Depth). Most filters only work in RGB though.
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  7. I see, nice info;D
    But why does virtualdub uppsample the colorspace of a yuv2 file and the like, if i donīt force it;S
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  8. Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    But why does virtualdub uppsample the colorspace of a yuv2 file and the like, if i donīt force it;S
    When VirtualDub asks a codec to decompress a video they negotiate a colorspace that both of them support. A codec can be set to prefer RGB over YUV. Some codecs can only output RGB (Panasonic DV codec, for example). Or, if you compressed in RGB mode the codec will prefer to output in RGB.

    On VirtualDub's filter list you can enable the display of the colorspace at each filter. I know the Brightness/Contrast filer can work in YUV or RGB. So that's a convenient filter to add to see what colorspace was negotiated.
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  9. Yeah but that sounds very bad, as Lagarith for example is decoded as RGB32 in virtual dub (or rgb24), itīs always decoded as such i think, itīs the same on players, they are doing colorspace conversation, there must be a way to prevent this.

    PS: If you connect Analog to that card we discussed, you need to do some kind of conversion right, as it donīt have composite input for example, how do you solve it, and does it hurt quality?
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  10. Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    Yeah but that sounds very bad, as Lagarith for example is decoded as RGB32 in virtual dub (or rgb24), itīs always decoded as such i think,
    No, if the video was compressed by Lagarith from a YUY2 source it will prefer to output YUY2. Try the attached file made from a YUY2 source.

    Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    itīs the same on players, they are doing colorspace conversation, there must be a way to prevent this.
    What shows up on the screen is always RGB. So the conversion has to be made somewhere.

    Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    PS: If you connect Analog to that card we discussed, you need to do some kind of conversion right, as it donīt have composite input for example, how do you solve it, and does it hurt quality?
    It comes with a dongle for connecting analog inputs.

    Click image for larger version

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    image from: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815100049

    If you look closely at the card itself, what looks like two HDMI ports is one HDMI port and a port for the dongle.
    Image Attached Files
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  11. Ah nicely, good that it comes with that dongle thing
    I tried your file, opened it in virtualdub, if i save Fast Recompress Uncompressed it becomes RGB24, if i choose Lagarith it becomes yuy2.
    yuy2 ís correct, but why doesnīt virtualdub feel it, and make me choose between codecs that support that source, as it does in capture.
    Cause else i wouldīt know what kind of source it was, i mean for the other Codec, as it shows all the separate codecs for it (RGB,YUY2,YV12).
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  12. Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    I tried your file, opened it in virtualdub, if i save Fast Recompress Uncompressed it becomes RGB24
    I get uncompressed YUY2 if I do that.

    Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    why doesnīt virtualdub feel it, and make me choose between codecs that support that source, as it does in capture.
    What do you have the output colorspace set to? I have the decompression colorspace set to Autoselect and the Output format set to Same as Decompression Format:

    Click image for larger version

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    You can always force the output colorspace too. Actually, I usually have both set to YUY2 or YV16 (same as YUY2 except planer, not interleaved).

    Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    Cause else i wouldīt know what kind of source it was, i mean for the other Codec, as it shows all the separate codecs for it (RGB,YUY2,YV12).
    Add the Null Transform filter and set the Filter dialog to show colorspaces. That will show you the colorspace negotiated between the decompression codec and VirtualDub:

    Click image for larger version

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    As you can see, it shows the colorspace before and after each filter.
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  13. This is when i have Auto and Same as, in colorspace.
    Image Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

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  14. When you exported uncompressed what was the output colorspace setting?
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  15. The settings where as your picture, and the file i saved with uncompressed got as stated RGB24
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  16. What does MediaInfo say about the saved file?
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  17. Video
    ID : 0
    Format : RGB
    Codec ID : 0x00000000
    Codec ID/Info : Basic Windows bitmap format. 1, 4 and 8 bpp versions are palettised. 16, 24 and 32bpp contain raw RGB samples
    Duration : 1s 1ms
    Bit rate : 249 Mbps
    Width : 720 pixels
    Height : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio : 3:2
    Frame rate : 29.970 fps
    Standard : NTSC
    Bit depth : 8 bits
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 24.000
    Stream size : 29.7 MiB (100%)

    Hope i copied right, it mostly said RGB instead of Lagarith
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  18. Then force the output colorspace to YUY2 before saving.
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  19. Well then it works i guess, but if you set Auto on colorspace, does your save as RGB aswell?
    Cause why should it decompress into RGB in the first place, isnīt that bad, and if i force to yuy2, it will be like Upsampling and downsampling right?
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  20. If the source is YUY2 (eg, the Lagarith file I uploaded), and I have the input colorspace set to Auto or YUY2, I get YUY2 output. That's true for direct stream copy, fast recompress, normal recompress, even full processing mode. I'm currently using VirtualDub 1.9.11. The video stays in YUY2 or YV16 unless I use a filter that requires RGB.
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  21. hmm, why does it change for me then. Cause in any matter it ainīt good, will try figure it out, please print screen your settings, and if you have any ideas, please tell

    EDIT: If you open the log window, and press play in virtualdub, what does it say?
    EDIT2: if i set lagarith to prevent upsampling, i canīt play with the first play button (i need to rofce yuv2 or something), but with the other it decompresses as Yuyv.
    Last edited by zerowalker; 8th Aug 2011 at 12:15.
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  22. I have lagarith set as follows:

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    I can't play the source video with the "prevent upsampling" option enabled like this -- I get an error dialog about the video not being RGB. But I have no need to play videos while editing. I can play the output video though. Actually, I hardly ever use VirtualDub for filtering. I usually use AviSynth for that.
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  23. Yeah i use avisynth aswell, but if i am gonna cut or stuff or do some editing with virtualdub, it makes me frustrated that it doesnīt work well.
    Can you play Lagarith videos if you got those settings, as i canīt if i have Prevent Upsampling When Decoding on;S
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  24. I already told you I can't "play" lagarith YUY2 videos if I have the "prevent upsampling..." option set. But scrubbing through the video and playing the output video work fine. That's a longstanding bug in VirtualDub.
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  25. Yes but did you mean play it on Virtualdub or play the output lagarith file, as i canīt play the output lagarith file, which you could, i canīt do either.
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  26. When I press the >I button (or File -> Preview Input) in VirtualDub it will not play. When I press the >O button (or File -> Preview Filtered) in VirtualDub it will play.
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  27. ah, that is the same as me then. But if you save the file now, as a Lagarith Yuy2, can you play it?
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  28. Member Seeker47's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by stevon111 View Post
    Got my Hauppauge Collossus today! Box was heavy with cables, card and software. Now for scheduled cable box capture!
    Building a Mini ITX HTPC is tricky, heat, noise, specialized PSU and other issues.
    Re Post #11: That certainly looks like a Shuttle. (Despite issues with some of their many models, still the best SFF boxes I'm aware of, and likely best suited for HTPC usage.) Some hardware details ?
    Last edited by Seeker47; 8th Aug 2011 at 13:58.
    When in Las Vegas, don't miss the Pinball Hall of Fame Museum http://www.pinballmuseum.org/ -- with over 150 tables from 6+ decades of this quintessentially American art form.
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  29. Originally Posted by zerowalker View Post
    ah, that is the same as me then. But if you save the file now, as a Lagarith Yuy2, can you play it?
    With the "prevent upsampling" option enabled I can't play LAGS video with various media players. If I disable that option all the player will play it.
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  30. Member Seeker47's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by jagabo
    It happened with the AverTV HD PVR. The driver was updated pretty quickly to fix the "problem".
    Was that the "Ninja" drivers referred to in post #59 ? Is this driver version still available ?

    How well does the AverTV product compare with the Hauppauge HD models ?
    When in Las Vegas, don't miss the Pinball Hall of Fame Museum http://www.pinballmuseum.org/ -- with over 150 tables from 6+ decades of this quintessentially American art form.
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