Alternative to HuffYUV for VHS capture.. Need smaller file sizes

[HDClown]

Ok, I've come to the realization that while HuffYUV is the best option for a codec to use for my VHS Capture. I simply don't have the storage space to accomodate all the VHS I want to capture, and I'm not confident that it's worth spending all the money on storage to use HuffYUV. This stuff is 80s and 90s era home video recorded on VHS and VHC-C camcorders in SP mode, and sometimes EP mode.

So, with that in mind, I need the experts opinions on an alternative codec to use for my master capture files. I need to maintain the capabilities i have today with HuffYUV in being able to work with the files easily in VirtualDub. The basics I do with these captures include cutting them into segments, removing bad areas (from damaged sections of tape), and processing the audio. To process the audio, I save out the audio track and run it through filters in GoldWave (primarily noise reduction filter) and then import the new audio back into the master file. I also have plans in the future (a few years from now when computers are much faster) of getting into lots of heavy "cleanup" with AviSynth filters (I've seen some really impressive stuff), so the new codec needs to be compatible.

For reference, I have the following equipment set that I've been using: Toshiba W-808 S-VHS -> Panasonic DMR-ES10 -> ATI TV Wonder 750 USB. The Toshiba has DNR but no TBC.

I also have a Sony TRV-120 Digital 8 camcorder which has built in DNR and TBC) that can be used for Analog -> DV pass-through. The TRV-120 has s-video input. And I also have a Canon HV20 HDV Camcorder that can do Analog -> DV pass-through, but the HV20 has no S-Video input.

[filmboss80]

Huffyuv does not need to be the final archival format, but if you are going to run the footage through filters for "clean-up," it is a good codec to use in the early stages. Upon editing and cleaning up a Huffyuv video, you can output the final video file as DV-AVI -- an absolutely wonderful archival format that takes up far less space while maintaining great visual quality.

[HDClown]

filmboss80: The problem I run into is that I don't plan to do all of the filtering "today". Processors need a few more years to progress (and cost to come down) where I'll be able to build a system to use where processing this much footage makes sense. However, I want to get all this stuff imported so I can start to clip stuff up and get them online for family to view. The longest part of capture is the time involved of 1x speed playback. I'm hoping to only have to do that once, because of the time involved, and because of the age of these tapes. I've already had some tapes that are at the age where every time I put them in the VCR and play/rewind them, I'm starting to see signs of degredation of the mdium.

So, since I don't have the storage space to keep in HuffYUV as a archive format, I have the dilemna going back to the archival codec to process against, or having to spend all the time over again to 1x capture.

When it really comes down to it, how much of a difference is there between a DV-AVI capture and a HuffYUV for filtering? Also, if you advocate HuffYUV -> DV-AVI, what DV-AVI codec do you recommend?

[jagabo]

Try Cedocida.

HuffYUV 4:2:2 chroma subsampling. DV 4:1:1 chroma subsampling. Ie for a 720x480 frame, the colors are encoded at 360x480 with HuffYUV, 180x480 with DV. Not of much consequence for VHS caps with only about 40x480 chroma. DV also will cause a little macroblocking from the DCT compression.

[HDClown]

Would the Sony DV codec using when passing through the TRV-120 be any better or worse than the Cedoocida codec?

[edDV]

They should be similar but first test your camcorder to see if it places black properly at digital 16 or improperly at level 32 (washout).

If correct then it comes down to the performance of the Sony analog inputs and hardware DV codec vs. your capture card + Cedocida software DV codec (requires a reasonable CPU).

[HDClown]

How do I check this "black property" ? I have some imports made on the TRV-120 already (from some Video 8/Hi8 tapes).

[jagabo]

Would the Sony DV codec using when passing through the TRV-120 be any better or worse than the Cedoocida codec?

I don't think there would be much difference in the DV encoding quality. But you probably have no control over levels, saturation, etc. when using the Camcorder passthrough.

[edDV]

How do I check this "black property" ? I have some imports made on the TRV-120 already (from some Video 8/Hi8 tapes).

Post a frame cap from VLC or a few frames of DV-AVI. I can look at it. Make it a frame that includes both black and full white content.


PS: This needs testing on the analog pass-through mode from the composite/S-Video inputs. Internal analog Hi8/Video8 tape playback in Digital8 camcorders has never had a black level issue.

[jagabo]

How do I check this "black property" ?

You can use AviSynth's Histogram():

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/322236-Lowering-contrast-in-H264-file?p=1995762&vie...=1#post1995762

In your case the script would be simple like:

AviSource("filename.avi")
Histogram()

[HDClown]

Bumping up an old thread hear instead of starting a new one. I want to give Cedocida a whirl. I am capturing VHS which is played through a Toshiba W-808 S-VHS which then passes through a Panasonic DMR-ES10 (S-Video + Stereo Audio) and then into a Diamond TVW750USB into a computer running Windows XP x32. Using VirtualDub to do the capture

I am uncertain how I should configure Cedocida based on my equipment. Could someone help me out?

[jagabo]

Set your capture card to capture as YUY2. Cedocida should be set like this:



Change the aspect ratio settings as appropriate for your source. If you capture YV12 set the YV12 chroma sample to MPEG 2 interlaced. Other Output formats can be used but I prefer to leave it at YUY2 unless I have a need for the others (like an editor that requires RGB).

[HDClown]

I'm a little confused on using Cedocida while I capture. When I go into Capture AVI in VirtualDub, Cedocida doesn'ts how up under Compression options for Video. All I have is uncompressed. Is thre a way to have this captuer and compress to DV as it captures?

[jagabo]

Cedocida shows up in VirtualDub on my computers.

[HDClown]

I don't need to copy anything into a virtualdub folder do I? I see Cedocida under Video/Compression (while not in capture mode), seems unusual

[jagabo]

I don't need to copy anything into a virtualdub folder do I?

No.

I see Cedocida under Video/Compression (while not in capture mode), seems unusual

Weird. I see it both places. Reinstall?

[HDClown]

Upon further investigation, when i choose the capture device as AVStream Analog Capture (DirectShow), which is how the Diamond device is showing up, I can't select Cedocida. Likewise, if I select Microsoft WDM image Capture Win32 (VFW) it doesn't show up. This device doesn't let me capture with the card either. if I select emulation, Cedocida shows up.

So it appears the codec is not compatible with my capture device?

[jagabo]

If HuffYUV shows up Cedocida should too.

[Cherbette]

I have HuffYUV installed and it works in capture mode yet Cedocida is not showing up in capture mode for me in virtualdub either....

[HDClown]

I tried it on another computer, I think it has something to do with the capture hardware not allowing it. I'm just going to end up passing through my DV camera.