Capture and Record US Cable Channels in full HD?

[onesikgypo]

Hi,

I was just wondering how i could capture and record US cable channels (Such as USA FX etc.) in full HD digital format. I currently havea tunner card which can capture/record the local chans in QAM but obviouslyt his wont work for the US Cable chans.

I am aware that there is a method above for connecting the PC to the set top box via firewire - however im running 64bit and to date i have never been able to find the equivelant drivers - they all seem to be 32bit.

Looking around i seem to have found 2 possible options, both external, these are Hauppauge's HD PVR (http://www.hauppauge.com/site/products/data_hdpvr.html) and ATI's Digital Cable TV Wonder (http://www.amd.com/us/products/pctv/tv-wonder-tuners/Pages/digital-cable-tuner.aspx)

Has anyone had any experience with the above 2 and say whether theyc ome out the same HD quality as recording over QAM on a simple tv tuner? Or does anyone have any other suggestions?

Thanks In Advance.

[Nelson37]

The HD PVR will work, for now. But when they block off HD over component, you're all done.

SFAIK, the ATI uses cablecard technology. From all I have read, this just does not work very reliably yet.

There is something which comes close to HD, definitely better than SD recording of standard channels, and is not likely to be cut off. Use a standard analog card to record downsampld HD thru the S-video connection. Definitely an improvement over SD channels. Anamorphic 16:9 can be done with some cards.

The HD PVR may offer a similar capability over component after the analog HD shutoff.

[usually_quiet]

I don't have ATI's cablecard tuner but thegreenbutton.com hase some recent threads with comments by people who do. Most there who have one seem happy with it.

Apparently, most of the problems with it were eventually solved. The analog and ATSC/clear QAM tuners seem to need a stronger signal than some other TV capture devices, but with a CableCARD installed and a strong signal, the HD picture quality should be good.

It likely would work well with Windows 7 Media Center for recording non-premium HD cable channels, assuming your PC meets the requirements for using a CableCARD tuner, and your provider sends a technician who knows how to set one up.

ATI's cablecard tuner costs between $200 and $300 new. It is hard to find new right now, but used ones are sometimes available for less. Later this year, SiliconDust is supposed to come out with a $250 dual-tuner cablecard device that connects via an ethernet port as a network device. SiliconDust has a great reputation, and two tuners would be an improvement over the one that the ATI product provides.

As far as I know Windows 7 is a requirement for using a CableCARD tuner, unless you happen to have a CableLabs-certified PC running Vista. Even with Windows 7, your PC has to pass Microsoft's Digital Cable Advisor tests for the CableCARD tuner to work. http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows7/Digital-cable-tuners-frequently-asked-questions

Any software that works with CableCARD tuners is required to obey DRM restrictions. Using Windows 7 Media Center, your PC won't record premium content that is flagged "copy never". It will record anything marked "copy once", but prevents additional copies from being made. However you will be able to record and make additional copies of anything flagged "copy freely".

[onesikgypo]

The HD PVR will work, for now. But when they block off HD over component, you're all done.

Are there currently any plans to Block off HD Over component? And if so, when would this be?

your PC won't record premium content that is flagged "copy never". It will record anything marked "copy once", but prevents additional copies from being made. However you will be able to record and make additional copies of anything flagged "copy freely".

Do You know what the practical reality of this, i.e. what are most shows on US cable channels marked as?

Thanks so far

I've also found the following which was meant to come out end of may this year but was pushed back - looking around this apepars to have good reviews, it actually does 4 tuners instead of the mentioned 2 in the previous post:

[Nelson37]

I believe the firm cutoff date stated in regulation is in the next year or two. 2011 or 2012. Close enough that this solution was eliminated for me.

The restrictions on the cablecard also ruled this out. That and the article I read a while back where multiple technicians from ATI, Comcast, and other were totally unable to get one working, after a couple days, and had no idea why. It took ATI a very long time to get the AIW series working correctly, and this was definitely not a smooth, steady process. I'll pass.

[edDV]

Current situation. You can cap IEEE-1394 broadcast channels 100%. Cable channels are at desecration of the cable/sat company. Here on Comcast, FXHD is on IEEE-1394, USA-HD is blocked. This seems to change periodically for unknown reasons. Analog component is supposed to be supported until current legislation expires in 2012. After that it is up in the air.

So far the Obama FCC has allowed first run (pre DVD/BluRay release Pay Per View) movies to be blocked on analog component.

Don't trust either political party on these matters.

[bigjimmpls]

I have to say that I have the ATI TV wonder digital cable tuner with the cablecard and it records beautifully on the HD channels. I wouldnt give mine up for anything. I have never had a sync issue with the recordings. The ati was expensive but well worth it and the cablecard costs me $2.99 a month.

Something to think about!!!

[edDV]

I have to say that I have the ATI TV wonder digital cable tuner with the cablecard and I records beautifully on the HD channels. I wouldnt give mine up for anything. I have never had a sync issue with the recordings. The ati was expensive but well worth it and the cablecard costs me $2.99 a month.

Something to think about!!!

Which cable provider?

Which channels are blocked?
Can you record Premium channels or Pay Per View HD?

[usually_quiet]

your PC won't record premium content that is flagged "copy never". It will record anything marked "copy once", but prevents additional copies from being made. However you will be able to record and make additional copies of anything flagged "copy freely".

Do You know what the practical reality of this, i.e. what are most shows on US cable channels marked as?

Thanks so far

I've also found the following which was meant to come out end of may this year but was pushed back - looking around this apepars to have good reviews, it actually does 4 tuners instead of the mentioned 2 in the previous post:

http://www.cetoncorp.com/products.php

As far as I know, so far only paid on-demand movies/events, HBO, and similar channels have been permitted to use anything other than "copy freely". (As I understand it, the FCC has to give approval.)

Ceton's products did get good reviews, and generated a lot of interest at CES, but considering the one you are asking about costs about $400, it had better be good.

[bigjimmpls]

I have comcast and I get all the HD channels that are broadcast. I dont get the encrypted ones but with the package I have I get free hbo and I record from that all the time. It just works great for me. I pay for a mid level digital channel package. When you get all the stuff it gets kind of spendy. I went with there triple play and have to say I have been extremely happy with comcast. When I bought the ATI digital cable tuner I thought it was a dual tuner but I soon realized that it was only a single tuner. But they put in a multimedia stream card anyway. Without the card you can still get all channels 2-99 and all the qam channels. I have never tried the pay per view as there is really nothing I want to watch.

[robjv1]

As much as I don't like it, I have to credit the cable companies. They were never trying to make a device to replace the DVD recorder, instead they focused on making a device that would replace the VCR. Time shifting on a DVR is the answer to everyone's (except the archivest) dreams and now there is nothing to step in and compete with it. Without competition, they've eliminated the third-party market and now they are working on getting all the laws in their favor to prevent someone from ever developing a device that can empower the consumer the way the VCR did.

It's not a huge loss for me, there is hardly anything worth watching on TV, although I'm going to be mad when I do want to record something and there is not even a cable box in the country with composite / S-Video outputs on it.

[jagabo]

I believe the firm cutoff date stated in regulation is in the next year or two. 2011 or 2012.

That's only for ATSC protected media -- Blu-ray players. There's no requirement for cable and satellite companies to do this. The ATSC deadline for analog HD is the end of this year (I suspect it may be delayed). In 2013 all analog outputs, even SD, will be removed from Blu-ray players.

You can cap IEEE-1394 broadcast channels 100%.

Maybe for you! Even though it's a legal requirement it's still not available in many places. Does the law specify that HD be provided over IEEE 1394? Or just "local broadcast"?

Basically, you need a Mux HD or HD Fury. Until their keys are revoked.

[usually_quiet]

I forgot to mention, at present CableCARD tuners can't do on-demand. That requires 2-way communication and current CableCARDS don't support it. I think SiliconDust is going to support a module that will allow their product to work with switched digital video, but I'm not sure when it will come out, or whether the module also supports on-demand.

[usually_quiet]

I believe the firm cutoff date stated in regulation is in the next year or two. 2011 or 2012.

That's only for ATSC protected media -- Blu-ray players. There's no requirement for cable and satellite companies to do this. The ATSC deadline for analog HD is the end of this year (I suspect it may be delayed). In 2013 all analog outputs, even SD, will be removed from Blu-ray players.

You can cap IEEE-1394 broadcast channels 100%.

Maybe for you! Even though it's a legal requirement it's still not available in many places. Does the law specify that HD be provided over IEEE 1394? Or just "local broadcast"?

Basically, you need a Mux HD or HD Fury. Until their keys are revoked.

I think you are suffering from acronym overload. AACS is Blu-Ray copy protection. ATSC is the N. American digital OTA broadcast standard.

[edDV]

You can cap IEEE-1394 broadcast channels 100%.

Maybe for you! Even though it's a legal requirement it's still not available in many places. Does the law specify that HD be provided over IEEE 1394? Or just "local broadcast"

Broadcast channels as I said. But it gets more complicated.

There is a national cable agreement to offer all PBS SD and HD channels over clearQAM and by extension IEEE-1394. The primary channel must also be carried analog

"Must carry" stations must be offered over analog, clearQAM and IEEE-1394 unless the station objects.

"Renegotiation consent" stations are up for a contract negotiation in every detail. These include the majors (ABC/CBS/CW/Fox/My/NBC)

Beyond that, I think CSPAN has an agreement that at least Ch1 and Ch2 are offered on analog, clearQAM and IEEE-1394.

Above that, the cable company decides locally. Fortunately most HD cable stations are available on IEEE-1394 here .