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I've been using a SA3250HD cbale box for several years, there are two 1394 ports on the back, which I thought were inactive
One day I hooked up the 1394 port to my XP laptop, the computer recognized the device and asked for drivers from a cd
Is it possible to record cable TV into a computer using this port ? Anyone have any experience with this ?
I remember reading years ago about D-VHS machines being able to record from the cable box, and early HDTV's that only
had 1394 inputs..... I'd love to be able to record HDTV stations straight from the cable box onto the computer, anyone know
if this is possible, and what software/hardware is required ?
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CapDVHS, VLC, GraphStudio, GraphEdit.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=593271
I have a link to a better site on another computer. I'll post it later. -
Thanks ! hate to be a pain, but there are actually more things I need to know about this..... once recorded, is playback
only possible using VLC media player, or can other software be used ? I have experimented with an ATI 650HD USB tuner
to capture Over The Air digital transmissions, playing back using a desktop computer's DVI port connected to my plasma TV, the pic is great. I can also use Power DVD 9 to playback the recorded HD files.
So I'd like to accomplish the same task, if possible, using the cable box 1394 port, to record and playback full HD resolution,
but from digital cable stations. Rather than paying the cableco and extra 10 spot a month to rent their HD DVR....... -
I have an SA Explorer 8240HDC DVR. I can only successfully capture via firewire when playing recorded video (Mpeg transport stream, .TS file), not live TV. There is data coming over the wire while watching live TV but it just looks like junk (encrypted?). I haven't found anything that can play it at all. The TS files captured from recorded shows play with any player that can handle MPEG 2 transport streams. I can capture SD video perfectly. HD video results in corrupted frames every 10 seconds or so.
Here's the other link I promised: http://home.comcast.net/~exdeus/stbfirewire/ -
Thank you so much for this extremely useful information ! I downloaded the drivers, WinXP installed them, but CapDVHS
doesn't work..... no info is shown as to the transport stream, when I hit the 'record' button, and error message closes
the program. It appears as though it's recording something for a few seconds, then stops. I even tried letting CapDVHS
keep recording without clicking on the error message, a file was on the C: drive that indicated a 568kb video file, but
Windows Media Player doesn't recognize it. Then I tried letting CapDVHS run for about 10 minutes while the error message
was showing, again the same thing, just a small file that was not playable. Before I gave up completely, I even tried
Windows Movie Maker, again an error message.....
Well, at least I gave it a shot, many thanks to you, Jagabo for your help -
I remember having similar problems with CapDVHS. I gave up on it and used VLC and GraphEdit or GraphStudio instead. Use VLC to verify you are getting a valid stream of data. Just open the tuner device (not the panel device) and see if you can view what's coming from the cable box. If you can, construct a simple graph in GraphEdit (tuner device -> dump) to save the data as a TS file.
Also, the capture device crashes and locks up any time an attempted capture goes wrong. To reset the device unplug the firewire cable, wait til you hear Windows make the disconnect sound, plug the cable back in, wait for Windows to make the connect sound, then try viewing or capturing again.
Be sure to start out with a standard definition channel until you get a procedure that works -- it's much easier on the computer. Then you can attempt an HD cap. -
OK, it seems like I really don't know what the hell I'm doing..... and don't understand all the terminology
I'm using my HP laptop, which doesn't have any tuner or capture device except for a webcam
I tried following your instructions, downloaded VLC and Graph Edit, it doesn't seem to make any difference
In Device Manager, the 3250 is listed twice as shown in the diagrams along with two unknown 1394 devices
When I plug the cable into the computer from the STB, a dialog box pops up asking which program I want to use,
giving a choice of Windows Media Player, Windows Movie Maker, and other software programs, none of them work
It could be the fact that it's just a cable box and not a DVR, maybe there is no stream from the firewire port, or
maybe copyright and content protection or encryption has something to do with it .....
CapDHVS doesn't show anything in the data info screen..... tried this again using the second 1394 port of the STB,
this time it didn't crash, so I tried recording 5 minutes of (whatever). The result was a 128MB .mpg file, which
won't play using VLC media player, or the standard Windows Media Player, or anything else
I didn't read the entire AVS forum thread yet, it's 178 pages long !
In any case, if I have any success with this eventually, I'll post it, once again thanking you for your intensive help -
On my computer the the SA8240 shows up as two devices. I forget the exact terminology (I'm at a different computer right now) but it's something like "Scientific Atlanta 8240 Tuner Device" and "Scientific Atlanta 8240 Panel Device". I have to choose the Tuner Device as the source.
In VLC select Media -> Open Capture Device. Make sure the Capture Mode is set to DirectShow. In the Video Device Name field use the pulldown to select the Tuner device (or whatever your SA3250 shows up as). Then press the Play button in the lower right. You should see the video playing. Note: VLC crashes if I press the Configure button next to Video Device Name.
In GraphEdit select Graph -> Insert Filters. I believe the SA box shows up in the WDM Streaming Capture Devices list. Add the SA device to the graph by highlighting it and pressing Insert Filter. The capture filter should now be visible in the main window. On the right side of the filter box there should be a pin labeled Output (or similar). Right click on the pin and select Render. That should add and connect a bunch more filters to display the video and play the audio. Press the Play button in the controls near the top of the window. Does it play the audio/video?
To capture rather than play, insert the Capture filter and the Dump filter* (the latter is found in the DirectShow section and will ask for a filename for the output file -- use filename.TS). Back in the main window drag and drop from output pin of the Capture filter to the input pin of the Dump filter. Now when you press the Play button whatever is coming over the firewire port is saved to the selected output file. Press the Stop button to finish your capture. Try playing the TS file with a media player (VLC, MPCHC) or examine it with MediaInfo. Anything useful? If I capture live video from the cable box I get a file full of junk. Its size looks about right but nothing will play it, MediaInfo gives no information. But if I capture while playing back something recorded by the DVR the file plays properly.
* You may have to register the DUMP.AX filter that came with GraphEdit before it will show up. Look for a REGISTER.BAT in the GraphEdit folder and double click on it. If there's no BAT file you'll have to do it manually. Open a Command Prompt, navigate to the GraphEdit folder and type "regsvr32 dump.ax /s". -
In the thread from avsforums they mention having better luck with TSReader than CapDVHS for recording. I remember trying all the tricks that were suggested in that thread several years ago with various combinations of things and ended up abandoning the effort. It seems that people using Mac computers were the only ones getting consistent and acceptable results.
I have found other ways to record the output of the Scientific Atlanta devices. I used a PYRO A/V Link for acceptable results for 480i but nothing higher resolution but still using component outputs. Then I used a HAVA Monsoon (similar to slingbox) that works very well for anything coming out of the box (on the component leads) and can be recorded at near DVD quality. Presently using an Hauppauge HD PVR which can capture in HD also. Hauppauge HD PVR is the best solution IMHO for now. -
joecass - Sorry to read about your problems. I have a Motorola cable box from my cable company and I've been using CapDVHS for years to record unencrypted HD TV shows (not HBO, etc. but stuff like Fox, NBC, etc.) to my PC. I've had to tweak the default CapDVHS settings a little, but it's worked exceptionally well for me.
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Jagabo - you deserve a nice Big Breakfast or Double Whopper with Cheese for all the helpful info....... thanks so much !
VLC media player did crash, as did the XP laptop..... but there was some kind of broken up video picture
I tried CapDVHS one more time..... changing the settings without knowing what I was doing, it finally showed data info:
544X480
Aspect ratio 4 X 3
29.97 fps
video bitrate = 15 mbps
audio bitrate = 28,120kbps
I hit 'record' and captured 5 minutes of CBS std def video..... and played it back with VLC media player....... voila !
BUT - and I deserve my butt kicked for saying this..... my goal is to capture HD Video, not 544X480
I have a slew of DVD recorders with QAM tuners, that all give an excellent pic ( converting HD stations to std 480i )
Previously I thought of buying a used JVC Digital VHS machine for this experiment, however they seem to be unstable
and unreliable, and secondly, only record a few hours max of HD video onto hard-to-find D-VHS tapes
I do use an LG LST 3410A HD hard drive machine, for recording OTA HD stations, but it also is very unreliable
I'm considering picking up one of those Dish Network DTV PAL DVR's, problem is an unstable OTA signal in my area,
even with a roof antenna, and the fact that many people report numerous problems with this device
The next logical step was to try computer recording, which does work with the aforementioned ATI HD650USB tuner, but
again, the recorded pic is choppy due to the inadequate OTA reception signal
I'll keep experimenting with the cable box1394 method, if it works for HD recording, I'll be very happy
Thanks guys for your suggestions and comments, much appreciated -
You were tuned to an HD channel but the firewire output was SD? Or were you just using an SD channel for testing and HD still doesn't work?Originally Posted by joecass
You could resort to using a Hauppauge HD PVR to record from the STB's component output. I use that and picture quality is pretty good. Unfortunately, the STB probably won't output HDMI and component at the same time. I have to disconnect the HDMI cable from the TV to record.
If you want pristine digital recordings from the HDMI port you can use a BlackMagic Intensity card. You'll also need a Mux HD to remove the HDCP enryption. And a high end computer to handle incoming digital HD stream. A pretty expensive solution. And probably illegal in the USA. -
The only way this would happen is if you tuned the SD version of the channel. The high def CBS channel would showOriginally Posted by joecass
1920x1080i
Aspect ratio 16 x 9
29.97 fps
The bit rates shown are not real. VLC media info will show the actual bit rate after you capture the file. Local average bit rates here are ~3 Mb/s for SD and ~18 Mb/s for CBS. The CBS station here doesn't broadcast a second channel, only data.Recommends: Kiva.org - Loans that change lives.
http://www.kiva.org/about -
You could resort to using a Hauppauge HD PVR to record from the STB's component output. I use that and picture quality is pretty good. Unfortunately, the STB probably won't output HDMI and component at the same time. I have to disconnect the HDMI cable from the TV to record.
If you want pristine digital recordings from the HDMI port you can use a BlackMagic Intensity card. You'll also need a Mux HD to remove the HDCP enryption. And a high end computer to handle incoming digital HD stream. A pretty expensive solution. And probably illegal in the USA.[/QUOTE]
I only used CBS std def to test, since it was the first time it worked..... I'll try CBS HD another time
Since I've already invested in the ATI 650 card, buying the Hauppage seems redundant, even if it gives a better pic
The SA3250HD is an older model with a DVI port, and I don't use it to watch HDTV. I mainly record programs from the
cable line QAM re-broadcasts of CBS, NBC, FOX, etc HD channels. Never watch TV in real time becuz I hate commercials.
If I get the firewire method working correctly for HD, then I'll be able to record other stations like USA, TNT, A&E, etc.
The BlackMagic Intensity card & a high end computer is not within my budget right now, maybe someday....
The cable QAM HD picture is the same quality as the DVI output of the SA3250HD, the OTA HD I record into my LG 3410a
is also about as good as it gets for me..... recording OTA HD into my desktop using the ATI card also gives an excellent
pic, it's just that the computer is old and outdated, so it has trouble keeping up with the high bit rates -
Getting this firewire capture is difficult at best..... I have to keep playing with VLC and CapDVHS, opening and closing these programs, plugging and unplugging the 1394 cable, playing with the settings, booting & re-booting the laptop. Today I finally got VLC to display a std def picture, but couldn't get CapDVHS to record.
While I had CBS std def playing on VLC, I tried tuning the cable box to CBS HD, I got a picture, but it was all
pixellated, and wouldn't remain steady enough to play
Methinks maybe the laptop hardware is insufficient to handle HD video, or the cable box input signal is too weak,
as sometimes std and hd channels pixellate or freeze for no reason
The laptop is running Windows XP MCE Service Pack 3
Microprocessor1.6 GHz AMD Turion™ 64 X2 Dual-Core Mobile Technology TL-50Microprocessor Cache2 X 256KB L2 CacheMemory1024MB DDR2 System Memory (2 Dimm)Memory Max2048MB Video GraphicsNVIDIA GeForce Go 6150 (UMA)Video Memoryup to 128MB (shared)Hard Drive100GB 5400RPM SATA -
This is where GraphEdit comes in. It can capture the MPEG2 data from the firewire port and write to a file on the hard drive without displaying the video. That requires minimal CPU/graphics power.Originally Posted by joecass
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CapDVHS does the same. It records the IEEE-1394 stream and uses near zero resource doing this. You can't display with CapDVHS.Originally Posted by jagabo
This is where GraphEdit comes in. It can capture the MPEG2 data from the firewire port and write to a file on the hard drive without displaying the video. That requires minimal CPU/graphics power.Originally Posted by joecass
Display of the MPeg2 playback file on a 1.6 GHz AMD Turion™ 64 X2 Dual-Core with NVIDIA GeForce Go 6150 should work for SD and 720p but may choke on 1080i.
Realtime display while capturing is going to be a challenge for HD. The NVida chip muct take the load off the CPU.Recommends: Kiva.org - Loans that change lives.
http://www.kiva.org/about -
Use CapDVHS alone. Don't try to display while capturing. VLC is trying to decode in software and isn't keeping up.Originally Posted by joecass
The cable company is required to provide an IEEE-1394 signal for the broadcast stations. If you are seeing these stations on your TV, the IEEE-1394 signal should be good quality. The cable company has the option of providing IEEE-1394 on the other channels. I get quite a few but sometimes live sports or other programs get blocked. I usually dual record with MCE or off analog just in case a particular show is blocked on IEEE-1394.Recommends: Kiva.org - Loans that change lives.
http://www.kiva.org/about -
Yes, I had forgotten about that. Probably because I could never get it to work reliably and gave up on it.Originally Posted by edDV
CapDVHS does the same.Originally Posted by jagabo
720p60 and 1080i30 require about the same amount of CPU power to decode. I would expect a dual core Turion to be able to handle both. But this will also be dependent on the graphics card. Integrated graphics controllers hog up memory cycles, often don't support video overlay, and often don't have good bandwidth to the video memory.Originally Posted by edDV
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Recommends: Kiva.org - Loans that change lives.
http://www.kiva.org/about -
Tried experimenting with a desktop computer rather than the laptop...... basically same results
CapDVHS works fine if the cable box is tuned to standard broadcast 480i channels like CBS, NBC, FOX
As soon as I tried tuning to a cable channel like TNT or USA, an error occurs..... and I'm getting exactly
the same result using VLC player..... it will show std channels 2 to 13, or any other channel broadcast
in analog by Time Warner Cable ( in NYC ), but will not display most other "paid by subscription" cable
channels. On my cable line, Time Warner still broadcasts analog cable, along with digital and QAM.
I suspect there's some type of broadcast "flag" preventing recording.....
I did manage to record a few minutes of CBS HD, but the picture quality coming thru the 1394 port
in no way compares to any other method I have of recording HD. It's washed out, not as clear,
and lacks in brightness and color depth...... very disappointing, to say the least -
Now, if you know a friend with a mac, give it a try. Like I said earlier, I gave up on it because very few were successful, and I was not.
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The cable company is only required to provide unblocked IEEE-1394 for the broadcast channels. Beyond that, they can decide which are offered on a local basis. Here it varies periodically but many cable HD channels are passed.Originally Posted by joecass
As I said above, my small laptop had no difficulty playing the captured file up to 1080i 17 Mb/s for lighter deinterlace modes.Recommends: Kiva.org - Loans that change lives.
http://www.kiva.org/about -
Not sure that this is of any help, but in returning to this thread the thought occurred to me that there is one channel I had so many problems with trying to record that I just gave up. It was CBS in HD. There weren't any copy flag issues, but the shows I got seemed to have all kinds of garbage in them like weird frame rates, etc. I could record and watch the shows on my PC without any issue, but it was just impossible for me to re-record them to a lower bit rate. It's been so many months since I tried that I don't remember the error, but I remember HCenc just crashing every time I tried to encode a CBS HD capture. I've never had this issue with any other HD 1080i channel. I record NBC in 1080i all the time and I can easily re-encode those to lower bit rates if I wish.
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