HERE's HOW TO FIT 120mins movie on one cd in SVCD FORMAT!!!!

[videoguy79]

oh, one more thing. . .

If you have an mpeg file that Windows shows as being less than 800MB but blows up in size when you try to burn it to a CD, you need to make sure that you are choosing the correct pack/stream settings in TMPGenc. For VCD, if you try to do a non-compliant (like 700kbps) encode with the setting as "Mpeg 1 VCD", the resulting file will look small. . . .but Nero or any other burning program will blow up the file size due to all the padding that is put in to make the packets the right size, and it will be too big for the CD. If you choose "mpeg-1 non-complaint VCD", the padding is not added and this solves the problem. I don't know about SVCD, though, since I usually up the bitrate on those rather than lower it. Hope this helps!

[scissors]

can i refer everyone to the subject line.

the original poster put forward his method for getting 120 mins on svcd.

he was ridiculed.

I posted saying i agreed with him.

I never claimed to be an expert.

I never said the quality was DVD. (nothing can be DVD because the bit rate is so high)

A moderator DID say the quality would be less than VCD.

I've posted an example.

It's better than VCD and VHS.

It's compliant.

It will do 106 Mins.

Changing the settings only slightly would get you your 120 mins.

you can all bleat on about quality bit rates blah blah.

the file is there.

I thank you. Good night

[y2flyy]

alot of love to ya scissors
ppl are drifting off from the subject and not understanding that i didnot say it would be dvd quality.
I do not need to watch a movie in dvd quality
im more than happy with svcd quality
b/c is alot better than vcd and vhs so its there for me
i wish ppl would stop with the quality issues
again i did not say that this would produce the best video output of alltime
im just stated that it looks exactly as good as svcd standard
and you can fit it on one cd
i know ive been doing vcd and svcd for well over a year and when i started i could not even put a vcd of that length on one cd
and to be able to do it in svcd quality is a very big progress for me
and alot of other newbies and other ppl
cmon now i have never even thought of being able to play svcd from one cd
like i said im no expert but it was always a fact that svcds required 2 or more cds
and now heres a way to put it on ONE cd with very same quality
whats the problem with that??

[bbb]

Cramming more video with less bitrate is not new. People who make vcds/svcds know this already for years. There is nothing to brag about cramming video onto cdrs.

In fact, what happens when you reduce the already insufficient standard bitrate for vcds/svcds is: video detail is drops and motion artifacts multiply.

It is common knowledge by videofiles that VCDs are usually unacceptable quality (mainly due to the amount of blocks in fast motion scenes). By lowering bitrates to half a VCD bitrate, the end result is LESS than unacceptable quality (the constant appearance of large, glaring blocks even in moderate motion scenes).

Hence, XSVCDs were created which allowed vcd makers to up the bitrate to get rid of blocks. Try a VCD at 500 bitrate vs at 1500 bitrate, I guarantee the 1500 will look far more acceptable. Unless of course you are encoding elderly snail races. :P

[scissors]

It is common knowledge by videofiles that VCDs are usually unacceptable quality (mainly due to the amount of blocks in fast motion scenes). By lowering bitrates to half a VCD bitrate, the end result is LESS than unacceptable quality (the constant appearance of large, glaring blocks even in moderate motion scenes).

I think this really will be my last post on this subject.

Did you download the 30 second mpeg? didn't think so otherwise your post wouldn't be here saying what it says.

For the record.

The method is VBR, so when it's required the bit rate will rise to 2200, ie during motion.

you could always use tmpeg's reduce block moise option also.

EVERYONE seems to have missed the points that

a) The file is done at 23fps 3:2 pulldown this saves approx 43200 over 120 mins, that a big chunk.

b) the actual image is bordered (letterbox) and is only 432x320. Saving even more space, and all those Bps get used on basically 2/3 of the full 480x480 image, producing a better result.

c) It's 16:9 not full screen so it can be viewed on 16:9 zoom on a widescreen TV

d) i tried to access the file earlier but tripod said the bandwidth had been exceeded. That's a few downloads. But no-one sent a message saying it's worse than VCD.

e) no one ever claimed any new ideas. I just defended a guy who sussed a similar method to one i've been using.

f) Hey, I'm the one with whole films on one disc, that look pretty damn good on my TV. I've no more to prove. Carry on with 2 disc vcd.

[scissors]

a) The file is done at 23fps 3:2 pulldown this saves approx 43200 FRAMES over 120 mins, that a big chunk.

[sean madison]

LEts' get ready to rumblllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllleeeeeeeeeeee eeeeeeeeeeeeee!

I am the guy with the movies on 1 cd.

I'm not to say i was first but i am pretty damn good at it.

People know this too and scissors, it seems that u use vbr also.

I tell u what. Since we both use vbr, when i get my new pc, lets have a battle off vs our quality!

U game? in 2 months, lets encode ot the finish!

Use our temps.

The rules may change from now but this is what i always look at-

Take the same clip, encode it.

What we are looking for- better quality and smaller file size!

Whoever has the better quality wins, BUT, there is also a max file size limit too, whereas u cant just use 5000 vbr and win.

So how bout it, anybody can join. Just give me 2 months.
This will be fun

[buttmuncher]

I've been reading the forum on this subject and I had to post something...
This is just to confirm that 120 mins is no problem in svcd format on an 80 min disc. I have recently ripped clint eastwood "for a few dollars more" which runs for 126 mins thats 2 hours and six minutes and takes up 709 megs folks, YES 709 MEGS.. And it's near dvd quality.... ( WHICH DUMMY SAID IT WAS WORSE THAN VCD? ) That works out to about 71 mins! Now I don't know if anyone has bothered to look but ripped if from dvd, svcd is very near dvd quality. NOT LIKE VCD which is just ok ! So why don't you people out there who doubt this FACT that 120 mins and good quality can be put onto an 80 minute disc try it! It craps on vcd quality. I wouldn't do anything else now . If you want almost dvd quality on one disc then svcd is the way forward.. Don't forget you only get near dvd quality when you have dvd quality as the source. REMEMBER you can't make a silk purse out of a pigs ear.... thankyou for listening......

[nicksteel]

Using the template on page 1 of the thread, what settings should I use with NERO?

I'm starting with a 23.9760 MPEG4 V3 640x272 downloaded AVI.

The older copy of windows media encoder with the vidtoasf command line converter can't open the avi file. I am using virtualdub to encode as MPEG4 low motion. Am I following the correct steps?

[y2flyy]

no nicksteel dont worry about that vidtoasf command prompt thingy
just use the regular directions that vcdhelp gives and itll make an asf file
ppl are still not getting that the main thing I was saying that I encoded an
asf with the same settings that i would have an avi
I DID not drop quality or bitrate or res or anything else
the asf source file just made a way smaller outfile file
and it looks exactly the same on my dvd player
Y2Flyy

[speedy726]

what program do u use to convert avi to asf? can u give me a link that works?

[y2flyy]

here ya go speedy
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/en/download/default.asp
i accept that contest sean
i think its a great idea
let's do it
Y2Flyy

[y2flyy]

no speedy sorry man dont get that one thats the new and its alot harder
email me and ill send it to you
i forgot where i got the older one from
b/c is hard to find

[vitualis]

LOL...

For people complaining that people aren't reading their posts properly, you sure need to extend the same curtesy to others.

1. Putting 120 min on a SVCD (80min disc) is trivial. It is EASY.
2. To do so requires that the average bitrate be approx. 800 kbit/s
3. It is common knowledge that to get good video quality at this average bitrate CONSISTENTLY is impossible.

Now, before you raise your hand and say "I've done it!", can you say that your "template" looks good (i.e., at least better than VCD) consistently for every type of movie?

What about hard to encode scenes? (e.g., opening to Mummy Returns or lobby scene of The Matrix).
What about fast animations (e.g., anime)?

For your "template" to have any meaning, you will need to provide a sample of a difficult to encode clip of video.

Furthermore, some movies are much easier to encode than others so it may well be possible to have a good looking 2 hour SVCD on one disc. That's great for you but you haven't described anything new. The issue is can you do it consistently?

Regards.

[SiCN]

Oh, same story again. Well, I also fit 120 minutes on one disc. Question is if I like the quality of the output... But if you guys are so "into" getting one movie on one disc. Why not try it with a VCD (352x240, 1150kbps video, 128kb audio) and burn the whole thing on a 99 minute CD-R You'll get a good 110 minutes on it (CBR) and it looks just like a normal Video CD.

[scissors]

[quote="vitualis"]
LOL...

For people complaining that people aren't reading their posts properly, you sure need to extend the same curtesy to others.

1. Putting 120 min on a SVCD (80min disc) is trivial. It is EASY.
2. To do so requires that the average bitrate be approx. 800 kbit/s
3. It is common knowledge that to get good video quality at this average bitrate CONSISTENTLY is impossible.

You're quite a fool aren't you.
You never bothered to download the file.
You've consistantly changed your arguments, from is isn't possible, to it's easy but not at the quality i'd like.

you hate it that it's been done.

who cares what the bit rate averages at. The Point of VBR is that you don't waste 2000kbps on something simple such a a black screen end credit, but during high motion you can go up to 2000Kbps.

I also said i used CQ between 40 and 50+ depending on the film. Which is why you do a one minute test, to adjust the settings.

How consistant do you want. How above everyone of the last 10 films i've tried worked.

weren't you the one who said the mpeg would be worse than VCD?????

did you even bother to download load it - that's a retorical question.


For your "template" to have any meaning, you will need to provide a sample of a difficult to encode clip of video.

you really are a knob.

(go on, lock the thread, throw me off vcdhelp, i'm scared)

why don't YOU, yes YOU, oh mr it can't be don't get off your sad i'm a moderator arse, and try the template on one of you difficult scences.

It'll only take 15 mins MAX.

It'll save me the 40 minute upload which was obvioulsy wasted.

No? of course not.

hwy don't you bleat on about bit rate averages, who gives a flying **** as long as the end result is better than VCD and fits on one disc.

if you want such good quality buy the ******* DVD.


Furthermore, some movies are much easier to encode than others so it may well be possible to have a good looking 2 hour SVCD on one disc.

That is almost admitting it, go on yer big baby. I'll buy you some nice crisps...

That's great for you but you haven't described anything new.

Did i ever claim it was new - twat.

The issue is can you do it consistently?

adjust as required!! The least you drop to is CQ 40, it still looks good.

moderator my arse.

I'm pissed with myself now, cus you'll get to go "look everyone, i've won, blah blah, he resorted to abuse".

To shizzon - Just NO. I only backed the flly bloke up. If you win you school yard competition, great, post the improved template. I'm not out for medals, i just thought like the original poster it would be good for all to have a go. But the babies hate to think there are people quietly out there doing it.

I offered an mpeg and no one was decent enough to say, yes i downloaded it and it looks like your right.

[rbruner2]

I understand the theory behind why what y2flyy is trying to do should work. In a sense, it is using the advantage of the asf format already taking care of getting rid of all the extra information that isn't necessary for the human eye. Then, when the asf is converted to MPEG, there is less the encoder needs to worry about encoding, so it does a better job.

Anyhow, I haven't tried it yet...but I plan to. One question I have for y2flyy is...have you tried this for a regular VCD? I have a videotape that I captured to an AVI. I don't need the quality of the SVCD because it is already pretty poor quality coming from VHS. Anyhow, I want to convert this to VCD...does your conversion to asf first trick work well for conversion to VCD as well? It might be a good way to convert the VHS tapes I need to do.

I have another question. When you said that you didn't change bit rate or resolution or anything for the asf file...what does that mean exactly? I have a DV-encded avi file (I captured the video through my digital camcorder). How do you determine the bit rate of the avi file? I've never seen a bit rate anywhere.

Thanks.

[bilbogod]

He eh eh hehe .....
Awww... I guess the temperature is starting to rise a little bit in here
U know folks that the topics regarding 1 cd encodes must have had over 20,000 + views in the last three weeks. That is going some !!
There is an interesting point being hit on time and again. Basically how much useless information does an mpeg hold ??? If similarly to an mp3

[bilbogod]

inaudible info is disgarded, then this should surely equate to smaller file sizes at negligible perceptive difference. The fact is that some people would scoff at the idea of converting a DivX into an Mpeg. I decided to try this (different thread using Cyberimage26's template) and was surprised at the results. The most difficult task was producing an excellent looking DivX to try it out on. "Fairuse" an excellent piece of freeware that a child of three could navigate around came to the rescue. Anyway the movie was Platoon and the rest is history. Result was excellent reproduction (yes this includes all the fast action scenes and explosions) and could be tailored to my individual space requirements. Hell, such was the available remaining space that I put the audio bitrate back up to 224. This was a hr 54 min movie with space to spare. Would I do this again ???? Probably not since it took a bloody long time to do Still I look forward to trying out all the other methods. Long live EP - VCD

[y2flyy]

VIRTUAL what in the HECK dont you understand that
I DIDNOT DECREASE ANY SETTINGS!!!!
I DO NOT CLAIM TO HAVE MY OWN TEmplate!!! that works for everyone
i said use the one I use or any tmpenc svcd template
I TOLD YOU THAT THE BITRATE AND QUALITY WAS THAT OF AN SVCD
WHAT DONT YOU UNDERSTAND ABOUT THAT
PLEASE LET ME KNOW
ALL IM SAYING IS CONVERTING AN ASF INSTEAD OF AN AVI FILE WILL PRODUCE A WAY SMALLER OUTPUT FILE SIZE OF MPEG1 AND MPEG2
I DID NOT SAY I MADE SOMETHING UP MAGICALLY TO CLAIM THAT I CAN FIT SVCD ON ONE CD BY DROPPING QUALITY.
JUST TRY IT PLEASE
PPL WHO HAVE SAYS THAT THE WILL NOT GO BACK TO VCD!!!!!
I must have help someone with this b/c i've had over 300 emails saying
THANK YOU
JUST TRY IT VIRTUAL
please do not lock this thread it is helping to many people
and aren't you here to help!!!???
so why dont you help by trying it and giving feedback and pointers
instead of arguing something that I never claim to have done
Y2Flyy

[kwag]

An couple of mpeg tests ( with template attached ).

One is 28 seconds from Lethal Weapon 4 ( high speed scene, water, fire, etc ).

The other is 30 seconds from Pixar's clip Geris' game.

View with PowerDVD, WinDVD, or burn as non-standard VCD ( NOT SVCD ).

Modified GOP structure 1,20,3,1 which gives best compression with maximum stability. Larger values create smaller mpegs, but you loose image stability.

No more comments. You be the judge

http://briefcase.yahoo.com/mpeg_test

Files are under "My Documents"

Enjoy!.

[y2flyy]

THANKS ALOT SCISSORS KEEP BACKING US UP BUD
and to answer your question rbruner yes you can use it for vcd also
and when i said that i did not change anything
im meaning during the conversion to mpeg2 alot of ppl lower the bitrate and other things to get a lesser file size but lower quality
but i did not touch the settings i left them at svcd standard
high bitrate,etc.....
and to determine the bitrate of an avi file (you'll need that to convert to asf) open it in a divx player
i use bsplayer and radlight
once open goto video properties or video info
and it'll have the bitrate and res of the avi file in KPs
Y2Flyy

[y2flyy]

KWAG i dont undertsand whos side you are on
are you saying that it doesnt keep the quality
did you convert to mpeg2 using an asf file??
Y2Flyy

[kwag]

Hi y2flyy:

I'm on nobody's side!.

Just sharing some data for the benefit of everyone.

kwag

[sean madison]

I am only gonna say this once for Virtualis and I, and we are tired of dumb ass MuthaFaCKo'Z who claim, i did it!!!

Did what? encode? congrats! everybody encodes

Or, i got 120 minutes onto a cd! oh wow?!?! You can put over 3 hrs of video on a cd but it will look like shit.

But then again, u say u got 2 hrs with great quality?

But when virtualis gives u tips to do to encode at difficult parts to prove ur theory or template, u refuse,
AND WE ALL KNOW WHY!!

Cuz u a little kid who just started encodin like last week and u just learned how to create a 2 hr movie onto 1 cd and keepin high quality isnt ur style.

I'm sorry, but i strive for high quality, i dont encode to 1 cd unless I test it before i do it.

Grow up people.

This is VCDHelp, the place where professionals help the newbies, not the newbies help the professionals.

We know how to put video on a cd, so u dont have to tell us.

Also, we know how to put 2 hr onto a cd in the same and I BET I can even do it in better quality than you cuz i been workin on this for bout 2 months with a different type of encoding u usin.

Ending words-
Hope virtualis locks the thread, hope scissors and y2flyy start doin more research bout how stupid they sound, and get the FiZZZuCK out dis BioTcH

[bilbogod]

Anyone recommend a free storage account thats good??? I wouldn't mind uploading a couple of clips which IMHO look decidedly better than a couple of others that I've seen and have smaller file sizes.

[liquid217]

i think what y2flyy is missing is that tmpgenc will automatically adjust the bitrate for whatever the source is. in other words, if all you have is a green screen, tmpgenc will drop the bitrate down. In the professional world of video editing, asf is known as the "end result" of encoding, usually to get the media published on the net. it was never meant for reencoding. Y2flyy, what you are experiencing is the transcoding effect from asf to mpeg. asf has allready lost most of the important data so when tmpgenc attempts to reencode this, the result is a lowered bitrate. If you are satisfied with the quality, then ok....more power to you. I myself used to try to put as much video onto a cd as possible. i personally try to get the highest quality i can with any type of encoding that i do. unfortunantly, this can really only be achieved with some type of dv system. either with a dv camera, or a dvd-r system.

[Mirror_Image]

You know, a lot of the flaming back and forth in these "How to fit xxx on to xxx in xxx format using tmpgenc" threads might be avoided if the poster would just include the relevant template right away, not a dozen or so posts later.

Open the *.mcf file in a text editor, copy and paste. Avoid the endless back and forth exchanges of this sort:

"You can not!"

"Oh yes I can!"

"No you can't!"

"E-mail me; I'll send you the template and you can see I'm not lying!"

Unless you want a flame war - in that case, be very, very vague...

[y2flyy]

OK i damn near about to give up on yall
sean what the hell are you talking about
you still have not mentioned that you already came up with encoding asf
to mpeg2 instead of avi
i dont care what you so called experts say
its produces a smaller file size
and i ve been doing this for a long time and know more than just the basics
so why dont you stop talking and try it
are you scared??
so many people have said that it works and it is great quality
why dont you do it
nobody says i was trying to help no professional
what makes you a professional
i bet you that your svcd will not look any better than my svcd on ONE cd from an asf file source
WHY are so many ppl saying that it works with great quality if it doesnt
the only one thats sounds stupid is you sean (who got ran off the boards
a few months ago huh??)
I FOUND OUT THAT CONVERTING AN ASF VIDEO FILE INSTEAD OF AN AVI VIDEO FILE TO MPEG2 SVCD WILL PRODUCE A SMALLER FILE SIZE
ENABLING YOU TO BURNON ONE CD!!!!! AND THE QUALITY LOOK EXACTLY THE SAME PLAYBACK ON YOUR TV IN SVCD QUALITY!!!!!!!!!!!
SEAN or VIRTUAL or ANYBODY PROVE Me WRONG ON THAT!!!!
PROVE it
i can forward over 350 emails saying that it worked from them
EVEN the infamous SEFY EMAILED ME and is giving me some pointers
and as far as I am and most people SEFY is a way bigger expert or "professional" than you sean
Y2Flyy

[scissors]

Oi Shiz fool

quote>LEts' get ready to rumblllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllleeeeeeeeeeee eeeeeeeeeeeeee!

I am the guy with the movies on 1 cd.

another quote >I am only gonna say this once for Virtualis and I,
and we are tired of dumb ass MuthaFaCKo'Z who claim, i did it!!!

hmmm only one person claiming I did it in here - fool.

quote > Or, i got 120 minutes onto a cd! oh wow?!?! You can put over 3 hrs of video on a cd but it will look like shit.

says who? The alternative is to reduce the size of the picture and increase the border size.
you'd end up with a smaller picture, but the quality would be retained.

quote>But when virtualis gives u tips to do to encode at difficult parts to prove ur theory or template, u refuse,
AND WE ALL KNOW WHY!!

the mpeg i uploaded, which you didn't bother with acutually pans INTO the picture at one point.
This means every bit of that picture is changing, requiring as possiblely more Bps than a bit of action.
It's panning that takes up lots of space as mpeg does work on the differences between I frames. Hence I suggested
playing with the GOP.

quote>Cuz u a little kid who just started encodin like last week and u just learned how to create a 2 hr movie onto 1 cd and keepin high quality isnt ur style.


yeah, nar nar nar nar nar.

quote.This is VCDHelp, the place where professionals help the newbies, not the newbies help the professionals.

We know how to put video on a cd, so u dont have to tell us.


so your professional. How much do you make?

quote>Also, we know how to put 2 hr onto a cd in the same and I BET I can even do it in better quality than you cuz i been workin on this for bout 2 months with a different type of encoding u usin

so now we get to it.

you see this as a competition. Out side of this forum and your bedroom you are nothing. You're not a fat lot in here.
It's not important. There there, never mind. It's only copying a dvd you know.
if we cared about Dvd quality, we'll buy the discs.

No-one ever said you weren't good, no one ever claimed to do anything better than you.

it's just put 120mins of svcd on one cdr, better quality than vcd.

read the line above again

and again

do you get it now?

This furum isn't MY life. I've spent way too much time on it this last couple of days.
gotta go, had a phone call from a mate, off down the pub. (That's a real mate and a real pub )