Does making a dvd player region free also allow PAL to display on NTSC?

[dizmack]

Hello everyone, great site!

My question has probably been answered a thousand times, but I'm having trouble finding the answer.

I live in the US and I can easily buy a dvd player that is "hackable" to become region free. This part I fully understand.

My question is this...If I hack my player to play some of the region 2 discs I have, how does that affect the fact that my tv is NTSC and region 2 discs are PAL. I have a Samsung LED tv model UN46B6000. If I hack my player and insert a region 2 disc, will that PAL formatted disc play on my NTSC tv? Sure the region on the player would be correct, but it's still a PAL disc on an NTSC tv, no?

Any help would be really appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
diz

[darkknight145]

in a word NO!
region is simply where in the world it can be played, nothing to do with the television standard used.

However, not sure about in the US, but most (if not all) DVD players in Australia are mutlistandard, they can either leave the standard as is or convert it to the standard you require either NTSC or Pal.
So check your DVD player specs to see what it can do.

[dizmack]

Thanks for the quick reply darkknight! So to clarify, there are two issues in dealing with this. The first is making sure a region 1 dvd player gets hacked to play region 2 discs, the second is finding a player that will, additionally convert the Pal standard to the ntsc standard, right?

[guns1inger]

Yep. You need to address both issues. If your TV is multi-system (i.e can display both PAL and NTSC) then the the player doesn't even have to convert the signal, but just display it natively.

[dizmack]

Thanks for the answers guys and gals! I appreciate it!

[usually_quiet]

Multi-standard TVs and DVD players are uncommon in the US. Those who want them need to look for a specialty retailer. The electronics department at an ordinary store won't have them.

[guns1inger]

Multi-standard TVs and DVD players are uncommon in the US. Those who want them need to look for a specialty retailer. The electronics department at an ordinary store won't have them.

I thought that had started to change over the last couple of years, especially with LCD/Plasma TVs. Over here you would have to go out of your way to find a non-multi-standard TV. In fact I suspect you would have to import one unless you scoured garage sales for something 15 years old or more.

[usually_quiet]

Multi-standard TVs and DVD players are uncommon in the US. Those who want them need to look for a specialty retailer. The electronics department at an ordinary store won't have them.

I thought that had started to change over the last couple of years, especially with LCD/Plasma TVs. Over here you would have to go out of your way to find a non-multi-standard TV. In fact I suspect you would have to import one unless you scoured garage sales for something 15 years old or more.

I think we are still pretty well locked into Region 1 and NTSC here. Only a small percentage of the population seeks out DVDs from other regions, so there is no appreciable consumer demand for changing the status quo, and a lot of pressure from the movie industry to leave things the way they are.

Googling "TV PAL and NTSC" turned up relatively few shopping hits, and the merchandise was supplied by a specialty retailer, although being classified as multi-system was apparently based on the tuner(s) only.

My own equimpent is five or more years old and NTSC only, but I have some PDF manuals stored on my computer's HDD to help relatives with problems they might have with purchases made within the past 2 years. I took a look at them.

Based on what the Philips DVP3962 manual says, it looks like it plays both PAL and NTSC discs. I guess that makes sense since Philips is also the brand for which region free hacks are most often available. So in the US, Philips would be the brand to try for multi-region use if buying a DVD player at an ordinary store, but I can't tell if it converts the output from PAL to NTSC. The manual only says this: "TV Type: Select the color system that matches the connected TV. It enables playback of a different type of disc (PAL or NTSC disc) on this unit."

The manual for the Samsung LN26A450C1D LCD TV from 2008 says nothing at all about the TV standards it supports.

[edDV]

First region hacks and decoding standards are separate issues as has been stated.

Concerning playback decode, there are three broad types of DVD players in the USA.

1. NTSC only playback. Most of the name brands fall into this category. The majors want the US market isolated to prevent export of US/Canadian players to the more heavily taxed PAL world. They also don't want Americans or Canadians importing PAL DVD discs. The industry wants to sell the NTSC version.
They do this for TV sets as well.

2. NTSC or PAL playback. In this case PAL plays as PAL and requires a PAL capable TV*. Many of the low end 'no name' Chinese players fall into this class. In this case the Chinese are shipping us a world model that differs little from those shipped to Europe or other PAL countries.

3. NTSC or PAL playback with PAL to NTSC conversion**. These models will play a PAL DVD to an NTSC TV. They usually don't advertise this capability. You need to look for feedback in review forums like this one to find these gems. https://www.videohelp.com/dvdplayers?DVDname=&Search=Search&dvdportable=&dvdchanger=&dv...Submit2=Search Be sure to select "Multi-system PAL/NTSC" then read the reviews to separate #2 and #3 types. Philips and Oppo are the most likely of the name brands to offer PAL to NTSC conversion. I have a JVC model that also does this.

* TV sets have two issues of compatibility. Separate from "PAL", the main TV spec is ability to play 625/50 video. Some HDTV sets will play 625 line 50 Hz video but lack a PAL decoder. In these cases, "PAL" analog component video will display color on the TV where encoded composite or S-Video will show only as monochrome.

** Name brand DVD players sold in PAL countries are mostly "Multi-System" in the sense that they play PAL and convert NTSC to PAL60 which is compatible with most PAL TV sets. This type of player is not compatible with most North American TV sets so don't get tempted by eBay.

[edDV]

Concerning #3 type players above there are two additional issues.

HDMI output may or may not work for PAL discs. This depends on how the manufacturer programmed the port. If they want to block digital PAL playback they can.

Separate but related to HDMI is upscaling. The player may or may not allow both PAL conversion and upscaling.

[jman98]

Multi-standard TVs and DVD players are uncommon in the US. Those who want them need to look for a specialty retailer. The electronics department at an ordinary store won't have them.

I thought that had started to change over the last couple of years, especially with LCD/Plasma TVs.

Depends on the brand. Here in North America, Samsung makes HDTVs that are simply incapable of displaying PAL video. I've tried. The TV manual itself says that it can't display PAL and they are quite correct. Yet that hasn't stopped a few forum members who don't even own Samsung HDTVs from expressing doubt about this until one of our senior members confirmed it for them.

[edDV]

Both of my Samsung HDTV sets completely block PAL.

Both of my Vizio HDTV sets display PAL from composite, S-Video or analog component. I don't have a PAL HDMI device to test HDMI.

My Philips "HD Ready" CRT lacks a PAL decoder but displays PAL analog component fine.

Don't assume a brand will display PAL. Try to test it in the store before you buy.

[usually_quiet]

I am happy to know for certain that Samsung TVs made for N, America won't display PAL video, though I suspected as much. The PDF manual I have was no help. It doesn't contain the acronyms "NTSC" or "PAL". (...Or "ATSC" or "QAM", for that matter, though the TV tuner supports both). There have never been any PAL DVDs available for me to test play.

While I don't own the TV, I might as well, for all the time I have to spend helping my relatives with it. I set it up for them, and unfortunately ever since, it seems like they need my help for anything more than changing channels. That's why I have PDF manuals for their stuff on my computer.

[victoriabears]

It seems to me that the very fact that a dvd player can be hacked region free , tends to suggest that it can play pal on a ntsc TV.
The blanket statements made on this site about the whole ntsc/pal issue have long baffled me.

The Pioneer range of dvd players currently sold , certainly the 420, can play pal on a ntsc TV and can be made region free easilly, most if not all Philips dvd players are also the same. They are freely available on the net, usually at reasonable costs, I have posted links to dozens of good sellers selling such players.

I have a huge amount of experience with this ntsc/pal issue have lived in Canada for 10 years and have watched pal dvd's (region free or not) on my ntsc TV's with no problem. Why buy a multi system TV unless you want to watch pal vhs, as I agree converting vcr's are expensive.

There is a lot of traffic about this whole issue and frankly when it gets into fps and dg pulldowns etc I really get baffled, I have never found any of these necessary to deal with. I have no idea where this difficult to play back material comes from as I have over 8000 vhs and dvd's and never found any. I have even resize badly encoded material and it looks fine.

I have large pal vhs library from the UK, am slowly converting it to PAL dvd, conversions are oh so unnecessary if you take the simple road.

I have even found buying friends/relatives suitable dvd players a lot cheaper on the stress than making NTSC dvd's for them.

As has been stated , Europe does not have these issues, as like vcr's sold there, their dvd player sales have long catered for NTSC playback.

[kosekjm]

My Samsung TV plays my region 2 discs just fine.

I have a Samsung LN40A750 LCD. I also have a cheap Philips DVD player (Not entirely sure of the model right now). The Philips was easily converted to play all regions. I then have the DVD player going into my Onkyo 606 receiver and then out to the TV. With this setup, I am able to watch just about anything that I've thrown at it. This has mostly been region 2 PAL discs (Still Game, Fry and Laurie, Rab C.) and a handful of Region 4 discs (I think it was 4 it was from Australia). So far any of these Region 2 discs play the video just fine. The one slight problem that I have is a slight lip sync issue. I beleive this is coming ffrom the receiver though, because prior to the receiver I had none. However since it is very slight, I haven't bothered rerunning all of my setup to hook the DVD player directly to the TV. I also haven't yet tried to correct it in the receiver (Like I said it is a very slight issue)

I also have a smaller Olevia TV in the bedroom hooked up to an Allegro VCR/DVD combo player. That player will play my region free PAL disks just fine. It will not accept a region 2 disc as I've not found any region hack for it yet. With this setup, I get no lip sync issues

Both of these players are hooked to the next device via component cables. In the case of the main TV, the Onkyo then hands the signal to the TV via HDMI.

I know not if the Philips is converting the signal or not. All I know is that I can watch any of the PAL videos that I have just fine.

The PS3 (Both old and new slim version) and my Panasonic BD60 both stop these disks as soon as I put them in. I'll get a message along the line of "This type of disc is not supported" (Been a while since I tried it so not entirely sure what the message was). Neither of these two players will accept any of my PAL discs, even including the ones that are region free.

I almost forgot, I also have an older Samsung Tube HDTV (One of their slimfit displays). That used to be hooked to the Allegro in the bedroom. That TV would also allow the PAL discs to play when they were being run on the Allegro DVD player.

[edDV]

...

I know not if the Philips is converting the signal or not. All I know is that I can watch any of the PAL videos that I have just fine.

Most likely the Philips player is converting. One way to tell is connect the player directly to the Samsung TV and select source info. PAL will show as 576i or 576p 50Hz, NTSC will show as 480i or 480p 60Hz.

[Mike99]

Regarding the Philips DVP3980 & similar players. The online manual states “Playback Multistandard (PAL/NTSC)” & that you can select PAL or NTSC disc. I also see this unit advertised from some vendors as region free and has a built-in PAL to NTSC video converter.

Is it safe to presume that the unit comes from Philips with the converter, and that the vendor is not modifying the player? And that selecting either PAL or NTSC refers to the output format, not the disc that you are playing.

IOW no matter where you buy the player from it appears all it takes to make it region free is entering a code on the remote. Then it will play Region 2 PAL discs, and it can also convert the output to NTSC with the proper PAL/NTSC setting. Does this sound correct? If so, then I could just buy this player locally.

Any comments or advice would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

[anaboland]

European/UK DVD players are pretty much all multistandard, and some are multi-voltage.

This is thanks to the people who set up the crappy region code thing in the first place.

Europe/UK is Region 2 - PAL
Japan is Region 2 - NTSC

Hence Region 2 players are required to play both, either at a native level or though some kind or conversion.

yes they could limit players sold in a particular region2 area to play only PAL or NTSC, but it probably more trouble than its worth so they don't seem to bother.

Also most tv sets have been multistandard for many years, i purchased my first multistandard set back in 1988, although they were harder to find back then.

Alot of the new tv sets sold around the world seem to be basically the same, i wonder if alot of the stuff sold in the US is multistandard, but its just not advertised, surely its cheaper to produce one set of multistandard tvs, than mess around producing various crippled versions for sale in different countries....?



With Most UK and i guess some US dvd player, there will be an option buried in the players SETUP menu.

This option is normally called TV TYPE or something similar, you then have 3 options PAL, NTSC, AUTO

NOTE:- With some players this option is only avaliable when there is NO Dvd in the drive..


1- if you select PAL then the output from the player will be compatible with a PAL TV, regardless of whether the Dvd is PAL or NTSC.

2- if you select NTSC then the output from the player will be compatible with a NTSC TV, regardless of whether the Dvd is PAL or NTSC.

3- if you select AUTO then the output from the player is as the original Dvd, ie PAL or NTSC


THe conversion from one TV Type to another is done on the fly by the players internal chipset.


It seems that the Philips players are popular in th US because they have the option to switch TV TYPE and its region free options, my parents have a UK philips dvd player and it also has the TV Type settings, and it performs nicely.

cheers

[jman98]

Regarding the Philips DVP3980 & similar players. The online manual states “Playback Multistandard (PAL/NTSC)” & that you can select PAL or NTSC disc. I also see this unit advertised from some vendors as region free and has a built-in PAL to NTSC video converter.

Is it safe to presume that the unit comes from Philips with the converter, and that the vendor is not modifying the player? And that selecting either PAL or NTSC refers to the output format, not the disc that you are playing.

Yes, Philips players come able to convert between PAL and NTSC. And you are entirely correct that selecting PAL or NTSC indeed refers to the output format and not the disc being played. Note that Philips may default to an output value called either ANY or MULTI (I don't remember which) that means send the same output to the TV as the disc has. This doesn't work on many North American TVs and needs to be set to NTSC.

IOW no matter where you buy the player from it appears all it takes to make it region free is entering a code on the remote. Then it will play Region 2 PAL discs, and it can also convert the output to NTSC with the proper PAL/NTSC setting. Does this sound correct? If so, then I could just buy this player locally.

Any comments or advice would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

Sorry dude, but you are completely wrong here. Many DVD players cannot be made region free by entering a code. And it's not common, but there have been some DVD players that could be made region free but actually did not convert and display all PAL input video as PAL output and NTSC input video as NTSC output. That's usually bad in North America as most TVs sold here can't handle PAL video. Samsung and Sony are among the most difficult DVD players in the world to make region free right now. Philips and Pioneer are in general the easiest, but you should ALWAYS check to see if an unlock code (usually this is called a "hack" on the internet) exists for the player prior to purchase. We get a lot of requests for unlock codes after purchase around here and a lot of disappointed people find out that they just bought a player that can't be unlocked.

[Mike99]

The particular Philips model that I mentioned supposedly can be made region free using the remote, at least according to postings in the DVD Hacks sub-forum. I figured why order one and pay shipping when I can get it cheaper locally, presuming I can get it to properly function.

[jman98]

My bad in that I thought you were asking about players in general rather than a specific model. I incorrectly assumed a bit of a subject change on your part that did not occur. However, my comment is still not all together wrong in that manufacturers do sometimes make changes in hardware and hacks that work today may not work by the time you buy a model. It does happen. We get posts all the time asking why a listed hack doesn't work when they did on the exact same model. So there's no specific recommendation in so far as "If you buy your DVD player from store X you have a 100% guarantee that the hack will work". For Philips and Pioneer it will most likely work regardless of where you buy it, but I can't give you a 100% guarantee of success. It's best to be able to take it back for a full refund if you can't get the hack to work. We had a post just today from a pissed off customer in Austria who bought a player after the sales person swore it could be made region free and there is no hack specific to that model. There's just a hack for a related model that might or might not work on his player. So you can't always trust vendors when they tell you that specific models can definitely be hacked by you at home.