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  1. Member
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    JohnnyBob,

    You specifically asked (more than once) for references as to why only limited inferences should be drawn from media quality testing on consumer equipment. I not only provided appropriate references, as requested, but also explained the limitations of such testing in plain english (for the benefit of any readers not familiar with optical media technobabble).

    All I did was give you what you asked for. There's little to be gained by shooting the messenger because you don't like the message.

  2. Video Restorer lordsmurf's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by VegasBud
    It gets even worse...have you ever run a "quality test" repeatedly on the same test disk? If you have, you should have noticed that the results aren't the same. The disk certainly didn't change between tests, so why do the results vary for the exact same drive? .
    "AHH! AHH! MY DATA DISAPPEARED!!! AHHH!"

    That's what usually happens when people notice the testing differences, especially after much time has passed. In most of those cases, the same drive is being used and has aged. Or another drive entirely is being used and just does not work well with this specific disc. In some cases, people who start to claim "all their discs have degraded" are now using a piece-o-crap drive to test with, as compared to the drive from the earlier tests.

    But God forbid you try to talk sense to any of these folks. They've made up their minds about testing, facts be damned. Nevermind that their knowledge of media was fractional to begin with.
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  3. ...C O P Y L E F T JohnnyBob's Avatar
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    Both of you are talking nonsense.

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    Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    Both of you are talking nonsense.
    Originally Posted by VegasBud
    All I did was give you what you asked for. There's little to be gained by shooting the messenger because you don't like the message.
    Exactly!!


    Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    It sounds like you work for Verbatim.
    Nope, i just have real life experience...

    Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    But what makes you think you have a right to make personal attacks like this?
    What personal attack ??
    Are you totally delusional ?!?!

    Oh wait, let me break out NERO to test my Verbatim DL+R's that have actually played flawlessy from start to finish so NERO can tell me they are F*@CKED!!!

    Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    Where's the moderator???
    Probably doing the same thing the rest if us are doing!!


    I may be crude, but i speak only the truth 8)

  5. ...C O P Y L E F T JohnnyBob's Avatar
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    That makes 3.

  6. ...C O P Y L E F T JohnnyBob's Avatar
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    Here's a typical quality scan of VERBATIM DVD-R 16X 100PK 95102 MCC03RG20 made in United Arab Emir purchased from Newegg on their Black Friday special. They give the best quality scans I've ever seen. Different batches of discs may have typical scan signatures, and in this case PIE increases towards the outer rim. Burning at 8x rather than 16x helps significantly.


  7. Video Restorer lordsmurf's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    Burning at 8x rather than 16x helps significantly.
    I'm glad you're at least heeding some of our advice.
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  8. ...C O P Y L E F T JohnnyBob's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by lordsmurf
    Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    Burning at 8x rather than 16x helps significantly.
    I'm glad you're at least heeding some of our advice.
    Wrong. I'm long past that and rely on my own independent tests, data, and logic. Your 'collective' advice, mostly unfounded hearsay and/or verbose gobbledegook, doesn't influence my judgement anymore.

    The data from my DVDSpeed quality scans speaks for itself. PIE totals are smaller towards the end of the scan (outer rim of the disc) when burnt at 8x rather than 16x with these particular discs. That is not the case with various other kinds and batches of discs where faster burning gives better quality scans. So the generalization to burn slower to get better quality is false - often the opposite is true.

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    I thought I had done my research when I decided to buy Verbatin +R made in Singapore disks two months ago. However, I've been appalled at the wastage. I am running 25-30% bad disks, which is higher than the wastage I had been getting on my bought-at-Costco Sony +R disks.

  10. Originally Posted by susaninpdx
    I thought I had done my research when I decided to buy Verbatin +R made in Singapore disks two months ago. However, I've been appalled at the wastage. I am running 25-30% bad disks, which is higher than the wastage I had been getting on my bought-at-Costco Sony +R disks.
    I wouldn't be so quick to blame the media, could be your burner, your DVD player, etc.

  11. Video Restorer lordsmurf's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    Your 'collective' advice, mostly unfounded hearsay and/or verbose gobbledegook, doesn't influence my judgement anymore.
    Your ignorant horseshit is really starting to piss me off. Two years ago (see thread), you didn't know your ass from your elbow, in terms of DVD media and DVD burning -- now you think you're the expert. It's like talking to a teenager.

    If anything, I am vehemently opposed to myth and misinformation. The FACT is that Verbatim is excellent media, and that 8x-12x on 16x media yields better results. If you don't like the facts, then that's just too bad.
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    According to dictionary.com, the definition of "opinionated" is "obstinate or conceited with regard to the merit of one's own opinions; conceitedly dogmatic".

    Arguing with an opinionated person is a waste of time. Instead, I'll merely recommend that anyone reading this thread at least go through the references I provided, if for no other reason than to see what the people with actual credentials have to say on the matter. Once you're familiar with the facts, make up your own mind as to what reality is.

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    susaninpdx,

    I agree with bbanderic...don't jump to conclusions. The only way to tell what's going on is to post a burn log, which is the best way to get the information needed to figure out what the problem really is. Anything else is just speculation.

    People who know anything about burning are only coming to this thread for entertainment, so it would be better to start a new thread to discuss the matter. I'll make a point of checking for your thread for the next few days, and will be happy to help you find the source of the problem.

  14. ...C O P Y L E F T JohnnyBob's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by lordsmurf
    Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    Your 'collective' advice, mostly unfounded hearsay and/or verbose gobbledegook, doesn't influence my judgement anymore.
    Your ignorant horseshit is really starting to piss me off. Two years ago (see thread), you didn't know your ass from your elbow, in terms of DVD media and DVD burning -- now you think you're the expert. It's like talking to a teenager.

    If anything, I am vehemently opposed to myth and misinformation. The FACT is that Verbatim is excellent media, and that 8x-12x on 16x media yields better results. If you don't like the facts, then that's just too bad.
    Originally Posted by VegasBud
    According to dictionary.com, the definition of "opinionated" is "obstinate or conceited with regard to the merit of one's own opinions; conceitedly dogmatic".

    Arguing with an opinionated person is a waste of time. Instead, I'll merely recommend that anyone reading this thread at least go through the references I provided, if for no other reason than to see what the people with actual credentials have to say on the matter. Once you're familiar with the facts, make up your own mind as to what reality is.
    Stupid prejudiced ignoramuses like you two should keep your mouths shut til you figure out where why your penises are so small.

  15. ...C O P Y L E F T JohnnyBob's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by susaninpdx
    I thought I had done my research when I decided to buy Verbatin +R made in Singapore disks two months ago. However, I've been appalled at the wastage. I am running 25-30% bad disks, which is higher than the wastage I had been getting on my bought-at-Costco Sony +R disks.
    Just goes to prove what I've been saying all along, unfortunately Verbatim is not longer a reliable DVD disc brand. Buying them is like shooting craps because you never know what you're going to get. You'll find some people here who probably work for Verbatim supporting that brand regardless, which you should disregard. It's possible to still buy good Verbatims but it's getting pretty tricky.

  16. Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    Originally Posted by susaninpdx
    I thought I had done my research when I decided to buy Verbatin +R made in Singapore disks two months ago. However, I've been appalled at the wastage. I am running 25-30% bad disks, which is higher than the wastage I had been getting on my bought-at-Costco Sony +R disks.
    Just goes to prove what I've been saying all along, unfortunately Verbatim is not longer a reliable DVD disc brand. Buying them is like shooting craps because you never know what you're going to get. You'll find some people here who probably work for Verbatim supporting that brand regardless, which you should disregard. It's possible to still buy good Verbatims but it's getting pretty tricky.
    There's absolutely nothing wrong with the Verbatim "Made in Singapore" Verbatim DVD+R dual layer discs...you won't find any better...proven fact.

    True that with Verbatim media you have to do your homework a bit to get the good stuff, which is one reason I stick with the "premium line" Taiyo Yuden's, you know exactly what you're getting. However, you can't go wrong with Verbatim "made in Taiwan or Singapore" for SL and DL.

    To anyone other than JohnnyBob, who has his mind firmly made up, forget about this disc scanning nonsense for reasons outlined perfectly by VegasBud, life is far too short. Get quality media, burner, DVD player and burning software and you should be good to go. If you do all that and verify your burns by actually watching your DVD's all the way through. If they play consistantly without errors, freezeups etc. there is no better test.

  17. ...C O P Y L E F T JohnnyBob's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by bbanderic
    ... forget about this disc scanning nonsense for reasons outlined perfectly by VegasBud, life is far too short. Get quality media, burner, DVD player and burning software and you should be good to go. If you do all that and verify your burns by actually watching your DVD's all the way through. If they play consistantly without errors, freezeups etc. there is no better test.
    Wrong. The best way is to scan all your burns with Nero DVD/CDSpeed, which is the only way to discover how good the burn actually is. After awhile you'll be able to recognize good from bad, marginal from solid, burns - and good disc batches from bad ones. After a few hundred scans under a variety of conditions, you'll get the hang of it. Don't believe these people here who say otherwise. It's not clear where they're coming from, but I'm pretty sure some of them work for (are employees of) Verbatim. They want to kill all criticisms, typical of commercial interests in general.

  18. Originally Posted by JohnnyBob
    Originally Posted by bbanderic
    ... forget about this disc scanning nonsense for reasons outlined perfectly by VegasBud, life is far too short. Get quality media, burner, DVD player and burning software and you should be good to go. If you do all that and verify your burns by actually watching your DVD's all the way through. If they play consistantly without errors, freezeups etc. there is no better test.
    Wrong. The best way is to scan all your burns with Nero DVD/CDSpeed, which is the only way to discover how good the burn actually is. After awhile you'll be able to recognize good from bad, marginal from solid, burns - and good disc batches from bad ones. After a few hundred scans under a variety of conditions, you'll get the hang of it. Don't believe these people here who say otherwise. It's not clear where they're coming from, but I'm pretty sure some of them work for (are employees of) Verbatim. They want to kill all criticisms, typical of commercial interests in general.
    You just made my point with that statement. After a few hundred scans and an untold number of good discs thrown away in the trash, you might get the hang of it . Like I said, life is too short.

    This will be my last comment on this subject in this thread, my point has been made. I will check back from time to time to see if anyone comments in support of your position, I'm still waiting.

  19. ...C O P Y L E F T JohnnyBob's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by bbanderic
    ...You just made my point with that statement. After a few hundred scans and an untold number of good discs thrown away in the trash, you might get the hang of it . Like I said, life is too short.
    So get another life! Scanning is fun!
    This will be my last comment on this subject in this thread, my point has been made. I will check back from time to time to see if anyone comments in support of your position, I'm still waiting.
    Your comment has been made, true, but not your point. As for anyone supporting my position, that's irrelevant. The truth is the truth, not something political. Scanning with DVD/CDSpeed is the best way to evaluate media quality. Period!

  20. Mod Neophyte Super Moderator redwudz's Avatar
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    This thread appears to have run it's course. Locked.

    Moderator redwudz




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