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  1. Member
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    Originally Posted by Seeker47 View Post
    Originally Posted by handyguy
    Build Your Own PVR

    byopvr.com
    Yup, we've heard that before. But they won't turn themselves On and Off at designated times, like a standalone DVDR. (Or the HDD portion of the Sat / Cable box.) Also probably beyond the reach of all but dedicated hobbyists with a nice budget.
    i would NOT say that
    I have a HomeWorx PVR, connected to a 2TB external USB drive
    set the time and channel and it comes on records just find, of course, this is OTA not cable, the cable tuner.. thats problem
    but there are retail models that accept "cable cards", the "channel master" has been mentioned here before, the biggest problem seems to be finding one,
    they sell out fast every time a seller gets a shipment
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  2. Originally Posted by Lyell1 View Post
    [...] My Cablevision has started giving me trouble dubbing off the DVR, apparently only HD programs. I only want to do what I have done for 40 years and that is record my College team's games. There is no non HD as a choice. I can certainly record them on my computer and make a DVD, but that's a pain, and I pay for cable TV. I pay a LOT of money for cable TV. This isn't Pay-Per-View! [...] I have been recording on VHS and saving those VHS's since 1982. I'm not stealing anything if I am paying. Now recording HD is a crime? Just for my personal collection of basketball games?
    In short, you don't have a leg to stand on. None of us do any more. High Definition was the Trojan Horse that ushered in a new era of very restricted recording options. Once your particular cable neighborhood goes 100% digital encryption, wave "bye-bye" to fuss-free permanent-copy recording with cheap generic gear you can buy in a store. You want HDTV-quality archives? You either get a CableCard recording device for your PC, or a TiVO that can network transfer its files to your PC. Those are your choices.

    Your post wasn't clear whether you want to capture these games in HDTV or standard def. If you are happy with standard def, all you need is a filter box like The Grex, connected between your cable box analog outputs and your DVD recorder (or PC) analog inputs. The Grex strips out the anti-record flag, so your PC or dvd recorder will function normally. There are other filter boxes than The Grex, but it is the most well-known and popular. Cost is approx $90 on Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/XDIMAX-GREX-7-4-Grex-Video-Stabilizer/dp/B0096I2DNE/ref=sr_1_1?i...deo+stabilizer). Yes, its expensive, but its the only way to "continue on as you have since 1992" with your basketball recordings. Cable systems are adding these anti-record signals on more and more channels every year, now that they see the Feds don't have the stones to fight them any longer.
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    Originally Posted by theewizard View Post
    Originally Posted by Seeker47 View Post
    Originally Posted by handyguy
    Build Your Own PVR

    byopvr.com
    Yup, we've heard that before. But they won't turn themselves On and Off at designated times, like a standalone DVDR. (Or the HDD portion of the Sat / Cable box.) Also probably beyond the reach of all but dedicated hobbyists with a nice budget.
    i would NOT say that
    I have a HomeWorx PVR, connected to a 2TB external USB drive
    set the time and channel and it comes on records just find, of course, this is OTA not cable, the cable tuner.. thats problem
    but there are retail models that accept "cable cards", the "channel master" has been mentioned here before, the biggest problem seems to be finding one,
    they sell out fast every time a seller gets a shipment
    When handyguy and Seeker47 posted those remarks in 2009, they were discussing an HTPC. (This kind of confusion is what happens when new members post questions in old threads.)

    In 2009, I think the only dedicated OTA DVRs available were TiVos, DVICO DVRs and the Echostar DTVPal DVR, and none of them was inexpensive.

    Channel Master never made any models that accepted a CableCARD, but some could record clear QAM. At one time, Tivo, Moxi, and Samsung did make stand-alone CableCARD recorders that could be purchased, but TiVo is the only such recorder still being made. None of these recorders would be of help with Lyell1's problem . All of them follow the same rules as cable DVRs regarding what they do with copy-once, copy-never and copy-no-more copy control flags.

    [Edit]I was wrong about Samsung making a cable DVR that consumers could buy. I forgot it was merely a cable box, without the ability to record TV.
    Last edited by usually_quiet; 21st Dec 2015 at 17:30.
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  4. Member netmask56's Avatar
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    Of course this wouldn't work in North America and if it did probably be illegal you can record from Cable, Netflix etc as capture as well as OTA and transfer onto your computer etc
    https://beyonwiz.com.au/products/beyonwiz-t4-barebones/
    BeyonWiz T3 PVR ~ Popcorn A-500 ~ Samsung ES8000 65" LED TV ~ Windows 7 64bit ~ Yamaha RX-A1070 ~ QnapTS851-4G
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    Oh that is sweet
    there is never 10 things on at the same time , that would want to record
    but 4 tuners, record multiple channels at the same time, record from HDMI

    I want a USA version
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  6. Member Seeker47's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by netmask56 View Post
    Of course this wouldn't work in North America and if it did probably be illegal you can record from Cable, Netflix etc as capture as well as OTA and transfer onto your computer etc
    https://beyonwiz.com.au/products/beyonwiz-t4-barebones/
    Hmmm. No time right now, but I'd like to take a closer look at this one -- to the extent that's possible via online research -- and of course I'll be most curious to hear what Orsetto has to say about this, or any competing devices that may be out there. The price is not a deterrent to me (and neither is the legality), but if it would not work here, never mind. (Probably not dual current, and who wants to mess with a transformer ?)

    I remained on the sidelines for Elegato, Avermedia, and other such devices, as they seemed tailored more for gaming capture, and these did not seem to offer the feature set or clear advantages I was looking for. Guess I've remained a Pioneer DVDR purist, and hope to remain so for as long as I can keep my hardware working. The other variables are whatever becomes of cable / sat receivers -- loss of their S-Video ports would be fatal -- and perhaps finding something demonstrably better than the Leunking intermediary connection box.

    [EDIT: I'm a bit behind the curve here. I believe the S-Video ports disappeared from TWC receivers some time ago. Then Tivo boxes dropped them . . . although they do still have that techie ethernet + software OUT. My DTV HR-24 receivers still provide the S-Video option, although the DirecTV firmware and user interface can give you annoying nag screens when you use it, which can ruin some recordings. The HR-24's are still in service, but for how much longer it is hard to say. The subsequent HR-34 or '44 (whole home / "Genie") appear to have dropped the S-Video, but I'm not entirely certain about that, and I did not want the Genie in any case. I should also mention that there have been some converters around that can go from HDMI or Component Out into the S-Video of the Pioneers. However, I have preferred to keep my equipment chain shorter and less complicated, wherever possible.]

    While it would certainly be nice to acquire a straightforward HD recording capability, it is not something I really require. (Actually, an HT consultant I've been introduced to has told me that such a standalone device is available here, albeit pricey and not so well known.) We are actively discouraged from discussing this here in any detail, but there is not a whole lot one might be seeking in an HD version that can't be found online via "Scene release" sites, after a bit of searching. However, a glaring category exception to this happens to be sports events -- which would disappoint one recent poster.
    Last edited by Seeker47; 21st Dec 2015 at 11:49.
    When in Las Vegas, don't miss the Pinball Hall of Fame Museum http://www.pinballmuseum.org/ -- with over 150 tables from 6+ decades of this quintessentially American art form.
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    Originally Posted by Seeker47 View Post
    Originally Posted by netmask56 View Post
    Of course this wouldn't work in North America and if it did probably be illegal you can record from Cable, Netflix etc as capture as well as OTA and transfer onto your computer etc
    https://beyonwiz.com.au/products/beyonwiz-t4-barebones/
    Hmmm. No time right now, but I'd like to take a closer look at this one -- to the extent that's possible via online research -- and of course I'll be most curious to hear what Orsetto has to say about this, or any competing devices that may be out there. The price is not a deterrent to me (and neither is the legality), but if it would not work here, never mind. (Probably not dual current, and who wants to mess with a transformer ?)

    I remained on the sidelines for Elegato, Avermedia, and other such devices, as they seemed tailored more for gaming capture, and these did not seem to offer the feature set or clear advantages I was looking for. Guess I've remained a Pioneer DVDR purist, and hope to remain so for as long as I can keep my hardware working. The other variables are whatever becomes of cable / sat receivers -- loss of their S-Video ports would be fatal -- and perhaps finding something demonstrably better than the Leunking intermediary connection box.

    [EDIT: I'm a bit behind the curve here. I believe the S-Video ports disappeared from TWC receivers some time ago. Then Tivo boxes dropped them . . . although they do still have that techie ethernet + software OUT. My DTV HR-24 receivers still provide the S-Video option, although the DirecTV firmware and user interface can give you annoying nag screens when you use it, which can ruin some recordings. The HR-24's are still in service, but for how much longer it is hard to say. The subsequent HR-34 or '44 (whole home / "Genie") appear to have dropped the S-Video, but I'm not entirely certain about that, and I did not want the Genie in any case. I should also mention that there have been some converters around that can go from HDMI or Component Out into the S-Video of the Pioneers. However, I have preferred to keep my equipment chain shorter and less complicated, wherever possible.]

    While it would certainly be nice to acquire a straightforward HD recording capability, it is not something I really require. (Actually, an HT consultant I've been introduced to has told me that such a standalone device is available here, albeit pricey and not so well known.) We are actively discouraged from discussing this here in any detail, but there is not a whole lot one might be seeking in an HD version that can't be found online via "Scene release" sites, after a bit of searching. However, a glaring category exception to this happens to be sports events -- which would disappoint one recent poster.
    The beyonwiz device certainly looks interesting... I imagine it wouldn't work in North America because the DVB-T tuner is not ATSC standard, besides the electrical/voltage difference. But if you examine the website closely, they are selling "refurbished" units and parts. That does not seem to support reliability considering the asking price. Four tuners and a 6TB drive is certainly appealing, though....
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    Originally Posted by hech54 View Post
    Wow. Your first post and you are asking for people to help you partake
    in possibly illegal activities......Hmmm.
    Dude, grow up. There was a Supreme Court Ruling in 1985 approving all recording of television programs for personal use. Many shows and news specials will never have repeats, be sold in physical form, or available for streaming. So it's an archival method of maintaining content, not a black market scam. A big part of understanding technology is knowing how to get past barriers. Have you ever locked yourself out of your computer or smartphone and had to *crack* your way back in? Trust me, it's a valuable skill to know. My former boss who owned a computer repair company always said, "There's no such thing as understanding technology without also understanding how to hack." So chill, please.

    Originally Posted by orsetto View Post
    Recorders like your LG made prior to 2007 are more accurate at detecting "real" versus "fake" or "accidental" record lockout signals. After 2006, almost every new recorder became way too trigger-happy, with Sony being the absolute worst offender. At this point, Sony recorders are nothing more than overpriced players: there's that many complaints about them being totally crippled.

    Arguably you are not supposed to be able to record any cable show that is authentically "protected", but this has become an impossibly grey area in the wake of constant cableco technical screwups during the analog-digital transition. ATSC/QAM is infested with all manner of glitches that cause unintended recording lockouts. In this current mess, the best bet in a new recorder is to buy one that has a hard drive built in. At the very least, even if such machines block you making a DVD you can still time-shift a protected show by recording it to the hard drive for later viewing. DVD/HDD recorders have pretty much vanished in the USA except for the Magnavox H2160, available at Wal*Mart and Target online for $229-279. Recording quality is excellent, it has a good ATSC/QAM tuner, and the internal HDD can hold 60 hours at the SP speed. If you keep an eye on the J&R Electronics website, once a month they blow out "refurbished" H2160s for the outrageous bargain price of $159 ("refurbished" just means a clueless consumer couldn't figure out the instruction manual and returned the recorder to Magnavox: the "refurbs" are good as new for $100 discount).

    While it has its faults (kinda klutzy to operate), its about the only game in town for a new recorder in the US. If your budget can go higher, to $400-450, you might consider the Pioneer 660 or Panasonic EH-68 "multi-region" import models available from J&R, B&H, and World Import. These machines are much more refined in operation than the Magnavox, but their tuners won't receive the new ATSC/QAM broadcasts in the US. You'd need to connect your cable or satellite decoder box, or an external ATSC tuner for off-air reception. If you do a lot of editing and making DVDs for your library, the pricier Pioneer or Panasonic will pay for themselves quickly in ease of use. If you primarily timeshift, watch, and erase the Magnavox is the steal of the century and the best price/performance recorder ever sold in the USA. A refurb Magnavox at $159 blows any other solution out of the water: "black box protection filters" cost at least as much, are a hassle to use, and overkill if all you wanna due with your cable is timeshift.
    THANK YOU for all of this info. Saving this! My cousin used to send me to a special website where I would buy a cable for a specific DVD player to be able to remove a copyrighted channel. It was fantastic. Thanks again for this valuable info. Viva la recorders/archivists.
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    @ParadiseKendra are you aware that you are referencing posts made in 2009?

    Orsetto's comments about Magnavox recorders are largely irrelevant in 2018. I think that at this point, Funai, the company responsible for the Magnavox recorders, has ended production. All you can find are refurbished/used models, and largely different, newer models than Orsetto suggests. His opinion regarding Funai's later models is that they were were not as well-made or reliable as some older ones.
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    I am aware, yes. It's still interesting info to read up on and gain knowledge from. I look forward to learning more! A shame about Magnavox recorders though. Ahhhh well, we'll find another way.
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    Originally Posted by ParadiseKendra View Post
    I am aware, yes. It's still interesting info to read up on and gain knowledge from. I look forward to learning more! A shame about Magnavox recorders though. Ahhhh well, we'll find another way.
    Maybe Funai is still in the DVD recorder business. I did a search using slightly different wording and found that Walmart is still selling one DVD recorder, new-in-box, the Magnavox MDR865H HD DVR. However, it won't ignore copy-once and copy-never protection added to a cable box's composite video signal. Also, the tuner won't be useful for recording anything other than over-the-air broadcasts received via antenna because it doesn't have analog tuning capability and digital cable service providers encrypt their digital signals now.
    Ignore list: hello_hello, tried, TechLord
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  12. Member Seeker47's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by usually_quiet View Post
    Originally Posted by ParadiseKendra View Post
    I am aware, yes. It's still interesting info to read up on and gain knowledge from. I look forward to learning more! A shame about Magnavox recorders though. Ahhhh well, we'll find another way.
    Maybe Funai is still in the DVD recorder business. I did a search using slightly different wording and found that Walmart is still selling one DVD recorder, new-in-box, the Magnavox MDR865H HD DVR. However, it won't ignore copy-once and copy-never protection added to a cable box's composite video signal. Also, the tuner won't be useful for recording anything other than over-the-air broadcasts received via antenna because it doesn't have analog tuning capability and digital cable service providers encrypt their digital signals now.
    I'm aware that the Pioneer 640 through 560 models that I continue using only turn up these days used on ePay, at usually exorbitant prices and in unknown condition that amounts to a crapshoot. That said, I can't recall any instances of being stymied in my archival activities, off of (the older model) DirecTV sat receivers that I standardized on some time ago. These recordings are limited to SD quality of course, but that is way better than nothing -- particularly at the "upper end" modes that are at or very close to DVD quality. If I ever "upgraded" to later sat receiver models which have dropped the S-Video Out connections, that capability would be lost. It has been a pretty decent setup, until and unless something better comes to my attention.
    When in Las Vegas, don't miss the Pinball Hall of Fame Museum http://www.pinballmuseum.org/ -- with over 150 tables from 6+ decades of this quintessentially American art form.
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  13. usually_quiet is correct, ParadiseKendra: my comments that you quoted above are quite outdated now (i.e. the vendor J&R closed down a few years ago after decades in business: R.I.P.). While the gist of my posts still apply in the abstract, in practical terms they're irrelevant today given that none of the recorders I discussed are available new anymore (and at this point even used ones will be worn out).

    DVD recorders are a dead issue now: they're completely gone from the market. Funai was the last holdout, but even they seem to have thrown in the towel. They were defeated finally by the same factors that defeated all other brands: the bizarre North American cable and OTA signal mess thats the laughingstock of the civilized world. Our off-air digital broadcast system started off badly and has only gotten worse with time (channels appear and disappear from TV and recorder memory at random, signal strength varies more than the weather). Our multiple proprietary cable and satellite signals are so screwed up and locked down that nothing can tune them properly anymore aside from the provider's leased decoder boxes or TiVO. This leaves no really decent reliable signal source for average consumers to use generic recorders: off-air is a glitch-o-rama joke, and if you can record at all from your cable or satellite decoder box all you get is a low-res letterboxed postage stamp.

    That said, some of us do still soldier on with our old dvd/hdd recorders, but keep in mind most of us bought them brand new ten or more years ago and they survive on a wing and a prayer. Due to myriad reliability issues with unrepairable burners, shopping for a used dvd recorder is a bad idea unless you limit your risk to $50 or so. Not many owners will let go of a good Pioneer, Panasonic or Magnavox for that little money, but they seem to turn up on Craigs List every now and then (never for less than $200 on Amazon or eBay, usually much more).

    Starting from scratch today, anyone with a pressing need for a dvd recorder should probably limit their search to a clean, used Magnavox H2160, MDR-513 or MDR-515. While not as nice as earlier Pioneers and Panasonics, those three models at least include ATSC tuners for off-air digital and were the high water mark for Magnavox (after the 515, they got really bad really fast- even the final run of 515s got crummy). The burner in these units was the most durable one ever put in a dvd recorder (aside from Panasonics), and the hard drives are easy to replace with ordinary PC HDDs if necessary. If you can even find one of the current Magnavox 800 series in stock for sale new, the cost is outrageous given the unbelievably shoddy construction, feature/function crippling, and total incompatibility with cable/satellite.

    Sad to say, you're probably better off with a $30 USB video dongle attached to your computer nowadays.
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    Thanks for the update, orsetto. Over the years, I managed to pick up a couple used Pioneer spares off of eBay, at non-ridiculous prices. Due to amazingly good fortune with the primary units that remain in service, I have not as yet had to swap one of these in, so their absolute condition remains unverified. (Apart from the run of quick, basic tests performed after receiving them.) I can only hope for the best. Time will tell.
    When in Las Vegas, don't miss the Pinball Hall of Fame Museum http://www.pinballmuseum.org/ -- with over 150 tables from 6+ decades of this quintessentially American art form.
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