Adobe CS4: Graphics and/or Video Suite

[vhelp]

Countdown: $699-$200 = $499 dollars to go..

Hello everyone

This is a question for those people who regulary or daily use Adobe CS3 and CS4 suites, not for those who don't. This is an *very* expansive tool, and at $600 dollars, casuals are not appreciated. I mean, its hard enough to get a WDTV (now the latest, WDTV Live) and the CS4 is five times that--so no braggers please.

So, can someone enlighten me with CS4 differences ? I thought the Adobe CS4 was the graphics suite. I've been shopping around for a graphics tool that does just about everything and more, and the CS3/CS4 is the tool, for sure, but the price tag is outragious. Still, i'm willing to honestly save up my allowence every week to get it. I mean that! I will be putting down $200 to start the saving plan, starting today! and will count down to the $600 price tag, here

Anyway. I want an industry standard, not a $39 bargan offering similar though crude features.

My plans are to study this suite, and explore (through many purchases) of instructional hard-core books on this subject. After seeing many example books already (I was actually considering purchasing a few in advance, just to read up on it while I honestly save up) on this overwelming subject, I am excited and eager to get started. I've even gone as far as creating my own filters (programming a graphics suite of my own, and if all goes well, I hope to parrelle some of my work with this instrustry standars' -- a guy can dream) in the interum and processes. Its truely an endeavor, worth its weight in gold, RGB/CMYK/HSV/etc gold that is

( versus v1.5, what does CS3 and CS4 stand for ? )

Does the CS4 stand for a version only or something else I need to look out for, and that there are different variations in the suites. I see (am learning) that there are other catagories, like those listed below.

I see there's:

	Components               DePr  DeSt WePr  WeSt  PrPr    MaCo
	Adobe InDesign® CS4      yes   yes  no    no    no	yes   US $699
	Adobe Photoshop® CS4 Ext yes   no   yes   no    yes	yes   US $999
	Adobe Photoshop CS4      no    yes  no    no    no	no    US $699
	Adobe Illustrator® CS4   yes   yes  yes   no    yes	yes   US $599
	Adobe Acrobat® 9 Pro     yes   yes  yes   no    no	yes   US $449
	Adobe Flash® CS4 Pro     yes   no   yes   yes   yes     yes   US $699
	Adobe Dreamweaver® CS4   yes   no   yes   yes   no	yes   US $399
	Adobe Fireworks® CS4     yes   no   yes   yes   no	yes   US $299
	Adobe Contribute® CS4    no    no   yes   yes   no	yes   US $199
	Adobe After Effects® CS4 no    no   no    no    yes	yes   US $999
	Adobe Premiere® Pro CS4* no    no   no    no    yes	yes   US $799
	Adobe Soundbooth® CS4    no    no   yes   no    yes	yes   US $199
	Adobe OnLocation™ CS4*   no    no   no    no    yes	yes 
	Adobe Encore® CS4*       no    no   no    no    yes	yes 

 	Shared features, services, and applications
	Adobe Bridge CS4         yes   yes  yes   yes   yes   yes 
	Adobe Device Central CS4 yes   yes  yes   yes   yes   yes 
	Adobe Dynamic Link       no    no   no    no    yes   yes 
	Adobe Version Cue® CS4   yes   yes  yes   yes   no    yes

I don't want to get the wrong tool suite. I want the (industry standards) graphics suite..unless the video/graphics are one in the same suite.., I don't know.

-vhelp 5224

[poisondeathray]

CS4 = "Creative Suite 4"

The different versions have different programs included e.g. photoshop, premiere etc... depending if you get a suite version like "production premium" vs. "web premium". Most "video" people get the production premium, because the included applications are video related (instead of including things like dreamweaver for web etc...)

If you browse the Adobe site it has a breakdown of what's included, but it sounds like you are mainly interested in the video editor itself, which is premiere pro cs4 , and graphics programs like photoshop and illustrator for vectors

http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/compare/

Have a look at the included programs , and what you really need. The master collection includes them all, but also costs more... It's definitely not worth buying the individual programs alone, you save way more money buying one of the suites (most people at a minimum would want photoshop and premiere right? and those 2 alone almost add up to the cost of the production premium suite)

[vhelp]

thanks poison. I was trying to avoid abode's website because I'm on dialup and all there cool graphics and flash are too much for my win98 and 150mb left of ram. The flash and graphics reduce my swap file size the point of crashing windows. I usually save what I can for work but they too have their problems like blocking most everything. I hate that!! So, I rely on your guys for your help. Thank you.

anyway, just went to the link you posted (ate up 20mb swap--i knew it would) anway..and I can see it gets even more confusing, and expansive!!. gosh!! didn't expect that!! Look like my plans may have to be put on hold. How unexpected. I'm disapointed.

so, I wonder what package I was looking at the other week that was selling for $599 or was it $699, I forget. I guess I now i have to do some more research.

hmm.. maybe I'm looking for the Adobe Photoshop CS4, its selling for $699, am not sure I need the video, though I didn't see it (specifically) listed..prob under a strange name. the web page is just too slow for my dialup.

Thanks for taking the time to point me in some direction.

-vhelp 5225

[poisondeathray]

Yes for photo work, photoshop is definitely the industry standard. But for graphics and vectors, illustrator is probably the industry standard.

And there are lots of books, but don't forget there are also many free resources and tutorials online, easily thousands of written and video tutorials (although your isp might "barf" on the video ones)

A lot of people swear by GIMP too, and that's free and definitely an option

[rallynavvie]

I've been using Adobe products for years now for both print and film production. They are excellent tools for video production on the PC platform. If it's a Mac I'd use FCP instead. The combination of Premiere Pro, After Effects, and the Magic Bullet suite will allow you to do almost anything an expensive production house can do (once you get good at it, that is).

Do you already own any of their products? If so you'll save a lot by using the upgrade path. They still send you the full version so it isn't like you have to install your old one first and then use the upgrade discs to update versions. However the video apps are now part of an expensive bundle so you may need to buy Premiere or After Effects on their own. The video suite used to be Premiere Pro, After Effects, Audition, and Encore. Now it's wrapped in with some others, though Photoshop is certainly very useful for video editing (you can create masks and filters there).

There are some great training tools out there besides the internet. I learned most of my Adobe video suite applications using the Classroom in a Book series they have. Wherever I got stuck there was a DVD to watch to walk me through and the books make a great reference next to the retail packaged manuals. The internet fills in the rest of the gaps.

[vhelp]

Unfortunately, I don't have any products. I have painshot pro (freeware i think) but that is prob not even the same or brand for that matter.

I'm not looking for creating dvd/bluray video aspects--menus, etc. Only graphics at the moment. I've been studying up on it (strickly amature, mind you) but I also want to look into align some of my programming tools with some of the adobe's for reference and gauging purposes. Photography is another aspect of the field that I will be using the suite with. I am currently reviewing DSLR type cameras, but they too are expansive, cheaping I saw was $499 so far. Anyway.

currently, my dialup won't cut it for resources purposes. besides, i'm old fashion.. I like holding a good book and reading it..specially when its computer related..i remember my good old vic-20 days, buying all sorts of computer magazines for $1.95, when they were that good..ah! the transactor was my favorite while waiting for the bus into work, that was a hard-core mazine for the Comadores, but that was way back in early 80's, gosh, time flies to fast these days, not enought time in a day to (finally) do everything you want.

All your advice, tips, and suggections are helpful.

-vhelp 5226

[ZQX]

There's a load of cool tutorials here, fooling around with them helped me become fairly fluent with Photoshop in a painless sort of way. I agree, Photoshop is the "industry standard" and there are no real alternatives out there (IMO).

[vhelp]

1. I'm confused.. who makes "paintshop pro" then ? I don't see it on adobe's website.

(I snipped the list off all the suites at the top for easy reference instead of bouncing bk/fw their website)

2. also, I see there is a trialware version (814mb) we provide a link. I could prob D/L tomorrow, but I'm not sure I should bother. I read some of the cons in this link. I am wondering how prepared do I need to be in terms of ram/cpu/speed/cores/and so on. I currently have 2 cores, 2gig DDR2 ram, and recently upgraded GPU (graphics card) to an GeForce 9400 GT 1gig, see link.

Any advice guys ?

3. oh, btw, you guys are correct.., there are tons of tutorials out there on the web. I was able to see a few of them, least those that weren't blocked from my work computer.

-vhelp 5228

[rallynavvie]

Your computer specs are fine for running Photoshop. With that video card upgrade you'll also reap the benefits from Photoshop CS4's GPU accelerations so that's pretty handy to have.

There is a 30-day free trial download, but I'd still recommend buying the retail box once the trial is up.

The Classroom-in-a-Book series by Adobe are great training if you're still looking for books. You can find them at any big bookseller (B&N or Borders for sure). Sometimes even the local library has the latest ones.

[vhelp]

I was in B&N last week and dropped my both my eyes when I saw how many CS4 books they had on everything CS4'wise. I was reading one of the subjects of masking and color changing an item, and the technique (antilias -- sorry for spelling error) during the process and it intregued me, because this aspect (antilias) is an known error in many facets of image processing. It opened up my eyes to some of the issues we see here on this boards regarding video conversion, etc. Yeah, I found a new hobby..well, sort of..been doing this since I can remember but just not definitive until now.

I can't wait to get started. I will definately be reading up on masking and layers, etc etc

-vhelp 5231

[edDV]

Food for thought.

The learning curve for these products is extensive and unless you have an immediate feature need, older versions will be fine for learning or experimentation and are very cheap on E-Bay. Likewise you don't need the suite immediately because it will all be obsolete before you master any one of the individual applications. I'd start with an older Photoshop or Illustrator and only upgrade when you need the added features.

I see you are on XP. Photoshop CS2 (version 9) would do fine for learning and experimentation. Check Ebay. You will also find old version's books for cheap. Many can be read for free in Google Books.
CS2 http://books.google.com/books?um=1&q=Photoshop+CS2
CS3 http://books.google.com/books?um=1&q=Photoshop+CS3&btnG=Search+Books

You will find Photoshop courses at most community colleges. This may also qualify you for academic discounts.

What do you mean by "graphics"? Do you understand what Illustrator does?

Paintbox Pro is a consumer product from a different company.

[ocgw]

1. I'm confused.. who makes "paintshop pro" then ? I don't see it on adobe's website.

(I snipped the list off all the suites at the top for easy reference instead of bouncing bk/fw their website)

2. also, I see there is a trialware version (814mb) we provide a link. I could prob D/L tomorrow, but I'm not sure I should bother. I read some of the cons in this link. I am wondering how prepared do I need to be in terms of ram/cpu/speed/cores/and so on. I currently have 2 cores, 2gig DDR2 ram, and recently upgraded GPU (graphics card) to an GeForce 9400 GT 1gig, see link.

Any advice guys ?

3. oh, btw, you guys are correct.., there are tons of tutorials out there on the web. I was able to see a few of them, least those that weren't blocked from my work computer.

-vhelp 5228

Corel makes Paint Shop Pro

ocgwpeace

[edDV]

1. I'm confused.. who makes "paintshop pro" then ? I don't see it on adobe's website.

(I snipped the list off all the suites at the top for easy reference instead of bouncing bk/fw their website)

2. also, I see there is a trialware version (814mb) we provide a link. I could prob D/L tomorrow, but I'm not sure I should bother. I read some of the cons in this link. I am wondering how prepared do I need to be in terms of ram/cpu/speed/cores/and so on. I currently have 2 cores, 2gig DDR2 ram, and recently upgraded GPU (graphics card) to an GeForce 9400 GT 1gig, see link.

Any advice guys ?

3. oh, btw, you guys are correct.., there are tons of tutorials out there on the web. I was able to see a few of them, least those that weren't blocked from my work computer.

-vhelp 5228

Corel makes Paint Shop Pro

ocgwpeace

Corel bough the rights to Paint Shop Pro as they did for many others such as ULead. The users wait to see if there is going to be investment in updates.

[deadrats]

@vhelp

i hope i don't come off like a giant douche but you're just all over the place, you contradict yourself repeatedly, at times within the same post. check out the following quotes lifted straight from your posts:

thanks poison. I was trying to avoid abode's website because I'm on dialup and all there cool graphics and flash are too much for my win98 and 150mb left of ram. The flash and graphics reduce my swap file size the point of crashing windows. I usually save what I can for work but they too have their problems like blocking most everything. I hate that!! So, I rely on your guys for your help. Thank you.

anyway, just went to the link you posted (ate up 20mb swap--i knew it would) anyway..and I can see it gets even more confusing, and expansive!!. gosh!! didn't expect that!! Look like my plans may have to be put on hold. How unexpected. I'm disappointed.

UPDATE: 10/1/2009 -- 2 years, 6 months, and still going strong in XP w/SP2

I currently have 2 cores, 2gig DDR2 ram, and recently upgraded GPU (graphics card) to an GeForce 9400 GT 1gig,

which is it, are you running win98 or xp? if you are running win98, why would you pair it up with a dual core and if you're running xp then how could you possibly have a swap file (xp uses a paging file, no swap) and how could you possibly only have 150mb worth of ram left free out of 2 gigs and how could a web site use up 20mb of swap?

Still, i'm willing to honestly save up my allowance every week to get it. I mean that! I will be putting down $200 to start the saving plan, starting today! and will count down to the $600 price tag, here

I'm not looking for creating dvd/bluray video aspects--menus, etc. Only graphics at the moment. I've been studying up on it (strictly amateur, mind you) but I also want to look into align some of my programming tools with some of the adobe's for reference and gauging purposes. Photography is another aspect of the field that I will be using the suite with. I am currently reviewing DSLR type cameras, but they too are expansive, cheaping I saw was $499 so far.

allowance? are you a kid? furthermore you're willing to spend $600 on a piece of software that quite frankly it doesn't really appear you have a real need or use for but you're not willing to spend $500 for a camera that would provide you with the source that you would actually use with the software in question?

and while i could go on and on pointing out numerous absurdities in your posts that make absolutely no sense whatsoever, i will be content with point out one more: you claim a desire to spend $600 on adobe's software yet you're still on dial up, considering you can get 3mb/s dsl for about $30 a month, perhaps you should invest the $200 you have saved up in a decent broadband connection.

oh, and give GIMP a try and save your dough...

http://www.gimp.org/

[rallynavvie]

I figured he had two PCs he was referring to and asking about running it on either.

I don't really see having a good digital camera as a requirement for Photoshop. I hardly ever use Photoshop with digital pictures like that. At work I use it for UI mockups (layers and folders are wonderful for sorting things) and some touch-ups and at home I use it for website graphics (raster images of course), some print media work, and of course for DVD menus. Given that I rarely ever use it for photos you can see how versatile a tool it really is. I do still use Illustrator for what little vector work I do and InDesign is my preferred method of documentation layout so the rest of the design suite is still handy to have.

That said I do think the OP needs to figure out exactly what he plans to do with the software. With the 30-day free trial and some dedication I think that's going to be the best option to really decide if Photoshop is needed. You may want to check out Photoshop Elements as it is still a great tool for photos, just not as versatile as the full version for other work.

I second GIMP, it is a fantastic program for being freeware. And of course my only option on Ubuntu

[stiltman]

I was thinking the same thing Win9x or XP???????
Then I got to thinking, maybe he has a win9x computer for Internet.

Other than that, I was going to Post earlier on, Photoshop 6 and up CS4 require at least XP

[ocgw]

Adobe Lightroom is my fav image editor, it is much cheaper than Photoshop, I only use Photoshop for "air brushing"

Adobe Lightroom is way better than freeware, but isn't too complicated

ocgw

peace

[vhelp]

Sorry if I confused anyone. This is definately for my XP Home Edition system. But, I am re-thinking my needs with the adobe choices for now. Thank you all for your helpful tips and advices.

-vhelp 5233

[kimco52]

I use the Master Collection because I use some of the programs from both suites.....Of course, the video ones, but also Adobe Flash and Dreamweaver for web stuff. Master collection made more sense.

If you are a student at a credible place....High School, Community College, College, .... you more than likely qualify for a student rate which is extremely cheaper. Details are on the Adobe site. Or if your kids are students, they can get it.

[rallynavvie]

I use the Master Collection because I use some of the programs from both suites.....Of course, the video ones, but also Adobe Flash and Dreamweaver for web stuff. Master collection made more sense.

In addition to being horrifically expensive (albeit large savings over purchasing separate). I haven't upgraded to Master Suite from my CS3 bundle at home which was fortunate because work ended up providing me a copy for both home and work. Otherwise I'd probably not be moving to CS4 versions.

The Education discount also applies to teachers IIRC.

[kimco52]

The reason I have CS4 is for HD in Premiere, otherwise, I am doing just fine with the suite of CS3. Premiere does h.264 and multicam in this version but I am not really using CS4 until I upgrade my computer. Upgrade was a good price.

[lordsmurf]

I could not function without Photoshop.

[vhelp]

eddv, I don't think I want illustrator..i'm pretty sure its photoshop that I want!

. . .

Up to now, I wasn't sure if I should get CS4, but now I'm thinking I should. Pain Shop Pro is not what I want, I thought it was closest to CS4, but it is more a toy (no affense, Corel) but it does not give you the craft man's "tool(s)" to do the job. It (along with other spin-offs) are more or less, front-ends to the "guts" of what CS4 can and does offer. I mean, I don't want a "template" to update colors or levels or what-haveyou. I want the tools and funtions that a craftmen uses to build his art.

Paint shop pro, adobe elements, ..these < $99 packages are nothing more than front-ends or templated builds from the original mold. I want to build things from the ground up. Learning how to and the why tos are all a part of that, too. front-ends / Templates doesn't fully give you that, only half.

So, I can tell that I'm going to really love CS4, period. The more I read into it the more exciting I get over it.

Just today, I went to my bookstore, (B&N) and sat down for several hours reading some more. I ended up making a good purchase on a $54 book that ended up costing me $32, if I were in the book club, I'd'ove save even more. So I walked out with a < 700 page book plus DVD w/ tutorial demos and photos, etc. so i can read at my leasure instead of sitting somewhere's else once a week. Its a great book, and i'll prob be bringing it to work with me.

Lots of great things to learn in this hobby. I may consider taking a course if available in my area, prob in white plains since that is where most of the schools are, I think. I'll have to look it up when I find the time.

-vhelp 5235