Confused about capturing VHS source to PC

[nomad2224]

I am learning (slowly) about capturing VHS to my PC so I can edit and burn to DVD and I've been shopping around for a video capture device or a capture card. Talking about this with some people at my work, a guy mentioned that I "don't have to bother with a video capture device or card" and that I could just use a "screen capturing program like Camtasia" to save the video playback from my screen to a file. Something about this doesn't sound right for the task I am trying to accomplish (VHS to DVD). I don't know if he's experienced with digital video capturing or production (I don't think he is), but I explained to him that first of all, my PC would have to support a RCA composite connection (or RCA to USB - which is in fact a video capture device I believe) for the audio and video in order to even playback the VCR's output on my monitor. But thinking about it, wouldn't this in fact work? I'm not sure, hence my confusion. I've never come across that technique of video capturing in my reading on the topic so far, but I am assuming that software screen capturing and actual video capturing with a hardware device are two different methods with different purposes altogether.

Anyways, I'm a little confused about how to proceed, I would appreciate light shed on the topic.
Thanks

[jagabo]

a guy mentioned that I "don't have to bother with a video capture device or card" and that I could just use a "screen capturing program like Camtasia" to save the video playback from my screen to a file.

No, you need a capture device.

[lordsmurf]

Sorry, but the "guy" doesn't know what he's talking about.
You must have a capture device.

You can learn a lot about this process both here
https://www.videohelp.com/capture
https://forum.videohelp.com/capturing-f2.html
https://forum.videohelp.com/restoration-f43.html

and over at
http://www.digitalfaq.com/guides/video/index-record-capture.htm
http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/forumdisplay.php/dvd-project-help-9.html

All the info is there. Read it. Ask questions as needed.

[DB83]

'Camtasia' is a screen 'capture program. For that to work you need a method to get your video on to a PC screen. There is no such input on a standard video card.

Some video cards such as the 'All-in-wonder' series double up as video cards and capture cards. And once you have a capture card you would not use such an archaic method anyway.

[nomad2224]

Is using a screen capture program therefore a "hack" way of getting external video onto your hard drive without having to go through an actual capture card? Would this even work and if so, why wouldn't more people be using this method of video capture? I can see the traditional function of screen capturing software (Tutorials, presentations, etc...) but if I wanted to get that content onto DVD, wouldn't it be the proper software to use for such a workflow? What makes it inadequate for capturing external video like that from a VHS cassette? Sorry, but I'm just trying to wrap my head around this...I can't see the difference.

[jagabo]

Is using a screen capture program therefore a "hack" way of getting external video onto your hard drive without having to go through an actual capture card?

No. There is no way to get the video onto your screen without a capture card.

[nomad2224]

No. There is no way to get the video onto your screen without a capture card.

So basically, once you're using a capture card to bring the video up on the screen, the correct method of saving it into the computer is to use video capturing software as opposed to a screen capture app. But can't a screen capture app do the same thing (and avoid all the drop frames and audio sync issues). If it plays back fine on the screen, wouldn't a screen cap program be more efficient?

[Gavino]

What makes it inadequate for capturing external video like that from a VHS cassette? Sorry, but I'm just trying to wrap my head around this...I can't see the difference.

The difference is that a screen capture program can only capture what is on the screen. It has no connection to the outside world.

So you need a physical connection to get the video off the tape and into your computer - a capture device.
Once it's on your computer, you could show it on the screen and capture it again with Camtasia, but that would be rather foolish as you've already got it!

[pinetop]

If you goal is to create a DVD, the easy route would be to just buy a DVD recorder. You could buy a Toshiba R410 for around $90.00 and be done, provided your VHS collection is in good condition.

[DB83]

Even with a screen capture program you could still experience dropped frames.


The process is VCR >> Capture Device >> Capture Software (Not Screen Capture software - although you now see the video on your screen it is not being captured from there) >> HDD

[Nelson37]

Screen capture progs are not designed to conform to DVD specs in terms of framerate, resolution, encoding, etc. As mentioned, in order to even attempt to use one of these for VHS capture, you would have to have a card to accept the VCR input, which would be a capture card.

Playing such video full-screen puts more strain on the PC, making dropped frames more likely rather than less.

Now assuming all else was OK, and ignoring the format issues raised in the first paragraph, I suppose you could do it that way, but I wouldn't.

The capture device will have software designed to record to DVD spec, and to work more efficiently with the card.

I read somewhere that the very earliest DVD rippers actually worked that way, but very quickly such process was abandoned for better methods.

You should show the guy who mentioned this to you some Shinola, and have him study it carefully.

[nomad2224]

Ok, well I understand now that the way to go, at least if I want to bring the VHS video into the PC is to bring it in through a capture device and specialized capturing software using DVD specs. But at least now I can resolve in my mind that using a screen capturing program, although possible, is not the recommended way to do it. I would still like to know more about why this is true, though, and I can see now why the guy who told me about "using screen cap software", not being experienced in digital video, would think that this would work.

[nomad2224]

If you goal is to create a DVD, the easy route would be to just buy a DVD recorder. You could buy a Toshiba R410 for around $90.00 and be done, provided your VHS collection is in good condition.

I am considering this too, although I think I might want to edit the video or add some menu's, in which case it would be necessary to import into the PC.
Do straight transfers from VHS to a DVD recorder really come out well? I know that's a loaded question for another thread but if you or anyone knows a link to more info it would be much appreciated.

[victoriabears]

How many vhs's have you got to transfer and how much time do you want to give to the project?

I have over 600 vhs's and first off I have never found pc capture to be as good as a dvd recorder, although I acknowledge it could be better with a lot of learning and effort, my vhs's are also in very good shape-that helps a lot.

Depending on the number of vhs tapes, i can suggest a dvd recorder for canada

[familyguy.68]

for the VHS is the Macrovision (copyguard) a problem? I purchased the DVD EZMaker USB Gold which is straight usb for the video and audio (should not have problems with "out of sync" audio/video) but have not tried it yet, I do have a spare dvd recorder in closet somewhere, anyone tried a usb capture devise for VHS movies, wife has Highlander movie series and The Last Don movies on VHS and have not found them on dvd, thought try VHS to DVD

[pinetop]

If you goal is to create a DVD, the easy route would be to just buy a DVD recorder. You could buy a Toshiba R410 for around $90.00 and be done, provided your VHS collection is in good condition.

I am considering this too, although I think I might want to edit the video or add some menu's, in which case it would be necessary to import into the PC.
Do straight transfers from VHS to a DVD recorder really come out well? I know that's a loaded question for another thread but if you or anyone knows a link to more info it would be much appreciated.

I would use a DVD recorder to transfer the VHS to DVD, then use that DVD with your choice of editing/authoring software on a PC.
A capture card and a worn VHS tape could lead to a wealth of issues, dropped frames, audio sync. I have done my share of VHS transfers both capture cards and DVD recorders. The best choice is the recorder.

[jagabo]

for the VHS is the Macrovision (copyguard) a problem?

Yes. Many devices, both DVD recorders and computer capture cards, will refuse to record Macrovision protected VHS tapes. And false Macrovision detection is sometimes a problem on non protected tapes. A video "stabilizer" between the VHS deck and recording device will usually be enough to allow recording. You may need a full frame time base corrector in some cases.

To get the best results from VHS tapes you need to invest in several hundred dollars worth of equipment. You need an SVHS deck with line time base corrector and noise filtering, a video processing amp, and a full frame time base corrector. Some DVD recorders have a built in line TBC. That can help a lot with MPEG encoding:

https://forum.videohelp.com/topic369003.html#1975151

[bendixG15]

To get the best results from VHS tapes you need to invest in several hundred dollars worth of equipment. You need an SVHS deck with line time base corrector and noise filtering, a video processing amp, and a full frame time base corrector.

But many of us just need acceptable results because we don't wish to invest the time or money to achieve the best.
And you can achieve acceptable results with say a hundred dollars or so for a capture card and some software, free or otherwise.

Also, once you move all your tapes to DVDs, what do you do with all that equipment ?
Took me 2 years to do the transfer, now I'm done. No more tapes to transfer to DVD.

[jagabo]

But many of us just need acceptable results because we don't wish to invest the time or money to achieve the best.

Obviously.

once you move all your tapes to DVDs, what do you do with all that equipment ?

Sell it at the same place you bought it -- ebay!

[pinetop]

for the VHS is the Macrovision (copyguard) a problem? I purchased the DVD EZMaker USB Gold which is straight usb for the video and audio (should not have problems with "out of sync" audio/video) but have not tried it yet, I do have a spare dvd recorder in closet somewhere, anyone tried a usb capture devise for VHS movies, wife has Highlander movie series and The Last Don movies on VHS and have not found them on dvd, thought try VHS to DVD

I've used my Hauppauge WinTV-PVR USB2 device to copy macro protected tapes without any problems.

[zoobie]

another option is to just pitch the VHS out altogether...especially if you have a subscription to netflix

copying vhs to dvd simply wasn't worth my bother, time, or $.
I just ordered the netflix dvd movies again and spent a whole 13 cents copying them to blanks with a superior PQ as another bonus

[DB83]

Ok, well I understand now that the way to go, at least if I want to bring the VHS video into the PC is to bring it in through a capture device and specialized capturing software using DVD specs. But at least now I can resolve in my mind that using a screen capturing program, although possible, is not the recommended way to do it. I would still like to know more about why this is true, though, and I can see now why the guy who told me about "using screen cap software", not being experienced in digital video, would think that this would work.

The best way for you to find this out is to try it yourself.

1. Get a trial version of a screen capture program
2. Configure it (if you can) to record at full dvd specs.
3. Record a video from an on-line source (eg youtube) at full screen (dvd size)
4. watch in amazement as your final video looks nothing like what you saw - jerky video and out of sync audio to start.

Now there is another issue when trying to use a screen capture program.

you probably have some video on your hdd. Play that and try your screen capture program to record it. And ask yourself why you now see a green screen where the video was. The answer is that several of the capture programs cannot handle video overlays which is how video is usually displayed on your monitor.

As I said, a capture device is not recording off the screen. Your capture program is displaying the video stream as it passes through the device and is capturing that.