Adobe Premiere H.264 Encoding

[Priapism]

Okay I tried to extract your notes from your first suggestions, and put together the settings.

MULTIPLEXER
* Multiplexing: TS
* Bitrate Type: Constant
* Mux Rate [kbps]: 0
* Video Buffer Size [kB]: 0
* Audio Buffer Size [kB]: 4
VIDEO
* Codec: MainConcept H.264 Video
* TV Standard: NTSC
* Frame Dimensions 1920x1080
* Frame Rate: 29.97
* Field Order: Upper (changed this from Lower to Upper)
* Pixel Aspect Ratio: Widescreen 16:9
* Profile: High
* Level: 4.1
* Bitrate Encoding VBR, 2 Pass
* Target Bitrate: 30.37 (i have no idea what to set this at so i just kicked it up to 30.37) Suggestions?
* Max Bitrate: 35 (i have no idea what to set this at so i just kicked it up to 35 from 25) Suggestions?
* Set Keyframe Distance: No
* Macroblock Adaptive Frame-Field Coding: No
AUDIO
* Format: Dolby Digital
* Codec: Dolby Digital
* Audio Layer: Dolby Digital Stereo
* Frequency 48kHz There doesnt seem to be an option to change this kHz to anything else
* Bitrate: 192 kbps

Here is the resulting file. Quality is extremely nice.
Explain this to me - why does this file have jumpy video with pauses and slight hesitations when I play it in Windows Media PLayer, but when I uploaded it to youtube that was fixed?
http://www.randomstufff.com/dev/youtube01.m2t
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pv2yGzrs7kQ&fmt=22
(obviously color depth isnt as good, and its not as sharp but there are no "jumps)
(PS ... yes youtube accepts m2t files)

[Priapism]

Note: though the video on my hard drive looks MTS original quality now, the end result on YouTube doesn't look as good as the original MTS file did on Youtube.

Trying your second youtube suggestion next...

-P-

EDIT - im out of my mind. The video on my hard drive does not look MTS quality.

[aedipuss]

this is what i would upload to youtube from your camera. i used vegas pro9 but the settings should be able to be duplicated in pp.

General
Complete name : H:\temp\clip.mp4
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID : mp42
File size : 3.52 MiB
Duration : 5s 5ms
Overall bit rate : 5 896 Kbps
Encoded date : UTC 2009-08-27 02:58:00
Tagged date : UTC 2009-08-27 02:58:00

Video
ID : 2
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : Baseline@L3.1
Format settings, CABAC : No
Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames
Muxing mode : Container profile=Unknown@0.0
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 5s 5ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 5 764 Kbps
Width : 1 280 pixels
Height : 720 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 29.970 fps
Resolution : 24 bits
Colorimetry : 4:2:0
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.209
Stream size : 3.44 MiB (98%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2009-08-27 02:58:00
Tagged date : UTC 2009-08-27 02:58:00

Audio
ID : 1
Format : AAC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec
Format version : Version 4
Format profile : LC
Format settings, SBR : No
Codec ID : 40
Duration : 4s 992ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 128 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Resolution : 16 bits
Stream size : 78.0 KiB (2%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2009-08-27 02:58:00
Tagged date : UTC 2009-08-27 02:58:00

clip_rendered_in%20vegas_pro9.mp4

[poisondeathray]

You're still uploading interlaced, that's probably why it's not crisp (well that and the 10x reduction in bitrate!)

Just imagine a 192kbps mp3, re-encoded to 20kbps...how would it sound?

Your content has shaky , non-tripod filmed motion, so don't expect it to compress very well when capped to 2Mbps

[aedipuss]

sorry for some reason vhelp wouldn't upload the clip until i changed it's name.

[Priapism]

Here are the settings based on your 2nd set of suggestions:

MULTIPLEXER
* Multiplexing: TS
* Bitrate Type: Constant
* Mux Rate [kbps]: 0
* Video Buffer Size [kB]: 0
* Audio Buffer Size [kB]: 4
VIDEO
* Codec: MainConcept H.264 Video
* TV Standard: NTSC
* Frame Dimensions 1280x720
* Frame Rate: 59.94 (29.97 was not an option, only 23.97, 24, and this one)
* Field Order: Progressive (changed this from Upper)
* Pixel Aspect Ratio: Widescreen 16:9
* Profile: High
* Level: 4.1 (4.2 was not an option, only 4.0 and 4.1)
* Bitrate Encoding VBR, 2 Pass
* Target Bitrate: 20.27 (with your settings it automatically set it higher, so I went with 20. Could have gone up to 35
* Max Bitrate: 35 (just went highest on this for no good reason)
* Set Keyframe Distance: No
* Macroblock Adaptive Frame-Field Coding: No
AUDIO
* Format: Dolby Digital
* Codec: Dolby Digital
* Audio Layer: Dolby Digital Stereo
* Frequency 48kHz 44 isnt an option, youtube seems ok with 48 in my previous test
* Bitrate: 192 kbps

Here is the resulting file. To be honest, comparing to my first clueless tests, I dont see much difference. AME doesn't seem to be able to duplicate the MTS quality, though I realize we're trying to YouTube format this thing...
http://www.randomstufff.com/dev/youtube02.m2t
Here is the resulting file on YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qANfkp8ToKM&fmt=22

[creamyhorror]

Why don't you follow a guide for Premiere encoding? It would solve the miscommunication here and save some time.

[Priapism]

Not really seeing any miscommunication. Im doing exactly as he suggests and identifying down to the minutia all the proper changes.

And if you can show me a guide for premiere encoding that actually bothers to give real life scenarios, ill be elated. All the tutorials Ive seen just rattle through things with no explanation. "Click here, choose this, and ... encode!"

[poisondeathray]

How are you watching the original clips? What software? or hardware?

If you are bob-deinterlacing (double rate), it's going to look 2x smoother. Youtube doesn't accept 59.94fps to my knowledge, but it looks much much better

[aedipuss]

did you examine the rendered video of yours i posted? youtube is fairly basic in what they are looking for. to get the HD video link you should upload 1280x720p at a bitrate around 5-6mbps with aac or mp3 audio. 44.1 or 48khz is ok.

[poisondeathray]

The settings I wrote down earlier work for me, are you sure you have all updates? Is this a trial version or the registered version? The are basically the same as aedipuss' above , but a bit higher quality for profile

[Priapism]

I think the last one is about as good as ill get. Ill try the other guys suggestion above as well, but these videos look pretty decent. Not sure if I can do much better on YouTube for now. Im going to stick with that last one and save those settings. If anyone has any specific tweeks you can suggestion, lemme know.

[Priapism]

Youtube doesn't accept 59.94fps to my knowledge, but it looks much much better

The last settings above are at 59 and they uploaded to youtube fine.

There is a link on the post showing the resulting youtube vid

[creamyhorror]

* Frame Rate: 59.94 (29.97 was not an option, only 23.97, 24, and this one)

That's 60fps, which results in smoother but much larger video which is harder to play back. If you're uploading to Youtube it shouldn't really matter I guess.

I don't understand why it doesn't let you output 30fps.

Here is the resulting file. To be honest, comparing to my first clueless tests, I dont see much difference. AME doesn't seem to be able to duplicate the MTS quality, though I realize we're trying to YouTube format this thing...

The video is high-motion and shaky like PDR said, so Youtube's re-encoding isn't going to look like the flower video no matter what you do.

Not really seeing any miscommunication. Im doing exactly as he suggests and identifying down to the minutia all the proper changes.

I mean things like making sure your video is deinterlaced and 2-pass, etc. All that would be specified in a guide I'm guessing.

I'll deinterlace/encode your original clip to see how good it looks when done with a good deinterlacer.

[Priapism]

Thanks man!

Ill do some more youtube uploads on these last settings so you guys can evaluate them. Bear with me ...

Ill try and find some that dont have as much swinging around going on

[creamyhorror]

Clip upped:

Link (ignore the green line at the bottom, I forgot to crop it off before resizing)

youtube.m2t, from Premiere



deinterlaced with NNEDI2



I think the difference is quite plain, even though the frames aren't matched. Zoom in 2x and see for yourself.


edit: to be fair, the NNEDI2 image is before lossy encoding. Encoding it with x264 at the same bitrate results in a minor quality loss:

deinterlaced with NNEDI2, encoded with x264 at similar bitrate to youtube.m2t

[Priapism]

Think that improvement will carry over into a youtube upload?

By the way - a one full minute video clip at the last settings i identified above is taking 20 minutes just to encode...

So this isnt gonna fly for very long. I need to speed it up without reducing quality ....

[creamyhorror]

Think that improvement will carry over into a youtube upload?

No, Youtube completely degrades the quality of mostly anything. Upload whatever you want to Youtube, it'll end up looking mostly the same.

By the way - a one full minute video clip at the last settings i identified above is taking 20 minutes just to encode...

It would take about half the time if you switched to 30fps (which is all that is practical for Youtube anyway). I'm not sure why you can't.

My render is pretty darn slow also, but at least it looks good.

[Priapism]

1440x1080 chosen and the 30fps option appears in the dropdown, with no option for 60fps.

1280x720 chosen and the 30fps option disappears, while the 60fps appears.

I'm now terrified to ask for 1, 2, 3, 4 step by step instructions on how to go about deinterlacing with Avisynth .... this process is beyond complex.

[creamyhorror]

Avisynth won't be any faster than Premiere, even if its output is better. If you're satisfied with the output from Premiere, you could just stick with it.

What you should do, though, is find a way to export at 30fps. Exporting at 60fps is pointless when the camera shoots at 30fps anyway. I found a post on another site that says:

I am glad to say that I have solved the problem, which wasn't really even a problem but a wrong setting buried inside of the encoder of Premiere/Encore.

First, there still appears to be no 720p 29.97fps/30fps blu-ray setting. Maybe this is not an issue, maybe it is, but you cannot author a blu-ray project in encore in this setting. THere is only 23.97fps and 59.97fps both of which are progressive. There is a 3rd setting that says 29.97i but as soon as you select it the project resolution goes to 720x480....weird. So I can only use the other 2, which neither fits directly. I was using the 59.97 setting to encode my .m2v file from Premiere Pro Cs3.

So it looks like in Blu-ray mode Premiere doesn't export at 30fps. Don't know about the reasoning for that, I'm not knowledgeable about Blu-ray.

[aedipuss]

premiere has an h264 preset you should be using to make youtube vids.





the output is like this.



sequence%2001.mp4

[Priapism]

Well my goal was this:

1) Uploaded raw MTS file and it looked awesome on YouTube, but sound and video eventually sputtered out.

2) I figured if I created a more youtube friendly version of it (like M4V file), I'd get equal quality on Youtube without the sputter.

3) And I figured if I had an MTS quality file to upload, it would look as good as the MTS I uploaded to YouTube.

4) But I have failed to create an M4V file with Premiere that looks as good as the MTS file.

Then again maybe that MTS youtube vid isnt all that amazing.
Here is a comparison between the MTS and the Premiere version.
Both on YouTube.

Can you do a frame comparison and tell me if one is better?

Here is the raw MTS file on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuzcUMfXOhg&fmt=22
Here is a premiere duplication file on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ec2_l5poYiI&fmt=22

-P-

[aedipuss]

sorry it looks better if i had set the framerate to the proper 29.97p, instead of 24p.



sequence%2001_1.mp4

[Priapism]

premiere has an h264 preset you should be using to make youtube vids.

Looks like you skipped the first 25 posts in this thread. Been there, done that.

And the quality of your samples is very poor compared to the original

Do you see how it sputters and halts? Thats my first problem, first post. We've worked through that, resolved it, and ive come to the conclusion that premiere can't create MTS quality duplications. Just like they told me.

[creamyhorror]

premiere has an h264 preset you should be using to make youtube vids.

Hmm, why is it better to limit the bitrate to 6Mbps? Can't Youtube take more? Does it choke?

edit: Also, Youtube likes 29.97fps, so there's no reason not to use it.

[aedipuss]

premiere has an h264 preset you should be using to make youtube vids.

Looks like you skipped the first 25 posts in this thread. Been there, done that.

Do you see how it sputters and halts? Thats my first problem, first post. We've worked through that, resolved it, and ive come to the conclusion that premiere can't create MTS quality duplications. Just like they told me.

what's your problem with the preset? it's no worse looking than your source video.

sputters and halts???? not at all here. download mine and if it does that on your system, it's not the video.

[Priapism]

LOL!!! Its way worse. Your result video has terrible color depth, and it sputters and halts, and its not as clear. I got better results with my listed examples above. You missed a ton of troubleshooting and error fixing.

And why do you keep saying to use a preset? If you read the posts before these, Presets are what i was using. I even listed four of them I tried. We then tweaked the presets to provide a better result. You're kinda interrupting this thread.

Cream can you do a comparison of the two youtubes above? I dont want to lose track of where we were.

[aedipuss]

LOL!!! Its way worse. Your result video has terrible color depth, and it sputters and halts, and its not as clear. I got better results with my listed examples above. You missed a ton of troubleshooting and error fixing.

And why do you keep saying to use a preset? If you read the posts before these, Presets are what i was using. I even listed four of them I tried. We then tweaked the presets to provide a better result. You're kinda interrupting this thread.

Cream can you do a comparison of the two youtubes above? I dont want to lose track of where we were.

your system must be running on a pentium 2 if it can't play the video i uploaded without sputtering.

[Priapism]

Or maybe, ive been encoding videos all evening, so my computer is boiling hot and slowing down. Could you do me a favor and read this thread from start to finish first? I dont see how your suggestion is an improvement on what we've already spent 3 hours doing. If I missed something obvious like the fact that premiere has presets, please let me know, but I thought we hit that in the first 4 posts.

[Priapism]

By the way, are you saying your video clip is equivilent in quality to the MTS file I linked people to in previous posts? Thats my source file. I dont think they're even comparable.