Filter out the terms Newbie and Pro from thread titles

[Supreme2k]

Can we blacklist this word already?

I haven't seen it yet where the question wasn't posted in the Newbie section. It completely redundant and has nothing to do with the actual question. Most of the time, it's not even "Newbie question about (creating DVDs/Conversion/etc.)", it's just "Newbie question here"

Same with Pro. "I need help help from a pro." Really? What if another newbie knows the answer? Are you going to refuse it because you are specifically asking for pros?
Also, Pro means Professional, which is defined as "following an occupation as a means of livelihood". Does that mean that you are only seeking people who want pay for the answer to your question?

Even worse is "Newbie question for pros"


I could go on and on about thread titles like "I NEED HELP!!!", but these two would be a great place to start.


It's not simply that I'm ranting or complaining. I'd really like to help more people, but if I have limited time, I'll skip over the ones that don't have a question, and move right on to the ones that I can answer.
Say I'm an audio "pro". If I'm skimming the front page, would I be more inclined to stop at "Please help a newb!" or "How do I turn a stereo track into mono?" The answer won't surprise you.

[G)-(OST]

"I need help from a professional newbie"

[edDV]

Wade in if you have valid input but if they want to know the proven technique request a "pro" solution. Problem is those techniques are low risk but likely to be expensive. Just know the difference.

You can request "pro" when it needs to be done right at low risk.

Or, you can ask for what might work when I have no money to spend and have patience to try what you can give me.

Or, you can ask for what the other consumers are doing?

The worse case is asking for LucasFilm or CSI effects. It is possible to explain how they did it but not how the home gamer can repeat the effect with no budget. Similar to asking an audio producer why can't my garage band sound like Michael Jackson.

[redwudz]

We have the rule:

Try to choose a subject that describes your topic.
Please do not use topic subjects like Help me!!! or Problems.

It's up to a Mod to interpret if the subject title is in violation. New members don't seem to read the rules that much anyway and creating more rules won't help much, IMO. Best just to ignore titles that you don't like.

[Supreme2k]

Maybe "ban" isn't the exact term. "Filter" is probably what should be used. Just as some boards have swear filters, maybe a word filter on the title. I know that it is available.

Again, not just to complain about those two terms, but to help these people help themselves. Kind of like how when you sign up on some sites, they show you the strength of your password as you type it in. Just as one of those might display "That password is not secure. Please enter at least 12 characters and 1 number.", the flag could respond with "Newbie and pro are not relevant in the title."


edDV, I think you may have stumbled in the wrong thread. Were you responding to this?

[edDV]

edDV, I think you may have stumbled in the wrong thread. Were you responding to this?

It had context. Bottom line there are many ways to solve a problem based on goals and start conditions. Pros usually have the advantage with better quality going in and better equipment to recover from mistakes.

[Supreme2k]

Seriously? You're going with that?

Your post neither had real context, nor did it even factor in what has already been said. Goals have nothing to do with who you are or whom you are asking, but everything about how you ask. "Newbie needs help" tells us absolutely nothing about any "goal".

Bottom line, like most things on message boards, the "pro" part can not and will not be proven. It ultimately comes down to taking a suggestion, trying it and seeing if it works. Pros are not going to answer a question just because someone posted "Pros only" as the title. As a matter of fact, it may guarantee that a pro doesn't answer.

[Des]

I understand Supreme 2k's point regarding the use of 'pro' in message responses, but I feel that 'newbie' is still relatively valid, if only because it gives the respondant some insight when answering to keep the help in more 'lay terms' than 'technical terms.'

EX: "I'm a newbie, what is the easiest way for me to achieve ..x" clearly sets up the need to be brief and simple.

I agree as far as needing an answer from 'A Pro' is a somewhat biased. Personally I'll take an answer from anyone who can identify with and help with a problem I might be having, pro or othewise.

EX (from real life): I am a Photoshop pro, my wife is a Photoshop newbie. 9 times out of 10 she is not looking for pro answers from me; she simply wants answers that will meet her needs.

--dES

[Supreme2k]

I feel that 'newbie' is still relatively valid, if only because it gives the respondant some insight when answering to keep the help in more 'lay terms' than 'technical terms.'

EX: "I'm a newbie, what is the easiest way for me to achieve ..x" clearly sets up the need to be brief and simple.

You are partially correct. My premise is not to use "newbie" in the title. Your example is better than the "help! I'm a newb!" that has cropped up more frequently lately.

It is much more efficient to ask "How do I rip this DVD?", then in the actual post, start with "I am a complete newbie at this. I bought my first DVD burner today." That would at least give the people who have knowledge of a specific area an actual question to answer. The same could go for the "pro" titles. "I am a newbie, be gentle" and "Seeking help from pros" are not really questions. If you need your oil changed on your car, you do not ask random people "Where do I find a pro?" or "Hello. I don't know anything." You would simply ask "Where can I get my oil changed/how do I change my oil?", then elaborate.

[stiltman]

I .

I think you need to update you name to SupremeVista or Supreme7....
Why get stuck in the past

[Des]

You are partially correct. My premise is not to use "newbie" in the title. Your example is better than the "help! I'm a newb!" that has cropped up more frequently lately.

I misunderstood a little. Now that I understand, I agree with you.
Clarity in the title is a must. I can live with 'help a newbie set up a hometheater,' but the titles that are 'I'm a newbie'
and then expect me to click on the topic to figure out what they want I skip over.

Recomending, to the public, the curtosy of clarity is something I am always in favor of!

--dES

[edDV]

I give more fundamentals in a response to a "newb" or "newbie". If the question comes from someone that shows familiarity with the issue, the answer can be short and to the point.

[jagabo]

Ban the terms Newbie and Pro from thread titles

Jeez! Find something more serious to worry about. Let's ban the word "ban" from thread titles.

[Supreme2k]

Could you guys please not post in this thread if you have nothing on-topic to add? This is a serious topic and not for OT jokes. Now that I don't have the threat of unwarranted retaliatory warnings or banning hanging over my head, I can actually have a decent discussion here.

jagabo, you tell me what constitutes "serious". Is placing Chinese subs in a movie "more serious"? Not to me, since it would be useless for my needs. How about ripping a disc? Should all posts be run by you to see if they are serious enough?
Who said that I am worried? I'm just making a suggestion. In other words, providing Feedback.

edDV, you still don't get it. Nothing is stopping them from fully explaining that they're newbies or need pro help from within their post. Just because someone doesn't preface their question with "I'm a newb" doesn't mean that they're a pro. You should always try to be as thorough as possible (unless it's a 1 program or 1-click deal).

[bendixG15]

Supreme2K - Looks like your OP has been answered. The fact is that people will post using whatever words and terms they are most comfortable with.

If you get your blacklist okayed, then I want to post mine and will expect to get it approved.

[MOVIEGEEK]

This is a serious topic and not for OT jokes

Lighten up Francis.
As redwudz mentioned it's up to the mods to decide what's appropriate.

[edDV]

There are various ways to describe (segment) the typical "Newbie/General discussions" customer. The way I think about it is:

1. Typical consumer looking to get his equipment working or get a camcorder file to a DVD.

2. HD/Home Theater optimization.

3. Format conversion techie hobbiests

4. Prosumer Producers (high end consumer/low budget pro) looking for technique or picture quality.

5. Novice Pro's - Mostly students with access to high end equipment and software.

Members answer when they have something to contribute. You will find the usual suspects answering questions in the various categories and we all learn from each other.

[Supreme2k]

Supreme2K - Looks like your OP has been answered. The fact is that people will post using whatever words and terms they are most comfortable with.

This isn't Video Conversion or Authoring, where I'm asking a question. I'm opening up a topic for discussion.

In response to "your OP has been answered":

We have the rule:

Try to choose a subject that describes your topic.
Please do not use topic subjects like Help me!!! or Problems.

It's up to a Mod to interpret if the subject title is in violation. New members don't seem to read the rules that much anyway and creating more rules won't help much, IMO. Best just to ignore titles that you don't like.

A rule that goes unheeded is far different from a filter.

If there is a sign on a small sheet of paper that reads "Do not swim in this pool" near an outdoor, unfenced pool, some may heed it and some may not. If that pool is in a locked building, it will deter most people from swimming in it.

Mostly though, it doesn't help anyone when their posts are passed over because they weren't phrased correctly (at all). I'm proposing a way to actually help people. I'm not simply complaining.

If you get your blacklist okayed, then I want to post mine and will expect to get it approved.

Not if it's idiotic or done out of spite.



And don't be just another thread-crapper, Moviegeek. Your so-called answer can be applied to most of your posts too. It's not about "appropriate". It's about helping people to help themselves.

edDV, you continue to be well off topic. It's not about defining the terms. The people asking are self-admittingly using them. It's about taking those terms out of the topic to leave room for the actual question (or to even have an actual question).

Members answer when they have something to contribute.

I beg to differ, especially in this thread.

[filmboss80]

With all due respect to Supreme2k, who has made many great contributions to this site...

This appears to be a one-man crusade for the most part, and I don't think rest of us feel like that sort of censorship is warranted. Sorry.

[edDV]

Well I guess I'm not following you. Got any examples?

The forum is called "Newbie/General discussions" so how is a person describing himself as a "newb" off topic?

As for "pro" I think most mean it as a term of respect for someone with more experience in the subject of question. In some cases they may mean someone who works in the industry.

[stiltman]

Maybe we need to define something here.
Filter

I see this a couple of ways.

1. A user types newbie and the board software filter automatically replaces it with ******* (I had this on my board)

2. A user filters all posts made by another users. This doesn't help in replies, but at least you rid yourself of the original poster

Am I in the ballpark with these definitions with respect of the topic at hand?

[johns0]

Why not just ignore people who post without proper subject headers,they will most likely leave due to not wanting to read anything to help themselves.

[JohnnyMalaria]

[It's not about "appropriate". It's about helping people to help themselves.

The difficulty here is that what you perceive as unhelpful is seen by others as helpful. If a newbie comes to VideoHelp for - well - help then knocking them down at the first step because their title doesn't fit the rules enforced by a non-discriminating robot will leave them with the impression that this forum is pedantic and elitist. This hurts the poster and the forum. It is much more preferable to have a human moderator make the call about the appropriateness of a newbie post.

Just my tuppence.

[Supreme2k]

It is neither a crusade, nor censorship.


It is no more censorship than moving an mp3 topic from Computer to Audio (well, that's segregation, but we won't go there).

This is just a very helpful suggestion. Just like most log-in sites won't let you use a 2 or 3 character password, this would help the "I'm a newbie/Looking for a pro" people not get relegated to the graveyard or perpetual self-bumping (there are a ton of both).

In all honesty, screw 'em. And screw you guys who read my posts in this thread (or don't) and interpret it to mean that I hate certain people. I'm trying to suggest a fix to a system that has a flaw. I know that I would rather be blocked and pointed in the right direction, rather than look like a dumbass (on top of being a newb) later. "Try to choose a subject that describes your topic" could even be "Try to choose a subject that describes your topic (ex. "How do I convert from mpg to avi?")

stiltman,
The user types in "Newbie needs help!" in the title and clicks Submit.
The topic is not posted (the filter catches it), and a warning comes up saying to word the post to include a question relating to the actual problem.

johns0 and others with the same suggestion (even redwudz):
This is not simply a complaint. I am suggesting a way for the posters to NOT be ignored. I already do ignore 90% of them.

JohnnyMalaria, don't be an anti-robite. The AI Anti-Defamation League is watching.

[MOVIEGEEK]

Supreme,
Your question has been done to death(search the forums), no matter what is listed in a forums rules somebody will: (A)not read them or (B)ignore them.
I don't know why you insist on making a crusade out of this but insulting other members doesn't help, my previuos comment was to bring some levity to the discussion so it doesn't get locked.

[stiltman]

stiltman,
The user types in "Newbie needs help!" in the title and clicks Submit.
The topic is not posted (the filter catches it), and a warning comes up saying to word the post to include a question relating to the actual problem.

I doubt this board software is sophisticated enough to do that. It will more than likely need human intervention

[Supreme2k]

Again, how is this a crusade? It's one little suggestion in one topic (that really hasn't been suggested before, forget about "done to death"). You cannot disregard or ignore a rule that is forced upon you, just like the password length for log-in sites.

There are numerous plugins for phpbb (along with the included ones) to achieve this.

While some may see me as "insulting other members", I see it as "responding in kind to insults". I say screw 'em when their only so-called contribution to this thread is "You're on a crusade" or "people can post what they want!"

Before anyone else answers, I urge you to read (or re-read) my very first post in this thread, especially the last part.

[jagabo]

Banning the words newbie and pro isn't going to make anyone post more descriptive titles. "Newbie needs help" isn't any worse than "Beginner needs help", "I need help", or "Need help".

[Supreme2k]

This is how it's done.

[netmask56]

Sometimes posters don't know how to start their question so cliches like "I'm a newbie and.." are simple literary devices that break the ice for the poster and then the ideas sort of flow....

As a subject of Australia and a frequent visitor to North America the problem of the inability of effective communications seems universal to the English speaking world. Banning or filtering doesn't solve these problems - I guess as a 71 year old I've just learned to go with the flow and try to interpret the question as best I can and the OP will save a lot of frustration by directing his objections to our respective national educators... I wouldn't like to see the forum become too rule bound. Many years ago when a new high rise apartment block was built in a Sydney suburb, at the first meeting of the Body Corporate the first rule they passed was "that no rules would be passed beyond what was required by law" !! It is a very happy building where people actually talk to each other.