Should I be concerned after "critical issue" on boot up for XP?

[yoda313]

Ok this is a little unusual. Here's the deal with my XP emachine. The other day the computer was in standby mode. I went to boot it up and it ended up doing a full restart rather than just a wake on. It then had one of those "recovered from error" message and wanted to transmit to microsoft (the "anonymous" reporting stuff). However it didn't send it - I'm betting ms has changed the protocols again.

This evening I booted up the xp machine from a cold start (completely off not in a standby mode). I didn't get any error message this time but the blue halo light around the big "e" power button is blinking. It only blinks when it is standby mode. It is normally a solid full on blue when the computer is on normally.

This is now at least 5 years old I think. I can probably still dig up my original off topic post when i bought the computer for the exact date.

Should I run some agressive defragging and scanning? Is this a precursor to something more dramatic?

Also - would I be able to dig up that error log that xp generates and tries to send to ms?

[minidv2dvd]

the error log is usually in the documents/settings temp file and is erased if not sent.

the blinking light and boot problems doesn't sound good. i'd be backing up anything important and getting ready to re-format. but it may be a motherboard/hardware problem beginning also.

you might try some additional anti-virus type scans too. some recent rootkits are being installed just by visiting infected websites, some that are well known and ignorant of their site being hacked and owned.

avast or gmer may tell you if you have been rootkitted.

[yoda313]

error log is usually in the documents/settings temp file and is erased if not sent.

Well that's ashame. Obviously I shut down after that happened so it probably isn't still there.

As for the second point I am currently running a virus check with nav 2009 with the latest updates.

avast or gmer may tell you if you have been rootkitted.

I'll have to check those out online - never heard of em.

As for backups I do have norton save and restore and did a full back up the other week. Just to be on the safe side I burned a dvd of family pictures this evening so I have a fresher copy available.

but it may be a motherboard/hardware problem beginning also.

If so anyway to further diagnose this issue? I'd hate to have to scrap this pc.

Its a emachine desktop pc with an intel celeron processor (p4 generation). This is an atx case I believe - full height and everything.

If in the end this ends up being a failure waiting to happen it wouldn't be hard to pick a motherboard to fit the case would it? (desktop tower unit).

[RabidDog]

backup everything. Clean all your fans/Fins. Smell the PSU. This is probably just a heat related issue.
Make sure you have at least 10% free space on each hard disc.
I wouldn't worry about any error log. It probably says "pge1 page100 gobbledook.. critical error .. computer shutting down"
XP isn't supported anymore anyway.

[yoda313]

Well its a "new" psu. It was recycled out of my vista pc. That is only two years old or so. I have one of those cable converters because the emachine motherboard uses a different power input connector than my newer vista hp desktop.

Though I'll try that out.

And the next couple of days I'll do the backup more completely. I should do it anyway and this is a good inspiration for it.

[minidv2dvd]

i'd look at the onboard voltage regulator capacitors around the cpu and check for leaks/white crud on their tops. if it were me i'd go the whole new case/psu/m.b/cpu/mem. route.

avast is a free a/v that also finds rootkits, gmer is a dedicated rootkit detector/remover.

[yoda313]

@minidv2dvd - I'm currently running gmer now. Nothing so far. I'm also still running the nav scan.

Well as I said the psu was replaced awhile ago - last year I think.

I guess it seems like I'm a lucky one that my emachine has lasted as long as it has. Aside from the psu and some pci cards and dvd burners its essentially the same stock piece as when i bought. Though I did do a reinstall of the oem xp once.

Edit - and I'm not ready to buy a whole new pc. I would even consider chancing a motherboard swap. Though I probably can't get an identical motherboard. Just something that would fit my celeron chip. I'd have to look into either buying a xp copy on ebay (passed on one at a garage sale again this year - doh!). Or look into maybe getting vista basic if a p4 equivalent celeron 2.66ghz is enough horsepower.

Edit 2 - ouch 200.00 for vista basic at bestbuy? I'd be better off buying a whole new pc with the case and get the os "for free".

Hopefully the pc isn't giving up the ghost. I'll have to let these scans run overnight. In the end if I have to get new hardware maybe I'll consider using some form of linux full time on it. Save the cost. Though this is my extra pc - my dual core amd vista hp is my "main" pc. I'm just hoping the emachine holds awhile longer......

[minidv2dvd]

if gmer doesn't find anything(nothing in red) on it's first pass, there isn't a rootkit on the comp.

what is the old comp used for? if it's not very important in the scheme of things at your house, just re-format and re-install what you have. it'll live as long as it can....

[Dv8ted2]

Edit 2 - ouch 200.00 for vista basic at bestbuy?

Can you say ebay?

[Ozzyjim]

ebay? - do you really trust buying an OS off of ebay?. I have looked at it but after recently buying a sealed boxed copy of Photoshop CS3 Extended that was all sealed, boxed, printed manuals, printed discs etc - IT WAS A FAKE. How many of the XP / Vista discs are going to be fake?

Just my own rant, Have you looked on any forums to see if anybody has suffered the same symptoms as you describe?. It may be a indication as to what the problem is, or there may be some LED's on the mobo that flash a sequence to tell you the problem.

James.

[redwudz]

I don't know that I would panic just yet. It's also possible that's it's a software/firmware problem. I have a couple of PCs that get stuck in 'Standby' on occasion. One of my Vista computers refuses to wake out of standby, though there are no other problems. In my case, it appears to be a driver issue. I rarely use standby, so I live with it.

But I would go ahead and take the precautions mentioned, just in case.

And I doubt MS would be of any help with the problem. But it would be a good idea to capture the error text if at all possible as that might save you a lot of guesswork.

A bit more about 'standby' mode: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_mode You can check which ACPI mode your computer is set for in BIOS. I usually use S3. When the computer shuts down all un-needed peripherals, it may have shut down something needed for wakeup and that can cause a reboot or not waking up. Your PS also has to supply power to the RAM and some chips like the USB or LAN or Modem chips during standby to be able effect a wake up. That's also usually set in BIOS. A failing RAM module may also cause this type of problem if it is used for your mode of standby.

Just another possibility.

[DarrellS]

I never use any power settings on my PCs and was always told not to use any by every geek on the internet that spoke on the subject.

[yoda313]

I got clear results on the virus check and the gmer check so its not that kind of issue thankfully.

Unfortunately that night I had a "windows had a delayed write failed" error message. It was 3 in the morning and I couldn't copy the message fast enough to get the full message written down - ie not thinking clearly.

SInce then the pc has been shut off until this weekend (off today for the 4th ). I may or may not tackle it today.

I'm concerned that this might be a harddrive issue. Fortunately I have a matching capacity 160gb ide drive I bought the other month for my modded xbox project. I never got that working so in the end I might swap the drive out and do a fresh oem install of xp.


@minidv2dvd - the pc in question is mainly a surfing pc. It doesn't really do anything hardcore anymore like video encodes or the like. That is saved for my dual core amd vista pc. This is also connected to my printers in the other room - my vista pc is now back in my tv room connected to my hdtv - which I am typing on right
now


Like I said I'll pop it back on again this weekend and do some more backups - file downloads, my documents, that kind of thing. THen I may just swap drives and pop in the new one and start fresh.

Would it be a good idea to get an external usb enclosure for this? I"m sure its best to get one that does sata and ide drives - they do make combo enclosures don't they?

I"d hate to trash the 160gb that i"m using as my os drive on the emachine thats acting up right now. I just don't want to count on it as a boot drive.

Edit - and whoever was talking about ebay I too share the concern of buying an os copy on ebay. Even if it was legit how can reuse a used xp? Wouldn't the activation code be linked to the other computer or something?

Also can you buy and use a newer upgrade copy of the next version of windows (be it vista or 7) with an oem copy of xp? I don't have a retail copy of xp just the one that came with xp.

[Dv8ted2]

ebay? - do you really trust buying an OS off of ebay?.

Yes, I have bought legitimate versions of Vista on Ebay. Yoda, you can get infected by just surfing. There are tons of sites that will infect you because the ads are infected.

Do you have any way of getting the exact error? That would be more helpful because it would give you a reference point of where to start your troubleshooting.

The error could even be something as simple as replacing the BIOS battery.

[yoda313]

Do you have any way of getting the exact error?

I don't see how.

The error could even be something as simple as replacing the BIOS battery.

Thats not a bad idea.

What do you lose when you get the new batter? Does it default to the original settings? I'd have to switch it to pci for graphics since I have a video card instead of the onboard graphics. Everything else shouldn't be too much of a hassle to reset should it?

They are usually the cr2032 watch type batteries if I remember correctly right?

[minidv2dvd]

delayed write error could be as simple a s a cable going bad, but there are other worse things it could be also, drive, motherboard drive controller, etc.

if it's 5 years old i'd stay with xp, why slow it down with vista. properly updated there's not much bad about xp.

yes you can upgrade oem versions. the only thing you can't do is use it on any other motherboard, it's tied to the first one.

[ChrissyBoy]

"windows had a delayed write failed" error message

I had that a number of years ago. It was a failing drive....

Have a look in the event log (App/Sys) and you may well see an event about the HDD. I did when i got that message.

[minidv2dvd]

if you take out the battery you lose the date/time and custom settings of the bios. the computer will boot and you should get the display to the monitor with the agp card, it just won't be listed as "first" display device.

i'd recommend putting a blank disc in the floppy drive to prevent the computer from booting to windows before you reset the custom bios settings, otherwise windows will have to install/uninstall any devices changed with the reset if you miss the keystroke to get into the bios.

[redwudz]

'Delayed write failed' is most common with external drives, especially USB drives and particularly USB flash drives. It means the communication to the drive was interrupted during writing. If you unplug a flash drive during a write, you will likely see it. It's a bit rare with internal drives and could be controller related, or just a bad cable. I would try replacing the cable first. If it's the controller, try updating the MB drivers and hope it's not a hardware problem.

I would also be a bit suspicious of your power supply, or at least the power cable to the drives. You might do well to reseat all your internal cables, cards and RAM before booting again. I think if the PS itself was the problem, you would have problems with all the drives and other parts of the system.

I used to get it with a external 2.5" USB powered HDD on my laptop. Adding a power supply to the drive seemed to cure it. I suspect the 2.5 HDD used too much power and the MB shut it down. USB devices can use up to 500MA on most MBs. More and they may shut down.

The bad news with that error is there is often data loss or corruption. Have that happen a few too many times and the drive will be so corrupted it's useless. You can also get it with a overloaded USB port when the OS decides to use the port and block other uses.

Probably not related to a BIOS battery. Your PC will run fine without a BIOS battery, but your BIOS will reset to the default settings and the date and time will always be wrong as the clock will reset at each boot.. It usually resets to the date of the MB manufacture, so it's very obvious.

[minidv2dvd]

yoda have you tried reading the s.m.a.r.t. data from the drive? about 2/3 of the time it will predict drive failures. you can use the free smart disc check.

http://www.passmark.com/products/diskcheckup.htm

[yoda313]

Thanks everyone.

I think when I finally get going today I'll head to best buy and pick up a new ide cable. I did twist it a bit when I was fooling around with the xbox harddrive formatting stuff (I had the case open and plugged in the blank drive to format it - it get bent around a bit and might have been too roughed up).

I'll also check out the battery type and pick up a replacement anyway - I'm 99% sure its original as I don't remember replacing it since I bought it so its probably needing a replacement anyway.

Hopefully the powersupply isn't the issue. Though replugging the cables wouldn't hurt. And the only usb drive I have is for backups (an older 160gb western digital - its actually currently unplugged since I moved the desktop around).

EDIT:

I think a found a new problem. I opened the emachine and checked some of the cables. It seems the c drive (the 160gb) has some minor bent pins. I took a flat blade screw driver and nudged them back to straight ever so carefully.

There was still a check drive notice on boot up with windows saying to check for consistency - I bypassed that so I could get to backing up files. I am on the emachine right now.

I may change drives anyway to be on the safe side. I can reload the files and programs later just to be sure.

[Nelson37]

"Delayed write failed" usually refers to a hard drive problem, but there are other possibilities. Replace the cable, at cheap to zero cost this is a no-brainer. At an absolute minimum, remove and replace the connections, making certain to reseat firmly.

I also agree with eliminating all standby settings, just something else to cause a problem. At a minimum, remove them now in order to test this "standby" issue. If possible, test with another power supply. Bad or intermittant power to the HD can cause "delayed write failed".

E-machines often use cheap, abnormally small power supplies. Replacement may be a major issue depending on your case. They also use cheap motherboards which are prone to unusual failures. At five years old, it is about at the end of it's useful life.

[yoda313]

fyi I already replaced the powersupply last year. I used the oem model out of my vista pc that is about two years old.

I will do the harddrive cables and get a new cmos battery.

I am nearly certain I will put in the new harddrive. I don't want any complications.

I am doing a ton of backups now to dvdr. I am backing up my zune collection currently to dl disc (5.5 gbs on this pc alone). Once done I'll get out and get the parts.

EDIT - fyi the disk check program posted earlier gave an all clear. But I think I'll still replace the drive and reinstall a fresh windows xp on the new drive.

EDIT 2 - I got another message now - Corrupt File exception processing message c000102 parameters 756bf7c. Not good I think....

Edit 3 - Ok I got a new ide cable and best buy actually carried it. I also got a new cmos battery - and yes its a cr2032. I got those set up and did some more backups.

Then I decided to go ahead and put in my replacement drive (the 160gb). I plugged it in and popped in my emachine restore disc. It ended up only taking about a half hour to do the format and restore. The format seemed to take almost no time at all. I was backup with a clean windows xp, new harddrive, new battery, new cable and a clean system.

I am slowly beginning the process of restoring everything. That will take some time. But at least I should be error free for awhile. That is assuming this was all a harddrive failure issue.

I have saved the harddrive. I am still considering getting an external drive to utilize it.