Encoding to VP7

[tb582]

What encoders will encode to On2VP7? I've tried super and MediaCoder and no luck.... see my post here about mediacoder:

http://forum.mediacoderhq.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6319

[poisondeathray]

If you mean a front end or GUI, you can use virtualdub or any app that uses vfw as the interface, assuming you have the .dll already

[tb582]

yes I already have the vp7vfw.dll file - Is there a list of apps that use VFW?

[poisondeathray]

I don't know of any current free apps that support vfw, except for virtualdub. There isn't much active development for the old interface

Most of the NLE's eg. vegas, premiere, videostudio will be able to access it as well

I can't think of 1 reason why anyone would use VP7 - way slower to encode & less quality than h.264; encodes result in characteristic oversmoothing even when internal processing is disabled and set to sharp.

[Midzuki]

yes I already have the vp7vfw.dll file - Is there a list of apps that use VFW?

Mencoder

Windows users can use -xvfwopts codec=vp[s:5a28f811b6]6[/s:5a28f811b6]7vfw.dll:compdata=dialog to have the codec dialog display before encoding starts.

[PuzZLeR]

I can't think of 1 reason why anyone would use VP7 - way slower to encode & less quality than h.264;

Add to that, with the exception of a small niche market or two, there is virtually zero support for it. Even its creator, ON2, was starting to believe that and have since introduced an H.264 implementation as well for the other markets.

...[VP7] encodes result in characteristic oversmoothing even when internal processing is disabled and set to sharp.

You know what? I'm starting to believe that about all the latest, and so-called, "modern codecs" along with VP7, which includes H.264, VC-1, RV40, etc. They utilize a variant of some sort of "smart blur" feature, which cleverly reduces bitrates "cosmetically" so you don't notice the lost details as easily. The disguise however starts to fall short on the big screen. Not only have I been horrified by what x264 looks like there, but I can even notice it, although not as apparent, but still there, with blu-ray encoded with even the professional H.264 and VC-1 implementations.

I'm seriously starting to believe the "modern codecs" are overrated.

[poisondeathray]

You know what? I'm starting to believe that about all the latest, and so-called, "modern codecs" along with VP7, which includes H.264, VC-1, RV40, etc. They utilize a variant of some sort of "smart blur" feature, which cleverly reduces bitrates "cosmetically" so you don't notice the lost details as easily. The disguise however starts to fall short on the big screen. Not only have I been horrified by what x264 looks like there, but I can even notice it, although not as apparent, but still there, with blu-ray encoded with even the professional H.264 and VC-1 implementations.

I'm seriously starting to believe the "modern codecs" are overrated.

VP7 and RV40 preprocess with a smoothing filter. But another contributing cause is the deblocking - even at low (even negative) alpha & beta values, there is some blurring and attenuation of sharpness (at low bitrates). RV40 is the worst - at least you can adjust the values or even disable it with h.264

Then I ask: what "non-modern" or "modern" codec at equivalent bitrate conserves more detail than the x264 implementation of h.264 ? I've done 100's of comparisons - I've come to a clear conclusion testing for myself...but maybe you have something else in mind?

[PuzZLeR]

Don't want to hijack this thread since it's about VP7. I will answer lower down in this thread instead.

https://forum.videohelp.com/topic366986.html

[jagabo]

You know what? I'm starting to believe that about all the latest, and so-called, "modern codecs" along with VP7, which includes H.264, VC-1, RV40, etc. They utilize a variant of some sort of "smart blur" feature, which cleverly reduces bitrates "cosmetically" so you don't notice the lost details as easily.

Of course they do. Both spacially and temporally. Reducing intra and inter frame noise is main basis of the additional compression. And along with the noise you lose small details.

[PuzZLeR]

Of course they do. Both spacially and temporally. Reducing intra and inter frame noise is main basis of the additional compression. And along with the noise you lose small details.

Yes indeed. But the compression advantages they offer can be counter productive on the big screen, which is why I believe they're overrated. The lost details reveal in a "blur" and "smear", which is my problem with them.

[jagabo]

The lost details reveal in a "blur" and "smear", which is my problem with them.

I don't care much for the look either. I find you need to stick with CRF 20 or better to get good results. But, unfortunately, I think most people equate lack of noise with quality.