Vista to XP?

[vid83]

I have Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 and I've read that it does not work with Windows Vista.

I am going to buy an HP desktop which ships with Vista.
I am going to buy Windows XP separately.

Can I format the hard drive of the new computer and install XP?

My plan is to get the computer, create a recovery disk for Vista and format the hard drive manually. Then insert the XP disk and install it. If I ever need to go back to Vista, I assume that I just format the drive and insert the recovery disk.

Will this create any problems?
The new computer will have Intel Core 2 Quad processor, 3GB RAM.

If this can be done, should I get 64 bit XP or 32 bit XP?

[serega]

I would download all drivers for Win XP first to save them on CD/DVD then reformat HD. I think 32 bit Win XP compatible with more programs then 64 bit.

[edDV]

I have Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 and I've read that it does not work with Windows Vista.

I am going to buy an HP desktop which ships with Vista.
I am going to buy Windows XP separately.

Can I format the hard drive of the new computer and install XP?

My plan is to get the computer, create a recovery disk for Vista and format the hard drive manually. Then insert the XP disk and install it. If I ever need to go back to Vista, I assume that I just format the drive and insert the recovery disk.

Will this create any problems?
The new computer will have Intel Core 2 Quad processor, 3GB RAM.

If this can be done, should I get 64 bit XP or 32 bit XP?

Call HP and ask. Many new laptops have no XP drivers available. I think Premiere Pro 1.5 might work under Vista's XP compatibility mode. Ask that in Adobe's Premiere Forum or over at CreativeCow..

[redwudz]

Make sure you can get the XP motherboard drivers (32 or 64 bit) or you may have major problems. Most times, I would advise to put in a fresh drive and disconnect or remove the Vista boot drive or just dual boot to Vista and XP with separate drives. Some factory boot drives include a recovery partition and without it, the recovery discs may not work. If you wipe the existing boot drive, you may destroy the recovery partition.

This may not be the case with your setup, but I would make sure first.

How do you know Premier is not Vista compatible? It's listed here on a Vista compatible list: http://iexbeta.com/wiki/index.php/Windows_Vista_Software_Compatibility_List#Video

Adobe
After Effects CS3
Premiere Elements 3.0.2
Premiere Pro 1.5, 2.0
Premiere 2.0, 5.0
Premiere Pro CS3

[vid83]

How do you know Premier is not Vista compatible? It's listed here on a Vista compatible list: http://iexbeta.com/wiki/index.php/Windows_Vista_Software_Compatibility_List#Video

According to the Microsoft Website, Premiere Pro 1.5 is not compatible and it gives a link to the Adobe site where you can get an upgrade to the current version of Premiere.

Going to XP seems like the cheapest option for me.
I have three things that are not compatible and have no drivers to make it compatible: Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5, Adobe Photoshop Elements 3.0, and my Sony voice recorder which I use to record my college lectures.
I can get XP for $179. If I didn't get XP, I would have to purchase all of the above, which would cost me hundreds of dollars.

[edDV]

How do you know Premier is not Vista compatible? It's listed here on a Vista compatible list: http://iexbeta.com/wiki/index.php/Windows_Vista_Software_Compatibility_List#Video

According to the Microsoft Website, Premiere Pro 1.5 is not compatible and it gives a link to the Adobe site where you can get an upgrade to the current version of Premiere.

Going to XP seems like the cheapest option for me.
I have three things that are not compatible and have no drivers to make it compatible: Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5, Adobe Photoshop Elements 3.0, and my Sony voice recorder which I use to record my college lectures.
I can get XP for $179. If I didn't get XP, I would have to purchase all of the above, which would cost me hundreds of dollars.

You could get an upgrade for not much more (even less on ebay) and stay Vista upgraded.

[vid83]

HP told me that I am able to install XP. Just go to bios and switch from SATA1 to IDE and then install XP.
They said I could get Vista (either 32 or 64 bit) and install Windows XP (32 or 64 bit).
They told me that if I wanted to go back to Vista, I could use the recovery CD that I created in Vista prior to going to XP.
I may get 6GB of RAM even though XP supports less (just incase I go back to Vista). XP will just use 3 to 4 GB and not utilize the other 2GB.

Also, I've read that if I got XP, I would have to download XP drivers for my hardware. How do I do this?

[pepegot1]

The XP drivers should be on the XP install disk and be installed during the XP installation. I do not see a problem with this. The computer should work with any OS. Use 32 bit for compatabilty.
If I got a new computer I would format the HD and install Win XP. Get it on Ebay for less.

[edDV]

The XP drivers should be on the XP install disk and be installed during the XP installation. I do not see a problem with this. The computer should work with any OS. Use 32 bit for compatabilty.

You mean the XP disc issued by HP for that model laptop? The specific machine drivers required usually include:

Motherboard
ATA/SATA disk controller
DVD-Writer
Sound chipset
Display chipset
LAN connect
USB2 controller
IEEE-1394 controller

[vid83]

How do I go about finding all the drivers?
Will Windows Updates do this for me?

[buckeyefan]

HP told me that I am able to install XP. Just go to bios and switch from SATA1 to IDE and then install XP.
They said I could get Vista (either 32 or 64 bit) and install Windows XP (32 or 64 bit).
They told me that if I wanted to go back to Vista, I could use the recovery CD that I created in Vista prior to going to XP.
I may get 6GB of RAM even though XP supports less (just incase I go back to Vista). XP will just use 3 to 4 GB and not utilize the other 2GB.

Also, I've read that if I got XP, I would have to download XP drivers for my hardware. How do I do this?



If you are buying an HP you will need to go to their support website, look for your model, and download the drivers for XP. You will also have to go to the website for each peripheral you have (i.e. printer, scanner, camera etc) and download the drivers. It can become a daunting task so I would download all those drivers before you do anything to Vista. Especially if you are thinking XP64. Many manufacturers have Vista64 drivers but not XP64. In general I would recommend staying with 32bit if you have some older software. You might be surprised by other software that will not work on 64 bit.

Also, as one the others stated in this thread, regardless of what HP said, almost all manufacturers put the system image on the hard drive these days. If you wipe it you will not be able to reinstall Vista. You have 2 options. 1) When you install XP don't delete the partition structure of the drive. Simply format the C: drive and install Vista on that drive. That should leave the original Vista Image intact. 2) Buy imaging software like Acronis TrueImage (which in my opinion is a must anyway) and make your own image of the drive before you install XP.

Finally, It is not that XP does not support 6 GB of ram, it is that either 32bit version (XP or Vista) will not support over 3 GB ram. You have to run a 64 bit version of Windows, Vista or XP, to support 4 or more GB of ram. But let me say in my opinion, unless you are doing some sort of virtualization or other ram intensive work you will never need 6GB of ram. Video work, for instance is very processor intensive but not as ram intensive. I am running Vista on a laptop with 3GB of ram and I can do any video work I need to with no ram problems. You could get 4GB incase you did go to 64bit but in my opinion 6GB would be a waste.

To wrap this up. I would recommend XP 32bit with 3 or 4GB ram and the fastest processor you can afford. I would use Acronis TrueImage to make a backup image of the original factory install of the system. Then I could be confident installing whatever I wanted, knowing I could restore that image if I needed to. Hope my rambling helps.

[vid83]

regardless of what HP said, almost all manufacturers put the system image on the hard drive these days. If you wipe it you will not be able to reinstall Vista. You have 2 options. 1) When you install XP don't delete the partition structure of the drive. Simply format the C: drive and install Vista on that drive. That should leave the original Vista Image intact.

I though that the recovery discs (DVD) was meant to be used in place of the recovery partition.

[INFRATOM]

with windows even if you use the recovery you have to activate it again besides the hasstle you have a few times you can activate. Partition the drive and use it as a secondary drive and buy a new HD for XP. With some motherboards if you press F8 it displays the boot order and you can boot into any HD that you want. On one of my computers I can boot into 3 different OS' . I know for the fact ASUS gives you that option by pressing F8.

[buckeyefan]

Vid83

If they give you DVD image of the entire drive that is great. Then you have no problems. The problem is most don't. I have 2 new Laptops both were the same, they gave me restore media but the restore media just was just a pointer to the hard drive image they had made. When I destroyed the hard drive image the media was worthless. That is the way most companies do it today.

Either way, rather than buying a new hard drive just buy Acronis True Image. I am telling you it will make your life worry free. Let’s forget about Vista for a minute. When you go to install XP, partition the drive so you have a C and a D drive. Then after you do a fresh install make a full backup with Acronis. This will insure if you have a problem installing drivers you can restore that original image in 2-3 min rather than reinstalling XP again in 45min. Then when you get all the drivers in and activate make a new image. And make images occasionally throughout the software install process. Then when you are fully installed you can get rid of any images you do not want. I would save the clean activated image, and an image with all your software that does not change. I always then have a final image that also has software that changes on a yearly basis like antivirus software, tax and financial software etc. Then at any time during the year if your system crashes you have something to go back to without reinstalling from scratch. So as you can see it will solve the Vista problem but it will also give you a great backup solution to make life worry free. In my opinion imaging software is a must for everyone. I use to use Norton Ghost but I had too many problems with corrupt images that is why I use Acronis. I don't work for the company I just think it is a great product. Again, hope this helps.

[pepegot1]

edDV

No, I mean an independent copy of Win XP-not Hp's. That's what I may have to do when my current computer needs replacement.
Vista is out of the question. I am not alluding to a Laptop machine, but a desktop one.

[vid83]

Vid83

If they give you DVD image of the entire drive that is great. Then you have no problems. The problem is most don't. I have 2 new Laptops both were the same, they gave me restore media but the restore media just was just a pointer to the hard drive image they had made. When I destroyed the hard drive image the media was worthless. That is the way most companies do it today.

HP used to provide a recovery discs (aka quick restore disc). Now you have to make your own. I think you can either use the recovery CD or the partition. When you first set up your HP computer, you have the option of creating recovery DVDs (3 DVDs) or ordering them.

[vid83]

Ok, I chatted with HP tech support last night.
I asked about installing drivers for XP. The representative asked for my computer model number that I am giong to purchase. He also asked whether I wanted the drivers now. He gave me four links/download page on the HP websites that contain the drivers. The four drivers are LAN, chipset, sound, and I forgot the fourth one. I asked him if the four is all I need and he said yes.

Does this sound right? I only need four drivers?

[buckeyefan]

The fourth is probably the video driver and those 4 may be all you need. Like I mentioned though, look into your peripheral drivers as well. Depending on which way you are going you could run into trouble. I had a Canon scanner and Canon does not offer XP64 drivers so I had to go 32bit. Just to give you an idea here are the drivers I have needed for a desktop and a laptop.

My Desktop: Chipset, LAN, Graphics, Sound, Printer, Scanner, TV Card
My Laptop: Chipset, LAN (Wired and Wireless), Graphics, Audio, Modem, Card Reader, Touchpad, Webcam, Bluetooth

[turk690]

As buckeyefan has said, it's important to distinguish whether any given recovery disk contains a true image of an OS installation or merely points to the hard drive's manufacturer partition where the OS image actually is, tough if you have formatted the lot.
But there us another problem I've encountered with installing XP back on some HP notebooks that came with Vista: the part in the installation process that is supposed to say a hard drive is detected and would you like to format it blah-blah instead says no fixed disk was detected and so installation is aborting! It seems HP, among others, implicitly want to discourage going back to XP by not enabling rudimentary SATA drivers in this manner so that any attempts at deliberate XP installation are futile. To get around this, the key is a USB flash drive or floppy drive, where ACHI and SATA drivers have earlier been downloaded and put on (from the Intel website for that particular chipset, if that, or HP, okay if they're up to it). In the XP installation process where it says "press F6 to load additional drivers, etc." this is where you get those crucial fixed disk drivers to be loaded in the temporary RAM drive XP installation creates so as to even get to the point where the hard drive is indeed recognized and you're given a choice of what to do next.
Some HP models do not want a flash drive, and only USB floppy drives work with this detour. Some Toshiba and Dell laptops also behave like this, not detecting the hard drive in XP installation. All Acer notebooks I have encountered so far (with and without pre-installed Vista) behave properly where XP installation is concerned, that is, the hard drive is recognized as expected and the USB floppy route is never needed (not surprising considering that some Acer models still come ONLY with Linux here in Saudi Arabia, implying that you can put your choice of OS and damn if the HDD is not recognized as is).
The floppy disk still lives, after all.

[vid83]

implicitly want to discourage going back to XP by not enabling rudimentary SATA drivers in this manner so

Not sure if this has anything to do with it but when I was chatting with HP tech suport, he mentioned something about changing SATA1 to IDE in BIOS before installing XP.

[buckeyefan]

Vid83

What turk690 has said about installing XP is correct, except for the fact that you do not have to load the additional drivers, if you are willing to make changes to the bios. In an earlier post you mentioned that HP told you to go to bios and switch from SATA1 to IDE . that will do the same thing but you will loose a modest amount of hard drive speed that way. SATA is a bit faster than IDE in laptops.

Turk690 said "It seems HP, among others, implicitly want to discourage going back to XP by not enabling rudimentary SATA drivers in this manner" I don’t want to be rude but it is not so much that any manufacturer is not enabling SATA it is that Windows XP never had a SATA or an AHCI drivers included that is why you would have to load them the way Turk690 said to if you do not want to change the bios. Vista has SATA and AHCI drivers on the install disks, which is why you don't have to change the bios for Vista. In the case of Acer, I have 2 Acer laptops and the reason you don't have to load AHCI drivers with Acer's is because they come with IDE set as the default. So if you never change it to AHCI you will never have a problem installing XP.

Just to be clear. To install XP you have 2 choices.

1) Change bios from SATA to IDE
OR
2) Load SATA/AHCI drivers durring install the way turk690 stated

[vid83]

Assuming that I can format the recovery partition.
I receive my desktop, create recovery discs and download any drivers to a CD.
I will have my Windows XP 32bit retail CD.
Then what?
What's the next step? Insert XP CD and restart computer?

[buckeyefan]

Assuming that I can format the recovery partition.
I receive my desktop, create recovery discs and download any drivers to a CD.
I will have my Windows XP 32bit retail CD.
Then what?
What's the next step? Insert XP CD and restart computer?

Yes. When the computer restarts hit "delete or F2 for Acer" (don't know what HP uses) to enter the bios. More than likely in your bios you will arrow over to "Main" and look for "SATA Mode" or something similar. Change the option to "IDE Mode". Arrow over to "Exit" and choose "Save changes and Exit"

You also may have to change the boot order in the bios. For some reason many manufacturers set the hard drive as first boot device by default. You may have to set the DVD-RW as the first boot divice and hard drive as the second boot device to be able to install Windows, then "save your changes"

Once the computer restarts windows will boot form the CD and begin to load. When you get to the screen that asks you which partition to install it in you have choices.

1) If you are confident you have solid restore DVD's I would delete all partitions and make 2 new partitions. Just follow the onscreen directions to delete and create partitions. Create a C: partition for Windows of at least 40-50GB (could be larger if you want) Then create a D: with the remaining space (use this for all your documents and files. As much as possible try to keep anything valuable, like documents, pictures and music off the C: drive) Then install Windows XP as normal on the C drive. Simply follow the on screen directions.
OR
2) If you are not confident you have solid restore DVD's when the computer restarts "Do Not Delete Partitions"
When Windows boots simply choose the C: drive to install windows in and when it asks to format choose "quick format NTFS file system" and follow the rest of the onscreen directions.

You should not need step by step directions to install XP, simply follow the onscreen directions. If you do not know an answer, leave the default setting. If you feel you do need step by step directions do an internet search. I am sure you can find them relatively easily. Then print them out before you begin the install.

When the install is finished it will not ask you for the drivers, but if you go to "control panel", "system", "device manager" you will be able to see all the drivers that need to be installed. Put in your disk and start the driver installs. If you are still missing a driver after you have done all four, well, then the fun starts! You will have to figure out what it is and go to the manufacturer’s website to find it. So, hope that helps and good luck.

P.S. One thing to consider. If you are really this unsure about installing XP you may want to consider sticking with Vista and upgrading your software. Vista really isn't that bad (I actually like it) and sooner or later you will probably have to upgrade anyway. A full XP install, updates and installing software can take as long as 8hrs or more. Maybe now is a good time to transition.

[Dv8ted2]

It makes no sense to go back to XP because of one program. It requires more work and more time to wipe out an operating system, install an outdated operating system, and reinstall all programs, when it it would be easier to update one program to go with what you already have.

XP is eight years old, has more security holes than swiss cheese and is on it's way to being discontinued. It is about to enter extended support, which means no bugfixes, and only security patches.

Why create more work, when it is extreme? Replace one program, and you can spend more time enjoying your computer.

A simple google search provided this.

Hi guys,

I recently found a way to make Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 work on Windows Vista. Currently, this application installs ok but hangs on startup.

I am posting this here (for whom it may concern) because I have found no other websites that present a workable solution to this problem, apart from paying lots of money to upgrade to Premiere CS3.

The steps are outlined as follows:
1. Install the latest Windows Updates (particularly ones to do with software compatibility)
2. Rename the program exe to 'Premiere Pro.exe' (read somewhere that this makes it more stable)
3. Delete the 3 GPU plug-ins from the plug-ins folder.
OPTIONAL 4. Set the compatibility mode to Windows XP SP2, although I've found this not to be necessary.

Thanks for reading. I hope this helps anyone who uses this legacy software.

Take care.

Delta.

http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/showthread.php?p=3168444

[vid83]

Dv8ted2,
It is not just one software.
First, it is my Sony voice recorder that I use to record my college lecture. It will not work with Vista and there are no downloads for it. Buying a new recorder would be $150.
I have Adobe Photoshop Elements 3.0. Upgrading this will be almost $100.
I have Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5, Encore DVD, and After Effects. Upgrading these will be several hundred dollars.
I cannot afford these. I can get XP for $179.

[buckeyefan]

I have to agree with Dv8ted2 to a degree. The only benefit that XP gives practically today is that it handles 2d graphics much better than vista. What that means is that on average (based on my own extensive benchmarking) XP will play video files (mpeg, avi, DVD etc) anywhere from 30% to 50% faster than Vista. One Mpeg I tested on XP peaked at 70% processor then played at around 20-30% processor. On Vista the same file peaked at 100% processor for 10+ seconds then ran consistently at 70-80% processor. (That was before SP1, and this was not my benchmark just a test to prove the benchmark)

Point is, unless you are doing tons of video stick with Vista and upgrade your software. If you are doing lots of video XP might be a good choice. I run Vista on my laptops and I have a desktop with XP for video work. And for the record I would not consider XP swiss cheese. It is still a solid OS, but Microsoft will stop supporting it soon so that is something to consider.

[vid83]

Microsoft will probably not provide future updates but all the updates by Windows Updats that has been released so far will still be available right?

[CrayonEater]

Why not do things the right way and just buy a laptop with XP? You can still get them, albeit they are a bit more expensive than Vista junk. That's for a good reason: Vista is still a POS which makes Windows ME look cool.

ACER and Dell still sell notebooks with XP. Both around the $500 range too, less if you buy a refurbed unit from Tigerdirect. Why deal with a turd of an OS like Vista if you don't have to?

The updates will be available, no worries. They may cut support for SP2, which means you might be stuck with SP3 and WGA, but you can still update manually if you don't want MS knowing everything you do and have installed on your comp.

[Dv8ted2]

You can still get them, albeit they are a bit more expensive than Vista junk. That's for a good reason: Vista is still a POS which makes Windows ME look cool.

Not true

I have used Vista at work and I use it at home on two computers. It performs well.

I have worked for two companies that rolled out Vista company wide. Vista and ME do not share the same code base. They are in no way similar. Vista was created from the NT codebase and was based off of Server 2003. Me was created from the 9X codebase and was based off of 98 SE. Vista is more secure than ME. Vista is more stable than ME. You have no clue what you are talking about and are spreading FUD.

You should use it on a daily basis rather than talk about something in which you have no leg to stand on.

[buckeyefan]

Why not do things the right way and just buy a laptop with XP? You can still get them, albeit they are a bit more expensive than Vista junk. That's for a good reason: Vista is still a POS which makes Windows ME look cool.

ACER and Dell still sell notebooks with XP. Both around the $500 range too, less if you buy a refurbed unit from Tigerdirect. Why deal with a turd of an OS like Vista if you don't have to?

The updates will be available, no worries. They may cut support for SP2, which means you might be stuck with SP3 and WGA, but you can still update manually if you don't want MS knowing everything you do and have installed on your comp.

I agree and disagree with CrayonEater.

First, if you plan on going with XP I agree you should look into having it preinstalled. I was looking at some Dells last week and Dell was charging $99 to install XP. That would save you $80 and all the hassle of doing it yourself.

Second, I disagree with his and many other peoples comments about Vista. I have been using Vista since it came out and overall I would give it a B to B+. It really only has a few major flaws. The 2D graphics flaw I mentioned earlier and it copies files ridiculously slow. XP is probably 2x faster at copying files than Vista. Other than that I have not really noticed any major flaws. People can whine about User Account Controls and other things like that. But if Microsoft had not put those things in they would still be whining. So, don't make a decision based on complaints about Vista. Decide based on your specific needs. If you went with Vista I don't think you would be unsatisfied. I almost put XP on my wife’s laptop last year (This was before SP1) but she liked Vista so much she would not let me. Really many of the problems I have found have been user errors because of the learning curve.

P.S. I have been using this site for years but I just joined this spring. Untill this string of posts I don't think I had commented more than 2 or 3 times total. But this has been kind of fun. Thanks for listening to me ramble.