Outdoor TV Antenna Input Needed

[Ron B]

I live out in the boonies; no cable, no DSL or high-speed internet; but we do have cougars and bears. I need an outdoor TV antenna. I don't watch that much TV; I don't want to pay for satellite TV, which is all I can get.
I've done some research; www.antennaweb.org suggested a medium range directional antenna with preamp, I'm thinking I might even go to a large directional. I need at least a 60 mile range.
I've looked at Winegard's 7084P, D8200U and the Clearstream C4, there might be one or two more.
Can anyone suggest a good antenna with preamp that would do the job?

[Soopafresh]

Have a look at this megathread:

http://www.highdefforum.com/local-hdtv-info-reception/14818-tigerbangs-prescription-de...reception.html

The post on the last page seems similar to your requirements:

"When I ran a TVfool.com scan of your coordinates, you are 60 miles from Memphis, and you really need a deep-fringe solution if you want reliable reception, espcially on WMC-DT, which will be on channel 5. If this was my call, I'd use an AntennasDirect XG-91 UHF antenna and a Wade-Delhi VIP-306SR with a Channel Master Titan 7777 preamplifier and a rotator. Yes, it's expensive, but it will work beter that the other suggestions made here. Some of the UHF digital stations that you will be looking for from Memphis are pretty weak, and you need all the antenna that you can muster. You can't get away from the fact that WMC-DT will be back on channel 5, and you won't get a usuable picture on WMC-DT with a VHF-high-band antenna at 60 miles from the transmitter...final answer!"

[Ron B]

That's quite an extensive post with lots of information. I know it's going to come down to a couple antennas; I'll have to do a little figuring and check out preamps. I live quite a distance from the signal and there are natural obstacles (like the Cascade Mountains), that will need to be considered.
I'm hooking it up to my new Sony Bravia 32" LCD, it deserves a better TV signal.

[MOVIEGEEK]

60 miles is pushing it with a digital signal but I'd recommend the Winegard HD7084P or HD8200U with a preamp.

[edDV]

If you PM me your approx location I can give you a recommendation. There are line of sight issues and then local obstacle issues.

I assume you are going for Portland, OR? Most towers are up at the top of Barnes Road.

You are going to need an upper VHF/UHF antenna. The switch puts NBC on 8, PBS on 10, and Fox on 12. The rest are UHF.

Are you getting the signals now? Are your neighbors?

My first guess is you need a Winegard HD7697P or HD7698P. These are new and tuned to Ch7-69

[Ron B]

I assume you are going for Portland, OR? Most towers are up at the top of Barnes Road.

I'm in Snowden, at 2000' above White Salmon, WA, which is right across the Colombia from Hood River. It is very remote, hilly and wooded. Most of my neighbors have satellite TV; I don't watch TV that much so I don't want to fork out the cash for a dish. I did the surveys at tvfool and antennaweb, I design and build video and radio antennas for airplanes, so I kind of have an idea what I need but I am more than happy for any input on TV antennas, I don't know much about them aside from the basics and I want to make a good choice for a "fringe area" setup.
I think the Channel Master Titan 7777 preamp looks like a good investment with whichever antenna I go with. I'd like to stick with one array/antenna; we get a lot of snow and ice up here (Snow-den, get it?), not to mention the Gorge's world famous 40-50 knot winds, a big antenna array most likely will not stay up for long, so I might have to lose a few channels in that trade-off. The XG-91 looks promising, so do those two Winegards that edDv suggested. What would be the difference between the HD7697P, HD7698P and the top of the line D8200U?
I know that no solution is going to get me everything, I just want to do the best I can without spending a fortune.
Thanks for all the input.

[edDV]

I assume you are going for Portland, OR? Most towers are up at the top of Barnes Road.

I'm in Snowden, at 2000' above White Salmon, WA, which is right across the Colombia from Hood River. It is very remote, hilly and wooded. Most of my neighbors have satellite TV; I don't watch TV that much so I don't want to fork out the cash for a dish. I did the surveys at tvfool and antennaweb, I design and build video and radio antennas for airplanes, so I kind of have an idea what I need but I am more than happy for any input on TV antennas, I don't know much about them aside from the basics and I want to make a good choice for a "fringe area" setup.
I think the Channel Master Titan 7777 preamp looks like a good investment with whichever antenna I go with. I'd like to stick with one array/antenna; we get a lot of snow and ice up here (Snow-den, get it?), not to mention the Gorge's world famous 40-50 knot winds, a big antenna array most likely will not stay up for long, so I might have to lose a few channels in that trade-off. The XG-91 looks promising, so do those two Winegards that edDv suggested. What would be the difference between the HD7697P, HD7698P and the top of the line D8200U?
I know that no solution is going to get me everything, I just want to do the best I can without spending a fortune.
Thanks for all the input.

The XG-91 is UHF only. It wouldn't get NBC, PBS or Fox. which will be VHF after the switch

The Winegard 8200 is designed for the old 2-13 VHF and 14-83 UHF bands. The new "769" series optimizes for the narrower 7-13 and 14-69 bands so can get more gain in a smaller size. The largest antenna elements were needed to get the lower VHF frequencies. The lower VHF channels (2-6) have been mostly abandoned for DTV due to poor ATSC performance.

[edDV]

According to TVFool, you have an obstructed but possible 70mi shot at Portland. 95-107dB will be problematic. You will need the largest antenna and a preamp. There are a few PBS translators around Hood River and The Dalles.

Your situation is near identical to mine except I'm higher at 3000ft. TVFool is projecting 70-100dB gain needed here. I'm considering the same antennas. If I were you, I'd look for antennas in your community and ask the owner if they can get Portland.

[lacywest]

Be sure you get a good pre-amp ... awhile back I bought two Motorola Preamps ... sealed up for outdoor use ... the power supply source is provided by connecting a regular coax cable to the AC adapter and string it up to the antenna.

And make sure you do a good job with the connections attaching the coax to the antenna itself ... the sun and wind and bad weather will screw up the wiring unless you put some thought into making a really sturdy connection. Dont be in a hurry. Use plenty of black electrical tape to make your connections solid and wont break off when the wind blows. If the antenna uses thin cheap plastic to keep the criss cross wires from touching ... reinforce them ... tear up a plastic binder and use the sheets of plastic to provide better insulation ... you dont want to have to take the antenna down ... a year or two later.

I did this to the antenna I have mounted on a 15 foot pole mounted to my chimney ... my zip code is 93230 ... I pick up all the channels really decent ... my antenna faces ... North East ... more or less.

[edDV]

It looks like some KGW Ch8 signal reaches Snowden WA.

http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=80

[Ron B]

The Winegard 8200 is designed for the old 2-13 VHF and 14-83 UHF bands.

Hmm, the folks at Winegard recommended the 8200U. Might have to take a harder look at the Winegard HD7697P or HD7698P.

I ran the TVFool tool again for the post transition results and I got a little different list of stations, possibly because I used my exact street address. Some of the stations were digital(in blue on the tvfool chart), but a number of the listings were purple, which I assume are some kind of analog repeater? A 2Edge signal path means the signal is coming over mountains, so that is going to weaken the power as well.

If I were you, I'd look for antennas in your community and ask the owner if they can get Portland.

Most of the houses around here have satellite dishes. If I was into TV more I'd get that, but I just don't watch TV that much. During the summer, the TV will hardly get used, we are always outdoors. I've been without TV for a year and a half, that's why I'm behind the digital curve. The first thing I saw when I turned on the boob tube after a year and a half was that everything was going digital and I needed a new TV and antenna!

Think the Channel Master Titan 7777 preamp is a good unit? Any preamp suggestions, or should I wait until I decide on an antenna?

Thanks again for all the great info.

[edDV]

Your listing basically eliminated Portland as a option. -117dB signal level is not likely to work. KOAB-DT (PBS) is in Bend Oregon. The rest are translators or low power stations serving local towns.

Who did you speak with at Winegard? I guess they were responding to lower VHF translators. Many of these rural translators will continue to operate in analog for a few years but eventually will be required to convert to digital.

You can search for info on translators using Google. Most seem to be run by Oregon Public Broadcasting (OPB). Ownership can be found in the FCC database.
http://www.fcc.gov/mb/video/tvq.html

Channel Master and Winegard each have a line of Pre-Amps and these are being redesigned for the narrower DTV spectrum. Best to call the company help lines and tell them your TV Fool results.

[Ron B]

So, not even worth trying for OTA TV?

[edDV]

So, not even worth trying for OTA TV?

You have the base data. At this point I'd call Winegard/Channel Master and get their opinion.

You could even reference this thread
https://forum.videohelp.com/posting.php?mode=editpost&p=1933286

I'd be interested to hear what they say. I'm trying to do something similar.

I'm going for greater distance (~90 miles) but from higher elevation (3,000ft).

[Ron B]

Thanks edDV

Direct TV is going to be about $350/yr. By the time I get all the antenna stuff squared away, it will be $250, at least. I might have to bite the bullet and pay for satellite. I'll do a little more checking, but I'm starting to think the antenna way may not pay off in the long run.

[edDV]

Thanks edDV

Direct TV is going to be about $350/yr. By the time I get all the antenna stuff squared away, it will be $250, at least. I might have to bite the bullet and pay for satellite. I'll do a little more checking, but I'm starting to think the antenna way may not pay off in the long run.

It depends whether the translators are covering the basics.

[edDV]

For RonB and others in remote USA areas, here is a good site listing translators and low power community stations. They also discuss the impact of the digital transition on these transmitters. Most will continue to transmit analog for several more years. Low power urban stations are being forced to digital.
http://www.ezdigitaltv.com/Low_Power_TV_Exemption.html