What is the ideal bit rate for anime ?

[Ahmed28]

I tried to squeeze my anime as much as it could, but still give a good quality, what's is the ideal bit rate for anime movies ?





Thanks

[Baldrick]

Please try give us MUCH information as possible

To what format? VCD, DVD, AVI Xvid, MP4 H264, Blu-ray ,etc
What is your source? DVD or downloaded video(then give us the details of that video)

[Ahmed28]

Oh, sorry, the source is dvd, the format is vob, the target is x264 in mkv container

[jagabo]

Use CQP or CRF (constant quality) encoding. Pick the quality you want and you will get exactly the right bitrate for every video.

[PuzZLeR]

Extending on Jagabo's answer: it's the answer to any source, not just anime. (But I prefer CRF. :P )

You want a quality level? No problem. Pick the correct CRF value and it will yield a file size with the lowest possible bitrate for that quality level since every clip will be different. The lower the CRF value, the higher the quality retention of the original (but bigger file size).

For DvD source, CRF = 18 is, with the naked eye, virtually lossless. But you can get away with great quality even at CRF = 19, 20 or 21 (maybe even higher depending on your tastes).

[Ahmed28]

How do I set CQP or CRF in Staxrip ?

Update tried CRF 18, the result is even bigger than the vob file

[jagabo]

I would use 22 for stuff that just needs to be medium-high quality watchable. That's still better quality than most stuff you see around the net.

[Ahmed28]

How about CRF 24 for anime ?

Is CRF 22 is the ideal value for anime ?

Can I turn off CRF and use fixed bitrate for batch encoding in Staxrip ?

[jagabo]

How about CRF 24 for anime ?

Is CRF 22 is the ideal value for anime ?

Once again, CRF is constant quality. It doesn't matter what type of source you have it will get the same quality. The file size (bitrate) will vary depending on how "compressible" your video is. A noisy off-air recording will give a relatively large file compared to a clean DVD source. A static video of a bowl of fruit will give much more compression than a video with lots of action, strobe lights, fog, rain, explosions, etc.

There is no ideal setting. It's up to you to decide what quality you want.

Can I turn off CRF and use fixed bitrate for batch encoding in Staxrip ?

I don't use the program but I'm sure there is. But then you don't know what quality you will get. You have two basic choices:

1) You specify the bitrate. You know what the final file size will be but you don't know the quality.

2) You specify the quality. You don't know what the final file size will be but you do know the quality.

[Ahmed28]

CRF is single pass, while the other are 2 pass, is that rite ?

[jagabo]

CRF and CQP and CBR are all single pass. Then you have 2-pass (or more) VBR where the codec examines the video in the first pass, then compresses during the second using information collected during the first (subsequent passes refine the image quality even more).

The difference between CRF ad CQP is that CQP is constant quality in a mathematical sense. CRF is constant quality in a visual sense. Your eyes are less likely to notice detail loss with some scenes than with others.

[PuzZLeR]

Theoretically speaking, there is no need for a second pass with CQ, CRF, CBR.

CQ and CRF: The encoder runs through the video and determines, and assigns, the appropriate bitrate for each frame/scene as it approaches it and sees it - no need to see it again. No need to return to adjust it since it's already determined the appropriate minimum bitrate per section. So there will be variance in bitrate levels throughout the stream, which would be normal.

CBR: The encoder assigns the exact same bitrate to every frame, whether the quality is good or bad. It doesn't care for quality or balance, only an exact bitrate for each and every frame so it doesn't need to go through it again.

2-Pass for a file size: A second pass is absolutely necessary since the encoder needs to balance things. Since you limit it with a file size, and want the highest quality possible for that bitrate, then it will need to see the video first, then in the second pass it will assign the best possible bitrate for each scene from the info it has collected in the first scene. It will typically take bitrate away from lower motion scenes and assign it to higher motion scenes as one example. Since it needs to go back to the beginning of the video again a second pass is crucial.

[PuzZLeR]

Update tried CRF 18, the result is even bigger than the vob file

Not always, but it will be in some cases (especially with high noise levels). I only suggested 18 as a pseudo lossless format - for exaample when you need to re-encode something with crops, watermarks, etc and need as much quality as possible without resorting to a true lossless format which would be up to 10X, or more, file size. I would suggest anywhere between 19-21 for good quality at nice file sizes.

How about CRF 24 for anime ?

Is CRF 22 is the ideal value for anime ?

The only person that can answer that question is YOU since it's YOUR taste in what you like. It may be nice to one person, but unbearable to another.

If you are satisfied with the quality at 24, then apply that to all your video to expect similar results. If it sucks in your eyes, then try 23, 22, 21, etc until something is acceptable to YOU. Just keep in mind that whatever value you select will yield similar quality to every video (but bitrates will vary).

Can I turn off CRF and use fixed bitrate for batch encoding in Staxrip ?

You can batch CRF or fixed bitrate in StaxRip.

[jagabo]

Here are a few examples, two 10 second clips from the same anime:

still.avi 354 KB
motion.avi 2250 KB

These are Xvid AVI clips, not h.264, but the concept is the same. Both were encoded with a constant quantizer of 3 (about the same as CQP 22 in h.264). Both have similar image quality but one is six times larger than the other.

[Ahmed28]

@Jagabo, Puzzler, thanks a lot, btw where should I put bitrate in 2 pass encoding profile in staxrip ?

[craigarta]

I'm probably wrong, But have noticed that when it comes to x264 vs. XVID the "Q" factor's are opposite

[jagabo]

In both x264 and Xvid lower quantizer values give higher quality. But the range is very different:

I would say "near lossless" is Q=2 in Xvid, Q=18 in x264.
A good compromise of quality and file size is Q=3 in Xvid, Q=22 in x264.
The defaults are Q=4 in Xvid, Q=26 in x264

TMPGEnc Plus and AutoGK use a "quality" value where higher is better.

[PuzZLeR]

@Jagabo, Puzzler, thanks a lot, btw where should I put bitrate in 2 pass encoding profile in staxrip ?

Let me instead direct you to a guide from a most excellent site at Digital Digest (which was my start with H.264 years ago):

http://www.digital-digest.com/articles/staxrip_h264_page1.html

You can skip the installation stuff at the beginning. But further on you will have tons of helpful information.

TMPGEnc Plus and AutoGK use a "quality" value where higher is better.

You can add HandBrake (x264, Xvid, etc) to that list which uses a percentage slider. But, Ahmed28, if you want to try it, let me mention that 100% is not lossless. It's actually insanity. CRF = 18 on HandBrake is actually about 65%. But you can get away with great quality at 59% if you want smaller file sizes.

[Ahmed28]

@Puzzler, I've read it before, the problem is like this, I can specify the bitrate for 1 encoding, but not batch encoding, so I was trying to find a bitrate option in the 2 pass encoding profile, so I can use it for batch encoding, since reencoding 1 by 1 vob files is very tiring

[manono]

If these VOBs are all for the same movie, why are you encoding them separately rather than all at once? Or are they a bunch of episodes or music videos or something like that?

[Ahmed28]

@Manono, yes, it a bunch of episodes, I splitted the original vobs from my dvds collection, the total episodes reach hundreds of vobs, and I want to batch encoding them, so 1 mkv is 1 episode, to encode 1 by 1 is very tiring, I usually leave my comp running at night