Question on how to fit more then 80min on 1cd

[B4UTRUST]

*ahem*

I'm new at doing any serious movie file conversion to write as VCDs to play on my standalone. I know how to do basic conversions(using TMPGEnc) from .avi to mpeg1 to write to a VCD using Roxio E-Z CD Creator or Nero and thats about it. Now I look around the forums and see topics saying they fit 120 minutes of video on one 80 minute cd or 3 hours etc etc etc. I read these topics, try these (so-called) easy step-by-step guides on how to do this and get totally befuddled and confounded by some of the terms used in them, as, being a newb to this, they have no meaning to me what so ever. So, what I'm asking for, if anyone would be kind enough to teach one as lowly as me *wonders if people here go for the ass kiss routine to get better results, figures this is still the real world, and decides to go on with it*, how to, in plain idiot, do something like this and still make the file considered to be a standard mpeg for nero or roxio to write to VCD.

The situation I'm at now is I'm converting 4 video files (anime episodes), each approximately 20 minutes long (1 is 20:59, the rest are 19:59) so I get a slight overhang over the 80 minute mark by about 56 seconds or there abouts.

Is there any way to adjust any video settings to get the slightly larger one, or any of them for that matter down in time size without cutting them so they'll fit on one cd? If it results in slight loss of quality that's perfectly acceptable as the particular files I'm working with right now are crystal clear on full screen and make some of the dvds I play look pixely in comparison (I know, shocked the hell outta me to when I got em but hey, I aint complainin!). So if it means a slight quality decrease in audio or video for the larger one it wouldn't bother me as I'm sure this will be the end result from what I've gathered in the other threads. About the only thing I've gathered for that matter but thats aside from the point.

And look, here I've begun to ramble like the idjit I am. I shall silence myself now and prostate myself before the almight omnipotent video conversion masters and pray diligently for an answer to my humble, most likely overly asked, question.

Thank you in advance for any help.

[oflahsp]

I am not a video master but interestingly asked nearly the exact same question a week ago. I've used Sefy's SeVCD templates in the tools section - they also come with a good explanation in a text file. Other promises of 120-130 mins on 1 CD havn't really materialised. People have said they can do it but don't tell you how.
Considering this is such an obvoius subject there should be a "How to get more on a CD" advice in the "How to - Author" section where those who are prepared to tell explicitly how to get on. No boasts!
Best of luck

[Nelson37]

Only ONE answer - lower the bitrate. what to do to try and make it look good at that lower bitrate is the real question, usually involving filters.
For Animation, try using TMPGenc noise filters at about 90% - It's SUPPOSED to be posterized. Using that clean picture, lower bitrates can look more acceptable. IVTC also can give better results with lower bitrates if your original was converted from 24FPS to 30FPS (rounded).
Possible 2nd answer - use 900 Meg CD's

[hitechjunkie]

Only ONE answer - lower the bitrate. what to do to try and make it look good at that lower bitrate is the real question, usually involving filters.
For Animation, try using TMPGenc noise filters at about 90

i totally agree with nelson on all his points!

another thing to consider when you are lowering the video bitrate to get more video minutes on one disc, is whether the output mpeg will be letterbox or not.

i find that lowering the video bitrate on lbx movie sources, doesn't seem to hurt the video quality as much as full-screen, pan/scan sources. as long as you crop the borders out of the image before encoding, the encoder will allocate those precious video bits/sec only to the (smaller) cropped image and add borders later. i enjoy watching the letterbox format so much that i've even re-encoded my Star Trek OS XVCDs with 32 lines (16 top, 16 bottom) cropped out. i find the letterbox format easier to watch, for some reason.

[Lazerick]

I've used Sefy's SeVCD templates, They work perfectly with very good resaults.

[B4UTRUST]

Okay I tried using Sefy's SeVCD NTSF template and it worked for video, gave only a slight reduction on quality(which was to be expected), but when I wrote it, there was no audio.

Now, me being the techno-idiot here, I have no clue about any of the settings that could cause this. Of course by the same point I have no clue how to set TMPEGEnc's noise filters.

If someone could explain that to me it would be much appreciated.

[WRCoach]

I have posted this a few times and few seem to believe that this is working for me.

I have been able to fit 120 minutes of MPEG2 on a standard SVCD using Nero with no MAJOR setting changes. Simply use TMPGEnc 2.02 (or higher) and encode using these settings for normal SuperSVCD (NTSC) template....it might even come set this way.

Rate Control Mode: Constant Quality (CQ)
Encode Mode: Non-interlace

and most important of all

Motion Search Precision: Motion Estimate Search (fast)

These settings, especially the last one, make a much smaller MPEG2 file that even version 2.01 (over 35% smaller) yet it still burns as a standard SVCD. If I change the Motion Search setting to a higher quality, the file does get bigger.

This is not really complex, compared to other templates...and it works. I have made 120 minute SVCDs with GREAT quality and low encoding times.

Let me know if it works for you.

[siaododo]

WRcoach, are you saying that you are using the SVCD template & was able to get 120 minutes on 1 CD? How? Don't you have to adjust the bit rate or something? Pls explain more?

[WRCoach]

No, I have not changed the bitrate. The only three settings I have changed are the ones listed above. I also believe that the way the newer versions of TMPGEnc work, they use fewer megs if the movie is letterbox. (I think the black borders do not take as much memory.)

Keep in mind, I wasn't looking to make changes like this. I stumbled on it. Also, these are SVCDs, not VCDs and definitely not XVCDs or XSVCDs. They play perfectly on my Pioneer 525 and on all the Apex players I have tried them on. I had tried one of Sefy's templates but did not like the results from lowering the bitrate and audio. The results from this SVCD method are far superior.

Email me for more info.

[B4UTRUST]

Currently my audio settings for TMPEGEnc with Sefy's SeVCD is
Stream Type: MPEG - 1 Audio Layer II
Sampling Frequency: 32000 Hz
Channel Mode: Stereo
Bit Rate: 224 kbits/sec
Emphasis: None

Would this totally FUBAR my sound into non-existance? *has a feeling it probably would*

most other templates I've seen have the sampling set at 44000. Is there some tutorial out there that explains these settings and exactly what in the 9 hells they do? I would REALLY like to read that and maybe, just maybe, I would be so lost here...

Guess this means another 2 hours of encoding...*le sigh*

Oh well...such is life I guess...

thanks everyone for their help.

And WRCoach, about the MPEG-2. I thought that was DVD format, not VCD. Or am I totally mistaken on that one?

[WRCoach]

You are not totally offbase. MPEG-2 is for DVD, but it is also for SVCD, which stands for SUPER VCD. Most SVCDs could handle only 46 minutes of video, but it seems that TMPGEnc has gotten much more efficient in creating MPEG-2 files which will work when burned with NERO without making a non-compliant XVCD or XSVCD.

I have seen the templates which mess around with bitrate and sound.........this way does NEITHER....and the quality is still there.

If you can play VCDs on a standalone you can also play SVCDs......but the quality of SVCD is much better than VCD.

Take a short 5 minutes clip, and try encoding it with those settings and burn it to a CDRW (so you don't waste a CDR). Try the same file as MPEG-1 for VCD and compare the sizes.

The SVCD will be smaller and better quality!!!!!

Don't ask me how....it just does.....but only with TMPGEnc 2.02 or higher. The old beta version gives a HUGE MPEG-2 file.

[B4UTRUST]

Okay WR, I'll give it a whirl. I adjusted the settings you listed and saved it as a seperate template for later use. See in about 10 minutes or so how well this worked.

Hopefully it works fine but with my DVD player, it might not support sVCD. The DVD player list says it doesn't but it supports xvcd so who knows. Anything's possible.

Thanks for the tips everyone, now lets see if I can learn anything and become and uber-encoder too ^_^

...nah...lol

[videoguy79]

I wouldn't recommend using a 32Khz sampling rate--that is most likely what is screwing up your audio. DVD players can read audio data at 44.1Khz (S/VCD), 48Khz (DVD w/mpeg2 audio), and 96Khz (for uncompressed PCM files). I don't believe that the audio chip can read any other sampling rate(s) than what I just listed. Use 44.1Khz to be safe. Also, some DVD players have trouble with bitrates different than the standard (compliant) bitrate of 224Kbps, so if you still are having trouble, try encoding at that bitrate. Of course, this will take up more disc space, so plan accordingly.

[kinneera]

If you can play VCDs on a standalone you can also play SVCDs

Not necessarily true.

[Tombed]

WRCoach, is this method could really give something similar to VBR 1600 bitrate ?

looks like I can get a 700 divX file to 450mo SVCD ?!?!?!?!
other comments ?

[B4UTRUST]

Thanks video guy, I figured that was what happened. I'm just trying to figure out why it set it like that? Maybe I accidently adjusted it or something sometime. Probably my fault.

Thanks everyone. ^_^

[WRCoach]

I am not as technically inclined as other posters as far as bitrate is concerned.

All I know is that I am satisfied with most of these nearly 2 hour SVCDS using the method I mentioned above.

[bilbogod]

O.k. I've done what you said (WRcoach) except I've substituted the n.t.s.c. template for a pal one. I used TMPGenc 2.51 and encoded Close Encounters Of The Third Kind. Overall result was a two hours 11min mpeg2 file of 1.3 gigabytes. Not that impressive. Might I suggest that If your claims are sincere that you continue this on the following thread:-
http://www.vcdhelp.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=78863

[Sefy]

Just wanted to point out a few things that might help you guys:
1) TMPGEnc 2.50 and 2.51 have a bug in the VBR encoding, they are stuck on a default of 2000kbps, so if you use anything else, the file size will be bigger.
2) I've never claimed a 100% sure thing and defenetly not DVD quality on my Templates, i've always aimed at VCD quality, the amount a movie will be encoded depends on the movie, here are a couple of drastic examples:

Bridget Jones's Diary (100min) - SeVCD NTSC Enhanced = 788mb file!
The Transformers Movie (86min) - SeVCD NTSC Enhanced = 815mb file!

As you can see, the far longer movie got down to 788mb!! which can be burned on a 80min CD with room to spare!
While the much shorter but with lots of action scenes using the same settings still couldn't be put on a 80min CD!

The amount your movie will compress depends on the action and scenes in the movie itself, don't expect too much, and defenetly not DVD Quality.