any inside info o whether or not xbox360 will support matroska in upcoming

[craig198]

any inside info o whether or not xbox360 will support matroska in upcoming dash updates? thanks

[FulciLives]

They can't even support 5.1 AAC or M2TS format ... you think they can handle MKV and all that it may contain?

I highly doubt it.

PS3 is a better multimedia player.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[craig198]

well then...Ill trade you.

[Baldrick]

Popcorn Hour, www.popcornhour.com = problem solved....

[craig198]

thanks for that baldrick. Ive heard of this popcorn hour but never thought much of it or what it did. very good deal indeed.

i noticed it only goes HP@L4.1 and the mkvs I have are L5.1 and when I change levels on them they get all crappy.

ive pieced myself together an htpc complete with 750GB sata hard drive for just a hair under 400 dollars shipped.

what do you guys think of this? I know its not as sexy or as small as the popcornhour. but its feature list more than makes up for it I think.
Foxconn M7PMX-S http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813186140&nm_mc=OTC-pr1c3watch&c...ONN-_-13186140

2GB - PC2-6400 / DDR2-800 (basic)
http://www.1stchoicememory.com/catalog/products.asp?ID=2234

Creative Labs Sound Blaster X-Fi Xtreme Audio 7.1 channels PCI-E Internal
http://www.lagoom.com/Creative_Labs_Sound_Blaster_X-Fi/30SB082000000/partinfo-id-575404.html

Intel Core 2 Duo Wolfdale E7200 2.53GHz 3MB 1066MHz LGA775 45nm Processor
http://www.partspc.com/ProductDetails.asp?CatID=506&ProdID=6984

Linkworld Black body/ Silver strip Steel 6280-01 Micro ATX Media Center / HTPC Case - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811164098

Generic SATA 750GB 750GB SERIAL ATA 7200RPM HARD DRIVE
http://www.memorylabs.net/oemwhlawdihd.html

Logitech Cordless Desktop EX110 Wireless Optical Mouse and Keyboard Combo
http://3btech.net/locodeexwiop.html

all this came out to less than 400 bucks and its a pretty potent system
Ive already got the perfect heatsink fan for my cpu sittin in my room doing nothing. of course these new 45nm cpus could get away with a penny for a heatsink.

[craig198]

I already ordered my parts...t0o impatient...hope it works out okay lol

[FulciLives]

You will need a video card that does hardware assist on decoding H.264

You should have went with an AMD 780G motherboard and a middle of the road AMD Athlon 64 X2 processor. For a budget HTPC it can't be beat as the video card chipset built-in the 780G is made to decode H.264 as well as Blu-Ray etc.

The system you put together will struggle without getting a video card.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Here is an example of what I am talking about:

780G chipset motherboard ---> CLICK HERE
AMD Athlon 64 X2 5400 Black Edition ---> CLICK HERE

[jman98]

Popcorn Hour, www.popcornhour.com = problem solved....

Note that reports on other forums about Popcorn hour state that it does have limits in MKV support. DTS for example is a no go. AC3 is the only audio that reliably works in the container. As Craig198 pointed in his follow up to this,
there certainly are limits to what Popcorn hour will support in terms of video too in MKV containers. The best we can say about Popcorn Hour and the similar iStar player is that they do support MKV playback but may not be able to correctly play everything in that container. Various reviews and postings in other forums give details to those who are interested about what does and doesn't work.

[Midzuki]

craig198 wrote:

Creative Lies Sound Bastard X-Fi Xtreme Audio 7.1 channels PCI-E Internal

[craig198]

creative lies? ya I know its not the best but its cheap and has optical. as long as I shield rf from it...well we shall see. lol.

thankyou FulciLives for that heads up. Im trying to cancel with newegg and partspc as we type. I will go your route instead. its only a little bit more but Im sure your right.

shoot I think my orders already shipped? thats frickn fast! whats new eggs restocking fee lol...crap!
well FulciLives I went with the foxcon again but this time with a 780G chipset for 66 dollars. I hope this is okay? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813186141

and a 4400 am2 X2
http://www.bzboyz.com/ProductDetails.asp?CatID=617&ProdID=18071

[FulciLives]

creative lies? ya I know its not the best but its cheap and has optical. as long as I shield rf from it...well we shall see. lol.

thankyou FulciLives for that heads up. Im trying to cancel with newegg and partspc as we type. I will go your route instead. its only a little bit more but Im sure your right.

shoot I think my orders already shipped? thats frickn fast! whats new eggs restocking fee lol...crap!
well FulciLives I went with the foxcon again but this time with a 780G chipset for 66 dollars. I hope this is okay? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813186141

and a 4400 am2 X2
http://www.bzboyz.com/ProductDetails.asp?CatID=617&ProdID=18071

Your motherboard choice seems decent enough ... it got mostly good reviews and the few bad reviews seemed unwarranted. I had picked the more expensive Gigabyte motherboard (see my post above) because it came with on-board 7.1 audio and yes there is an optical output so you could have done away with the sound card and let the more expensive gigabyte do it all. The gigabyte alone is $105 whereas the combo of the foxcon mb and the creative labs sound card add up to about $115 so the gigabyte with no sound card would have actually been cheaper while doing the same thing. So you still did OK in my book but you spent $15.00 more and lost a PCI slot. Not the end of the world.

As for the CPU ... from all accounts that should be good enough for HTPC use but I would have probably gone with a more powerful processor. Granted my original choice was more than what you really need but "to be safe" I probably would have gone with the AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000+ Brisbane 2.6GHz for $66.00 which is only $16.00 more than your pick but has a bit more "oomph" to it. Plus for that $16.00 more you get a (stock) heatsink and fan. The CPU you picked is OEM so it probably does not come with a heatsink/fan combo. Chances are you will spend more than $16.00 on an after market heatsink/fan combo.

Based on what I've read about the 780G chipset (the motherboard) the CPU you picked should be powerful enough as I seem to recall one review I read saying that even a lowly AMD Sempron 64 3200+ and the AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ had no problems with only a roughly 22% CPU load when playing back full HDTV content. Since the AMD Athlon 64 X2 4400+ is faster you should be A-OK other than needing a heatsink/fan combo.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Here is a link to an article about the awesomeness of the AMD 780G chipset
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-780g-chipset,1785.html

[craig198]

shoot I didn't even think to look for the optical on the gigabyte. not a big deal you are right. plus I have a separate module now that I can move around. (if I needed the sound card elsewhere) and of course the downside of loosing a slot as well.

and the -1 pci slot is no biggy to me either.

already have the zaleman heatsink fan from an old am2 build that went to the water lol.(cooling) so no worries about that.

glad I ran into you fulcilives. you've been a big help! I take it you do this for a living(htpc's) or a die hard hobbyist??

[FulciLives]

glad I ran into you fulcilives. you've been a big help! I take it you do this for a living(htpc's) or a die hard hobbyist??

I'm just an ******* ... at least some think so.

Truth is I'm just a "die hard" hobbyist.

Let us know how it goes once you get it all hooked up etc.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[craig198]

I'm just an ******* ... at least some think so.

Lies Lies Lies. whoever called you an a-hole is prolly one himself.

Truth is I'm just a "die hard" hobbyist.

thats cool. sounds like you know your stuff.

Let us know how it goes once you get it all hooked up etc.

heck ya!

[craig198]

HTPC case is here. pretty cheap. face cover falling off because of broken posts. was an easy fix with superglue. haha ghetto. no it looks good though.

foxconn 780G just came today.

as well as the amd x2 4400

still waiting on hard drive and memory.

installation in case is a pain. really a sloppy fit. and I exposed some traces on the bottom of motherboard from it sliding around. they didnt look broken(paint rubbed)so I put some electric tape over them and Im gonna keep on truckn.

my zalman fan is not going to work with this case(would stick out the side 1/2"). oh well time to order another heatsink. im going to stick with zalman and get the http://www.partspc.com/ProductDetails.asp?CatID=599&ProdID=16844

[MJA]

many complains about the plastic bezel on the front,and the power supply

case look very nice

[craig198]

well so far Im having problems with smooth playback of mkv container with h264 codec. the 780g is supposed to handle this right? is it because Im not using the hdmi interface? just testing with dvi right now. i dont think this should make a difference though right? chipset drivers are the latest 8.5 drivers. any ideas? im using vlc player.

[craig198]

well kiss my grits wmp11 is actually better at the playback than vlc! wmp is buttery smooth. im guessing vlc is not detecting the 780g video decoding. i havent even begun the audio testing yet ugggggh

[FulciLives]

I've read things that have indicated that VLC is not the best player for HD content.

Try the old Media Player Classic or even better yet the new Media Player Classic Home Cinema "edition"

MPC HC[/url] website]Modern graphics card offer the possibility to decode partially or completely a video stream using DirectX Video Acceleration (DXVA), in order to reduce CPU usage dramatically. MPC-HC includes an embedded video decoder that uses this technology, to decode H.264 and VC-1 with hardly any CPU time required.

Unfortunately the MPC-HC decoder only supports the "bitstream mode" at this stage, which means that only the most recent graphic cards are supported :

* nVidia series 8(9)xxx for H.264 only
* ATI Radeon HD series for H.264 and VC-1 decoding

"Motion compensation" mode might be added in the future to increase compatibility with older graphic cards, but I cannot promise anything. Mpeg2 and WMV accelerations are not supported either.

DXVA is quite picky, so if you want to use it you have to respect thoses rules :

* Windows XP users, select Overlay Mixer, VMR7, VMR9 or VMR9 renderless
* Vista users, select EVR or EVR custom renderer

The MPC-HC Video decoder must be connected directly to the renderer. That means no intermediate filters such as DirectVobSub or ffdshow can be inserted between the decoder and the video renderer.
Internal subtitles can work with the MPC Video decoder in DXVA mode, but the rules are even more restrictive :

* Windows XP users, select VMR9 renderless
* Vista users, select EVR custom renderer
* In "Options / Playback", tick the checkbox "Auto-load subtitles"

Warning for ATI users : VC1 acceleration is broken in 8.6 release (green frames appears randomly during playback). If you experiments such trouble, please revert to 8.5 build.

The ATI chipset in the 780G is supported.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[craig198]

hey john thanks for that info. unfortunately I don't understand half of it.

Im running windows vista 32bit
1 gig of ram
amd 4400

I had to run vista because my creative x-fi card is not supported in xp!

I noticed with vlc player and media player classic that cpu jumps up real high.

Ive tried media player classic home cinema and it also maxes out my cpu decoding 1080p mkv files.

[FulciLives]

hey john thanks for that info. unfortunately I don't understand half of it.

Im running windows vista 32bit
1 gig of ram
amd 4400

I had to run vista because my creative x-fi card is not supported in xp!

I noticed with vlc player and media player classic that cpu jumps up real high.

Ive tried media player classic home cinema and it also maxes out my cpu decoding 1080p mkv files.

Well use whatever works but Media Player Classic Home Cinema aka MPC-HC should work. You might have to follow those directions which I realize are very barebones. Perhaps you can find another thread here or elsewhere that gives more details on how to properly set up MPC-HC

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[MJA]

1GB of RAM is not enough for Vista

[krbo]

Ive tried media player classic home cinema and it also maxes out my cpu decoding 1080p mkv files.

I'll join in this thread as FulciLives asked me via PM as I was one which advertised (and still am) strongly 780G chipset.

Anyone trying to play HD video must understand there are some standards standing and not following them leads to a problem. So standard for hardware H264 playing says "4.1L profile with no more then 3 reference frames for 1080p video" (720p is much more tollerant , even 11 can go well on some platforms). It's a simple question of memory buffers hardware have.

this is a must read:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=52b387c43276aafbf57d298d99afeb6b&t=972503


Unfortunatelly there are a lot of people who don't know or don't wan't to know this and also a lot of older encodings.

Also as MPC HC is still developed it is a good practice to follow up discussion on forum.doom9.org (software players) and from time to time test a latest beta build from

http://xvidvideo.ru/


If you have uncompliant 1080p video (use avinaptic from avsforum post to see ref frames) only help is to reencode it within standards.

Other possible action is pure brute force play -> strong CPU , lot of money and power and CoreAVC as software decoder

Personally I'm using 780G with BE-2350 on HTPC and only MPC HC with AC3filter - nothing else and AC3filter is here only because of some DTS problem with MPC HC and stupid AAC encoding which no AV receiver understands.

720p takes from 1-5% CPU and heavy 1080p mkv (Planet Earth 45Mbits sequences) even some 15-20%.

All of these is the same for Popcorn, PS3 and any other hardware assisted mkv players.

[craig198]

thanks krbo for that info. so should I uninstall the latest klite codec pack and run clean like you? im going to do some more testing. so I see you use the mkv files too.

the whole reason I put together an htpc is because the xbox360 cant handle the mkv and higher level h.264 video >@4.1 and re encoding is such a bear. believe me I wanted the xbox360 to be my player.

Ive done some testing on my 50" plasma and and I need help with MPC HC getting the image a little wider and taller(to small an aspect ratio and black bars on each side. Ive tried using the pan scan and controls dont seem to work.

audio is superb! Ive got dts 5 channel with low frequency effect going over the optical toslink. no problems there!

p.s. getting the tv to even show the hdmi output was a pain. front hdmi port(game) would not show a thing. finally after giving up all other possibilities I moved hdmi to back of plasma and voila.

[krbo]

thanks krbo for that info. so should I uninstall the latest klite codec pack and run clean like you? im going to do some more testing. so I see you use the mkv files too.

yes, yes. Codecs can only harm hardware acceleration. Nothing can be between video and card - only DXVA capable player (there are only two of them - Cyberlink and MPC HC). For example it is known that VSFilter (for subs in many codec pacs) disables DXVA.

the whole reason I put together an htpc is because the xbox360 cant handle the mkv and higher level h.264 video >@4.1 and re encoding is such a bear. believe me I wanted the xbox360 to be my player.

5.1 and higher profiles belongs to a 2k or higher res. video, something only in experimental phase (in Japan mostly). Anything in lower then 2048 encoded in 5.1 is pure human error coming from lack of knowledge.
And yes, reencode is a PITA but you (and I) will still have problem until everyone learns how to properly encode with x264 for standalone devices

Ive done some testing on my 50" plasma and and I need help with MPC HC getting the image a little wider and taller(to small an aspect ratio and black bars on each side. Ive tried using the pan scan and controls dont seem to work.

hmm, side black bars usually comes from desktop not stretched enough , try to use "overscan" control in ATI control centre (warning: overscan can disable DXVA depending of video driver revision (older drivers usually))
You should use some of ATI's HDTV resolutions and desktop should be fully from side to side of your TV.
Even if you can't do that with ATI maybe a PowerStrip software can.

There are cases of bad AR info inside MKV. You can fix that fast with mkvmerge remux but even if it is a case it is not normal to have any side bars with maximized MPC window.

audio is superb! Ive got dts 5 channel with low frequency effect going over the optical toslink. no problems there!

if any of DTS audio movies starts to crack then use AC3filter (only for bypass,not any kind of reencode etc) to AV rec. It's a known bug.

p.s. getting the tv to even show the hdmi output was a pain. front hdmi port(game) would not show a thing. finally after giving up all other possibilities I moved hdmi to back of plasma and voila.

my first attempts were also problematic, there was a picture from a start but changing channel was disaster - no more picture until restart or resolution change. It was a ATI driver issue - not sending proper EDID signal via HDMI.

[craig198]

hmm, side black bars usually comes from desktop not stretched enough , try to use "overscan" control in ATI control centre (warning: overscan can disable DXVA depending of video driver revision (older drivers usually))
You should use some of ATI's HDTV resolutions and desktop should be fully from side to side of your TV.
Even if you can't do that with ATI maybe a PowerStrip software can.

There are cases of bad AR info inside MKV. You can fix that fast with mkvmerge remux but even if it is a case it is not normal to have any side bars with maximized MPC window.

thats the thing, the desktop is using all of the plasma screen area(HDMI). but only the movie is showing black bars.( and I tested with my small lcd monitor(DVI) and that touched both edges)

shouldnt the pan scan help this issue? and why doesnt the controls respond when I try to resize?

thanks for the tips. great help. I had no idea codecs interfere like that with hardware. and also that there is so few media players capable of direct x video acceleration

[krbo]

thats the thing, the desktop is using all of the plasma screen area(HDMI). but only the movie is showing black bars.( and I tested with my small lcd monitor(DVI) and that touched both edges)

shouldnt the pan scan help this issue? and why doesnt the controls respond when I try to resize?

yes, pan scan should help as there are a lot of options there but first thing first.

I see catalyst 8.8 is released , I didn't moved from 8.5 since everything works OK.
(from 8.8 beta I heard it solved some people problems)

try some of the latest MPC HC builds (links in earlier post)

use latest DirectX , latest MPC builds requires latest DivX runtimes - directx must be manually updated !

now MPC Options - Playback - Output - the most important thing is renderer - VMR9 or EVR is your choice

right click on video - Video Frame-> select "keep aspect ratio" and "default" in "override aspect ratio"

with these setting everything in pan/scan works for me (and video is fully streched from side to side)

btw. right click - filters - video mixer renderer - pin info - under "Connection media type" MPC will clearly say if acc working "Video: DXVA 1280x720 23.98fps" )

in fact i never saw any side black bar in any video on my 2 780G setups no matter of resolution (so called "micro HD rips" can have very odd resolutions combined with anamorphic encoding)

one PC is my main with only VGA LCD monitor, other one is HTPC with only plasma - no dual screen in any of them.


so there must be some setting on your side. Pity you are too far away to have some beer and check your setup

...and also that there is so few media players capable of direct x video acceleration

h264 acc to be more precise. There is a third one in development (guys from divx company) and ongoing plans for CoreAVC but for now, only two working for h264 and only one is free.

Few guys working on MPC HC are a really great ones...

[craig198]

ah florida is only a hop skip and jump away from where? croatia? oh nvmd

I will try out those settings. you really know your stuff when it comes to this. I hopefully will get this setup running smooth and full screen. ya plasma is a brand new Panasonic Viera TH-50PZ800U http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-tvs/panasonic-viera-th-50pz800u/4505-6482_7-32886472.html?tag=tpr

[craig198]

is there any tool for moving the picture left right up down on the tv?(or setting the boundries ie xbmc calibration) only thing I saw in catalyst control panel is scaling. but there is still a black bar on the right when left is perfect.

p.s. those settings for mpc hc worked perfectly! great screen ratio now. thanks

[krbo]

is there any tool for moving the picture left right up down on the tv?(or setting the boundries ie xbmc calibration) only thing I saw in catalyst control panel is scaling. but there is still a black bar on the right when left is perfect.

this is a heavy artillery for picture manipulation:

http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/ps.shtm

First read and learn what is a key combination to return from blank screen when you loose picture !!!!