2 questions about DVD authoring

[ihmcjacky]

1) I've found that the text made in the photoshop (which is then put in DLP) , when played in TV, the texts are not clear and sharp enough, is there any solutions on that?

2) I am combining 2 vcds in 1 DVD now, the VCDs have mandarian and putonghua speeches (left for mandarian and right for putonghua). Can DLP separate these 2 channels so that the 2 audio do not get mixed with each other?

[Baldrick]

2) Not with dlp. But you can use another audio editor like goldwave to open vcd mpgs or the audio files and separate each audio track and save as two new audio files.

[tomlee59]

Since the audio processing you want to do is very simple, you can use any of a number of free tools that will do the job well. Audacity is excellent, and free (goldwave is trialware; $45). It will import the MP2 VCD tracks, allow you to eliminate the unwanted channel, and then duplicate the wanted one so that you have two-channel mono sound with the desired audio track.

[guns1inger]

I create all my still menus in Photoshop for DLP authoring. A few tips to make it look better

1. Don't use small fonts or fonts with serifs (tails) or thin horizontal features

2. If you are using thinner fonts, put a drop shadow behind them to add body and bring them off the background

3. The overlay will always look rough on a PC

4. A standard definition CRT television will never display the images as crisply as your PC monitor

[ihmcjacky]

Thanks Baldrick, tomlee59 and guns1inger~ But about the goldwave, I have suceessfully separate 2 audio tracks in goldwave, but after the separation, the audio only plays in left/right channels making the audio too soft to hear, can goldwave make the audio played in both right and left channel(stereo) with only one language?

guns1inger's advice is effective, but can you elaborate more on "fonts with serifs (tails)" and "thin horizontal features "? Any examples on that?

[guns1inger]

Times New Roman is a serif font - note the small flares at the base of the fonts ? These are serif fonts : http://www.dafont.com/theme.php?cat=502

Arial, on the other hand, is a sans-serif font - the stalks go straight down the bottom without flaring. These are sans-serif fonts : http://www.dafont.com/theme.php?cat=501

Thin horizontal features are exactly that. Look at a character like E, for instance. Some fonts have very thin branches. On an interlaced television, these will shimmer or be indistinct. Something like this : http://www.dafont.com/existence.font Look for fonts that are bolder and stronger in form - like this : http://www.dafont.com/hurtmold.font

Note : an not recommending any particular font, just suggesting guidelines and giving examples. Sometimes simply bolding a thin font gives it enough weight to work, sometimes adding a drop shadow or glow helps. If you have a font you really want, or worse, have to use that is causing you problems, experiment with different ways to present it.

[SCDVD]

If your authoring program has an anti-aliasing function, it is generally best to not use it. Anti-aliasing, which is intended to soften edges, tends to make fonts more blurry.

[aedipuss]

after separating the channels into 2 mono, put one mono track back into the editor and duplicate it into stereo, and save it as stereo. do the same for the other. then use both the new stereo audio tracks in dlp. if the audio is still too low then put an audio track into the editor and normalize the volume, repeat for the other.

[thecoalman]

If your authoring program has an anti-aliasing function, it is generally best to not use it. Anti-aliasing, which is intended to soften edges, tends to make fonts more blurry.

Then on the other hand you might get a flickering without it. I generally don't use any flicker reduction in the authoring application but will add anti-aliasing to text images in my image editor. Or as gunslinger suggested a small drop shadow which is just about the same thing.

[SCDVD]

If your authoring program has an anti-aliasing function, it is generally best to not use it. Anti-aliasing, which is intended to soften edges, tends to make fonts more blurry.

Then on the other hand you might get a flickering without it. I generally don't use any flicker reduction in the authoring application but will add anti-aliasing to text images in my image editor. Or as gunslinger suggested a small drop shadow which is just about the same thing.

There are two issues here. The OP is asking about improving the clarity of text on a menu. The point you mention is good advice for scrolling or rolling text. To blur it or put some type of edge on the text such as a drop shadow does help with flickering but this isn't the issue with static text on a menu. In that case, anti-aliasing tends to blur the text which is counter to the OP's objective.

[thecoalman]

Well I have had text with sharp edges flicker, it's even pretty common on those cheezy commercials for products when they get to screen the 800 number listed and the rest of the text if you want an example. A 1 or 2 px gaussian blur or even some minor anti aliasing should not blur it that much that its really noticeable. I wouldn't even consider doing it without the anti-aliasing under and circumstances because you're going to have jagged look.

You need the righ combination of font, font size and slight blurring to get it look really good IMO.

[SCDVD]

Well I have had text with sharp edges flicker, it even pretty common on those cheezy commercials for product when they get to screen the 800 number listed and the rest of the text. A 1 or 2 px gaussian blur or even some minor anti aliasing should not blur it that much that its really noticeable. I wouldn't even consider doing it without the anti-aliasing under and circumstances because you're going to have jagged look.

I don't want to leave the impression that I disagree with you. Someone with you experience knows how to fine tune things for the optimum results. The problem with some "canned" anti aliasing is that it is pretty heavy overkill with excessive blurring. The amount that you describe using works great because you are applying it with a knowledgeable hand. A teaspoon of salt in the pot of soup tastes good but a cup of salt would be awful.

[guns1inger]

Don't start bringing soup into it, lads. This is not the place

[ihmcjacky]

after separating the channels into 2 mono, put one mono track back into the editor and duplicate it into stereo, and save it as stereo. do the same for the other. then use both the new stereo audio tracks in dlp. if the audio is still too low then put an audio track into the editor and normalize the volume, repeat for the other.

Thanks for your suggestions, I've done after using it~ But by comparing
with TMPG DVD Author, DLP is not convenient enough in this case although
DLP provide more functions on DVD Authoring

[ihmcjacky]

um..it seems that you guys give me many suggestions, I will try them out, if it is possible, can you guys give some sample of your past work to let me have a look? (Just for learning)

And one last Q guns1inger, as I have mentioned before about the missing button problem, I finally realize it is an "aspect ratio problem" . Now I just wanna ask if I edit my motion menu in vegas , do i need to render it in 16:9 or in 4:3 mode if my VTS properties in DLP is 16:9?

Regards
ihmcjacky

[Alex_ander]

...if I edit my motion menu in vegas , do i need to render it in 16:9 or in 4:3 mode if my VTS properties in DLP is 16:9?

Surprisingly, DLP help (menu/menu window) says:
A good rule of thumb is that if the main movie is in 4:3 (Full Screen) then you should also design your menus in 4:3. For 16:9 movies you can go with 16:9 menus. I wonder what happens if you don't use that rule, maybe it's just a 'creative' recommendation.
Outside DLP it's absolutely NOT necessary. It is quite possible to have a 4:3 menu and 16:9 movie in the same VTS (if you remember old TDA, it could only produce 4:3 menus) and vice versa.
I've heard of another DLP limitation: some users complained it fails to compile in case they use more than 8 VTS's (99 by DVD specification).

[ihmcjacky]

...if I edit my motion menu in vegas , do i need to render it in 16:9 or in 4:3 mode if my VTS properties in DLP is 16:9?

Surprisingly, DLP help (menu/menu window) says:
A good rule of thumb is that if the main movie is in 4:3 (Full Screen) then you should also design your menus in 4:3. For 16:9 movies you can go with 16:9 menus. I wonder what happens if you don't use that rule, maybe it's just a 'creative' recommendation.
Outside DLP it's absolutely NOT necessary. It is quite possible to have a 4:3 menu and 16:9 movie in the same VTS (if you remember old TDA, it could only produce 4:3 menus) and vice versa.
I've heard of another DLP limitation: some users complained it fails to compile in case they use more than 8 VTS's (99 by DVD specification).

What you mean is if the movie ratio is 4:3 , then I MUST render the
motion menu in 4:3, otherwise, unexpected errors will be happened?

[lordsmurf]

Well I have had text with sharp edges flicker, it even pretty common on those cheezy commercials for product when they get to screen the 800 number listed and the rest of the text. A 1 or 2 px gaussian blur or even some minor anti aliasing should not blur it that much that its really noticeable. I wouldn't even consider doing it without the anti-aliasing under and circumstances because you're going to have jagged look.

I don't want to leave the impression that I disagree with you. Someone with you experience knows how to fine tune things for the optimum results. The problem with some "canned" anti aliasing is that it is pretty heavy overkill with excessive blurring. The amount that you describe using works great because you are applying it with a knowledgeable hand. A teaspoon of salt in the pot of soup tastes good but a cup of salt would be awful.

Most un-tweakable "anti-alias" options are more along the lines of 10 pixels, so it gets downright blurry. DVDWS2's anti-alias, for example, is pretty crappy. I anti-alias in Photoshop, and I never use DVDWS2 for text. Everything is icon-driven, all text is done in the PSD (converted to BMP for menu).

[Alex_ander]

What you mean is if the movie ratio is 4:3 , then I MUST render the motion menu in 4:3, otherwise, unexpected errors will be happened?

I didn't try setting different AR's in DLP (in TDA or DVDRemake it always worked for me as it should by DVD standards), so after finding the quoted phrase in help file I'm not sure it is safe to do in DLP. Let's wait what Guns1inger says from his experience with DLP.

[Supreme2k]

A teaspoon of salt in the pot of soup tastes good but a cup of salt would be awful.

I must be totally out of the loop, because I thought it was a spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down

[lordsmurf]

as it should by DVD standards),

Just remember that a lot of software and hardware uses subsets of the specs, not the whole spec. DVD recorders and authoring software can be really bad about this. Sometimes it's acceptable, sometimes not. Depends on the issue, your needs, etc.

[guns1inger]

To be honest, it's not something I doas a rule. If I am creating a 4:3 disc, or disc with primarily 4:3 content, I create 4:3 menus. If it is a 16:9 disc, or has primarily 16:9 content, I create 16:9 menus and author so that 16:9 menus letterboxes on 4:3 screens.

You can author with 16:9 menus and have them display P&S on 4:3 displays, if you wish, however you have to watch your safe areas pretty carefully as around 20% from each side is out of bounds in this mode.

I can recall only a couple of instances where I have authored both 4:3 and 16:9 versions of the same material on a disc, and in these cases I have produced duplicate versions of the menus in both 4:3 and 16:9, and created a 4:3 VMG menu that is the first menu. The user chooses an aspect ratio at this point, and the subsequent VTS have menu ARs appropriate to the AR of their content. Each VTS can have it's menu playback set to override the project properties settings.

[ihmcjacky]

thanks for all you guys ~ I have tried some tests on the ratio issue and have the following results:
4:3 static menu with 4:3video /16:9video ---->menu display no problem
4:3 motion menu with 16:9 video ----> menu buttons do not show and vice versa
and the conclusion is just like guns1inger and Alex_ander said, if the ratio of the menu and the video is not synchronize, problems will be happened, but it only happens on motion menu only, the static menu is not affected.

[Alex_ander]

4:3 motion menu with 16:9 video ----> menu buttons do not show and vice versa

That's strange and possibly is a bug of the software player (hopefully not of DLP). Even WinDVD shows button display problems with still+audio menu.
The authors of DLP indirectly confirm that having different AR's for menu/movie items in the same VTS is legal. There's a recommendation in help file addressed to the owners of simplified version of their program (DL Studio), which only authors single VTS. They suggest to put movies with different AR in menu (1) and title (2) domains to override their incompatibility in VTS' titles.
I can see a reason why they also recommend to match AR of menu and titles when possible ('as a rule' they say). Some players (mainly software) on selection of a chapter from menu will show the last frame of menu while changing AR to that of the movie (most standalones will blackout that frame). Same problem with selecting 'root menu' button at playback.