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  1. Member wulf109's Avatar
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    Are there any standalone DVD recorders that can record 16:9 anamorphic?
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    The Philips 3575 and 3576 record WS and 4:3 LB, per setting made in its Video > TV Aspect menu... determines what aspect is seen live and recorded (WYSIWYG).

    They don't set any flags but they record in a way that WS recordings play perfectly on 16:9 TVs and nicely on 4:3 TVs.

    See this post for more details.
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    I believe all standalone DVDRs can record 16:9 if fed such. The problem as Wajo said is very few set the flag. This is not a issue if you have a 16:9 monitor but can cause tall skinny people on a 4:3 set.
    Panasonics will set the flag if using RAM discs. I believe some Toshibas and a few others will set the flag on standard discs, but it's by far the exception rather than the norm.
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  4. Member edDV's Avatar
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    Also true for the LG DR787T. I only had it for one hour so am not necessarily recommending.
    Recommends: Kiva.org - Loans that change lives.
    http://www.kiva.org/about
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  5. The 2 Toshiba recorders I use both will. I think Pioneer recorders will too.
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  6. Member wulf109's Avatar
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    Changing the flag with IFOEDIT would result in a quarshed image with short fat people. The recorder has to be capable of "seeing" a 16:9 anamorphic image. My Pioneer 220 sees 16:9 input as a 4:3 frame with image imbedded letterboxed in the 4:3 frame,changing the flag in this circumstance does nothing.
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    Correct me if I have this wrong, but the way I had this explained to me and it made sense was this way.
    The full resolution for all DVD's is 720x480 which turns out to be a 4:3 frame. To store a 16:9 frame the 16:9 frame is horizontally squished to fit into that 4:3 frame. If done correctly their is a bit set that tells the DVD player upon playback to unstretch that 4x3 frame to fill a 16:9 frame. If that bit is not set you will need to setup your DVD player to stretch 4:3 format to fill a 16:9 frame. Doing so will properly display full frame on a 16:9 TV. The other problem with missing the bit is when you play this DVD on a Player set to output 4:3 it will output this squished 4:3 frame to your 4:3 TV which will look vertically stretched. If the bit was set your player would know to output this image in either Zoom which would stretch the image and then cut off the sides, or letterbox, which would again stretch the frame but this time put black bars on top and bottom. This way you will not miss the side info, and also display the image in the proper aspect ratio. Please let me know if I'm all wrong in my thinking. I still don't really understand how someone adds this flag with a computer program. Can it be done anytime, or must it be done before the disc is finalized?
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    jjeff, I've also heard what you heard, but read this from Wiki, which changes your/their first premise:

    "Note that neither 720x480 (1.5:1) nor 720x576 (1.25:1) are in 4:3 (1.33:1) display aspect ratio. The DVD 720x480 standard was based upon the older analog NTSC and PAL standards which have a fixed 4:3 aspect ratio, but a variable horizontal resolution (approximately 200 upto 700) depending upon the quality of the received signal. The DVD specification was designed to capture this variable resolution, assuming an ideal lossless NTSC or PAL signal. When a 1.5:1 NTSC-DVD is viewed on a standard 1.33 display, each pixel is squeezed closer together, or when viewed on a 1.77:1 display, moved farther apart. When a 1.25:1 PAL-DVD is viewed, each pixel is moved farther apart in order to recreate the proper 1.33 or 1.77 aspect ratio."
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  9. Originally Posted by jjeff
    Correct me if I have this wrong, but the way I had this explained to me and it made sense was this way. The full resolution for all DVD's is 720x480 which turns out to be a 4:3 frame.
    Since 720/480=1.5:1 and not 1.33:1 (4:3), your whole premise is wrong, and everything you said after that is wrong as well. Well, most of it anyway. You accidently got some of it right. wabjxo has it right.
    I still don't really understand how someone adds this flag with a computer program. Can it be done anytime, or must it be done before the disc is finalized?
    Well, it can't be done to a disc, as they're read-only. It can easily be done with the files on the hard drive using such programs as IFOEdit, PGCEdit, VobBlanker, etc.
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  10. Member wulf109's Avatar
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    Checked the owners manual on the Philips 3576 and it clearly states that it cannot input 16:9,it says all 16:9 will be changed to 4:3 for recording. Again not anamorphic.
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    Originally Posted by manono
    Originally Posted by jjeff
    Correct me if I have this wrong, but the way I had this explained to me and it made sense was this way. The full resolution for all DVD's is 720x480 which turns out to be a 4:3 frame.
    Since 720/480=1.5:1 and not 1.33:1 (4:3), your whole premise is wrong, and everything you said after that is wrong as well. Well, most of it anyway. You accidently got some of it right. wabjxo has it right.
    I still don't really understand how someone adds this flag with a computer program. Can it be done anytime, or must it be done before the disc is finalized?
    Well, it can't be done to a disc, as they're read-only. It can easily be done with the files on the hard drive using such programs as IFOEdit, PGCEdit, VobBlanker, etc.
    Well glad I "accidently" got some of it right I guess I may not know how it works, but I do know it works just fine on all my Panasonic DVDRs. I either feed them a 16:9 source from a DVD player or in the case of my EZ-28 with digital tuner it gets the 16:9 from tuning a 16:9 HD broadcast. In either case when I play back those recorded DVD's they play back just fine and in full 16:9 on my 16:9 TV. If I take those DVDs though and play them back on a 4:3 TV everyone will be tall and skinny. I'll get the whole 16:9 image but it will be on the 4:3 screen. Since I basically don't use the 4:3 TV all is fine for me.
    In regards to changing the flag I'm sure I've "read" that people do this on their PC to a R or RW disc they have recorded to. Just not sure at what time they do it. Since I personally don't put my DVD's in my PC again I'm only going off what I've read.
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  13. I record widescreen on my Toshiba recorders and it plays back full screen on my widescreen HDTV. The recorder has to be set in the set up menus for 16:9 recording. They are 3 year old recorders. I don't know if the new ones do 16:9 or not. The Toshibas have the best PQ I've seen and I've been using DVD recorders since the first one released in the U.S.
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  14. Member wulf109's Avatar
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    Could you check one of those widescreen DVD's with IFOEDIT and see if it shows them as 16:9 or 4:3
    Some LCD's will expand an embedded 4:3 to full screen,but that isn't anamorphic.
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    Originally Posted by wulf109
    Could you check one of those widescreen DVD's with IFOEDIT and see if it shows them as 16:9 or 4:3
    Some LCD's will expand an embedded 4:3 to full screen,but that isn't anamorphic.
    I'll repeat the Wiki excerpt here again... note the 1st bold statement, then the ref. to the DVD std being 4:3 fixed aspect, THEN the horizontal res being variable, then the statement that when viewed on a 16:9 TV the pixels are "squeezed together" and on a 4:3 TV are "moved farther apart."

    "Note that neither 720x480 (1.5:1) nor 720x576 (1.25:1) are in 4:3 (1.33:1) display aspect ratio. The DVD 720x480 standard was based upon the older analog NTSC and PAL standards which have a fixed 4:3 aspect ratio, but a variable horizontal resolution (approximately 200 upto 700) depending upon the quality of the received signal. The DVD specification was designed to capture this variable resolution, assuming an ideal lossless NTSC or PAL signal. When a 1.5:1 NTSC-DVD is viewed on a standard 1.33 display, each pixel is squeezed closer together, or when viewed on a 1.77:1 display, moved farther apart. When a 1.25:1 PAL-DVD is viewed, each pixel is moved farther apart in order to recreate the proper 1.33 or 1.77 aspect ratio."

    This means, when you look at the file on a computer, the file HAS TO show 4:3 cuz that's the DVD-std frame and that's the frame recorded, but the computer program will ALSO show the res. as 720x480 WHICH DOESN'T COMPUTE... 720x480 is a std pixel-ratio for a 16:9 aspect pic (1.5:1)!

    It's what's INSIDE the 4:3-std frame that counts when it comes time for playback... the 720x480 has to be "squeezed" to fit the 4:3 shape, which is NOT it's natural shape. The "squeezing" and "moving apart" are why the 3575/76 can record a WS program and display it in natural 16:9 on a 16:9 Tv then display it in almost-perfect aspect on a 4:3 TV.

    If your DVDR doesn't set the WS flag, then it can't be formed to fit a 4:3 Tv with LB bars per that DVDRs playback controls for aspect, so it won't be truly "anamorphic" in the sense you might be referring to. The 3575/76 doesn't set the flag, so playback controls have no effect... it's just natural 16:9 or slightly sqeezed 4:3.
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  16. Member wulf109's Avatar
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    IFOEDIT will when you double-clck on the .ifo for the main VTS will show if the movie is 4:3 or 16:9
    If it says 16:9 it's anamorphic,if it says 4:3 it's not anamorphic. The TV whether CRT or LCD will resize to fit the screen. My question is about anamorphic,your comparing apples and oranges.
    Approved DVD resolution's are 720x480,704x480,and 352x480 all of which will resize to fit the TV screen,but have nothing to do whether it's anamorphic.
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  17. Anamorphic is the way they encode retail DVDs to raise the resolution when played on a widescreen TV. DVD recorders can record 16:9, but, it isn't anamorphic.

    http://gregl.net/videophile/anamorphic.htm
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  18. Samijubal --- Quote
    DVD recorders can record 16:9, but, it isn't anamorphic
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    I would say NO they can not record anamorphic

    My units record WYSIWYG –[What You SEE Is What You Get] and I have not seen or found one that isn”t
    If a program is in !:33 {!4x3] it records the program as 1.33, If in 1.77:1, -- !.85:1 or 2.35 it records them as the are sent but are NOT Anamorphic
    Using a PC the program aspect ratio can be changed

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    In response to a similar question, this answer is from a user that I would value the opinion

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    Physically changing a programs aspect ratio is hard enough to do on a PC, it would surprise me greatly if any stand-alone DVD recorder would do it at all, let alone do it well.
    It is a wonderful feature to add to a Wish List.
    AND
    I just got a ViewSonic PJ503D projector I'll be using mainly as a TV. It's an "entry-level" unit for sure, but I have been reading up on Home Theater stuff. The more expensive projectors (MUCH more expensive!) can even use an anamorphic lens (just like movie theater projectors) so you can go from 4:3 AR stuff to 16:9, or even wider AR's, with no image quality lose. You do need to have the right size screen though.
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    A pic in 1;33 is what it is. One in 1.77, or 1.85 is ok on a 4x3 TV. A 2.35 Is Not.
    Tthe letterbox is to narrow a strip
    Adjusting a 16x9 TV for pic size usually results in squat or Elongated figures

    My answer to this problem
    MY units hve a 2x zoom THIS is two much the picture is degraded and to much of the pic is lost
    So I picked up a PLAYER that had a 1.25x zoom. This did not materially degrade the pic and it was much better on a 4x3 and works ok on a 19x9 and doesn’t get so big vert to loose any writing below the pic and the loss of horz is minimal.

    Other than that I would have to go back to a PC. I do not want to do that As my solution does just fine for me



    PS
    I record in SD and that Player will also up-covert SD recordings and Sony can stick blu-ray
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