I'm doing something wrong with a pulldown from Pal -> Ntsc..

[zambuka42]

its good to know that gspot has this fault.. but in the end, the length of the video IS being changed during the pulldown by 4 minutes. I just woke up and took a look at the finished re-encode (without the 'for dvd' option checked) and there was no video.. when I played the file it was nothing but a black screen with "cavistreamsynth: system exception - access violation at.." written in it.

[guns1inger]

Open the script in virtualdub. Something isn't right with it

[zambuka42]

it opens in virtualdub fine. This is the script:

AVISource("myfilename-not-shown-here")
LanczosResize(720,480,0,0,640,272)
AddBorders(0,48,0,48 )

that's it

[guns1inger]

http://avisynth.org/mediawiki/FAQ_common_errors#When_frameserving_I_got_the_following_...from_0x0.22.3F

Might help

[zambuka42]

ok, I'll check it out.

[jagabo]

You might as well fix the frame size while you're at it:

LanczosResize(720,368,0,0,640,272)
AddBorders(0,56,0,56)

[zambuka42]

fixed the avisynth problem, and did the re-encode again using the settings outlined above.. and still it doesn't work. It becomes 4 minutes longer.

[manono]

The only way it can become 4 minutes longer is if you encode for 25fps and apply standard 3:2 23.976->29.97fps pulldown. You're not applying 3:2 pulldown in CCE are you (not that it should make a difference)? Do me a favor please. Open the pulled down M2V in DGIndex and first run the Preview (File->Preview). While it's doing that the Information screen will pop up. Under Video Type what does it say? Is it Film 100%, or does it flip back and forth between 79-80%. Next, please save a portion of the D2V. Use the [ and ] buttons to isolate a small section and then File->Save Project. Open the resulting D2V file in Notepad and post a portion here, something like:

900 5 0 217233408 0 1 10 71 72 d3 f0 f0 e1 f2 f3 e0 f0 f1 e2
900 5 0 217800704 0 1 10 73 70 d0 f1 f2 e3 f0 f0 e1 f2 f3 e0
900 5 0 218363904 0 1 10 70 71 d2 f3 f0 e0 f1 f2 e3 f0 f0 e1
900 5 0 218929152 0 1 10 72 73 d0 f0 f1 e2 f3 f0 e0 f1 f2 e3
900 5 0 219502592 0 1 10 70 70 d1 f2 f3 e0 f0 f1 e2 f3 f0 e0
900 5 0 220078080 0 1 10 71 72 d3 f0 f0 e1 f2 f3 e0 f0 f1 e2
900 5 0 220637184 0 1 10 73 70 d0 f1 f2 e3 f0 f0 e1 f2 f3 e0
900 5 0 221208576 0 1 10 70 71 d2 f3 f0 e0 f1 f2 e3 f0 f0 e1

[zambuka42]

no, I am not applying any pulldown in CCE. I will do what you said about dgindex and get back to you. tx

[zambuka42]

ok. Video Type is a steady Film.. however, it jumps between progressive and interlaced. I suppose this could be a problem. So I did the same with the m2v before pulldown is applied and it is a solid progressive.

ok as for the d2v

here is a section from the m2v after pulldown:
900 1 0 781969464 0 0 0 32 73 90 f1 b2 e3 b0 f1 a2 f3 b0 e1 b2 f3 a0
900 1 0 782333356 0 0 0 71 32 d3 b0 f1 a2 f3 b0 e1 b2 f3 a0 f1 b2 e3
900 1 0 782713592 0 0 0 30 71 92 f3 b0 e1 b2 f3 a0 f1 b2 e3 b0 f1 a2
900 1 0 783086220 0 0 0 73 30 d1 b2 f3 a0 f1 b2 e3 b0 f1 a2 f3 b0 e1
900 1 0 783462644 0 0 0 32 73 90 f1 b2 e3 b0 f1 a2 f3 b0 e1 b2 f3 a0
900 1 0 783821816 0 0 0 71 32 d3 b0 f1 a2 f3 b0 e1 b2 f3 a0 f1 b2 e3 ff

and just for good measure, I'll give you a section from before the pulldown:
900 1 0 779061068 0 0 0 72 72 d2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2
900 1 0 779422436 0 0 0 72 72 d2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2
900 1 0 779784160 0 0 0 72 72 d2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2
900 1 0 780151412 0 0 0 72 72 d2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2
900 1 0 780511960 0 0 0 72 72 d2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2
900 1 0 780877988 0 0 0 72 72 d2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2
900 1 0 781243008 0 0 0 72 72 d2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 f2 f2 e2 ff

[manono]

Ah, now we're getting somewhere.

Video Type is a steady Film however, it jumps between progressive and interlaced

Not supposed to do that. After DGPulldown is done it's still supposed to be solid Progressive. Did you set the progressive frame flag in CCE, as you should (I think so)? Are you using the latest DGPulldown? It's up to ver 1.0.11, although I found when I just checked that I was using 1.1.08. I haven't ever heard of any broken earlier versions, but I suppose it's possible. And after coming out of DGPulldown set for 25->29.97 it's not steady film. It's supposed to be 79-80% film and the D2V is supposed to look like mine above and not like yours. Note mine has 2 zeros in a row, while yours has that telltale steady film cadence of 0 1 2 3 0 1 2 3.

Yours:

900 1 0 781969464 0 0 0 32 73 90 f1 b2 e3 b0 f1 a2 f3 b0 e1 b2 f3 a0
900 1 0 782333356 0 0 0 71 32 d3 b0 f1 a2 f3 b0 e1 b2 f3 a0 f1 b2 e3
900 1 0 782713592 0 0 0 30 71 92 f3 b0 e1 b2 f3 a0 f1 b2 e3 b0 f1 a2

Mine:

900 5 0 217800704 0 1 10 73 70 d0 f1 f2 e3 f0 f0 e1 f2 f3 e0
900 5 0 218363904 0 1 10 70 71 d2 f3 f0 e0 f1 f2 e3 f0 f0 e1

I'm not quite sure how you're doing it, but you're applying standard 3:2 pulldown and that accounts for the out of synch audio. This is not 25->29.97fps pulldown that you're showing me.

[zambuka42]

Yes I set the progressive flag frame.. and as I said, the m2v created by CCE (before pulldown) shows progressive constantly in Dgindex.

Yes I have the latest dgpulldown. and yes it shows steady film.. not 79-80%.

So, you are telling me that 3:2 is being applied. That is crazy because I've done this with DGpulldown, and Hard Code's pulldown as well. Both with the 25->29.97 selection verified!

I've done plenty of other avi's before this (some of which were pal).. but something crazy is just going on with this one and I don't get it.

[manono]

Yes, something screwy is going on. Your GOP lengths are different than mine, but I don't think that should make a difference. It was suggested earlier that you should try it with the Custom box checked and 25->29.97 filled in by hand. Did you try that? My only other suggestion is to bring it up with the author, neuron2 (Donald Graft), who moderates over at Doom9. If you're not registered there, you'll have to first register and then wait 5 days before posting. You might post in the MPEG-2 Encoding Forum, perhaps in the Pulldown of 25fps To NTSC thread:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=88031

There has to be something basic that you (and perhaps us as well) are overlooking, but for the life of me I can't figure out what it is. Maybe someone else here has some more ideas as well.

Oh, by the way, the only box I check in the lower part of DGPulldown is the Top Field First Box, All the rest I have unchecked. I don't know if any of them play a part, but it's worth a try. At least you won't have to reencode it yet again. Then run the Preview in DGIndex to check for that Film 79-80% thing to show that at last you have it (or not).

[zambuka42]

I'll try using the custom box, but since I used two different pulldown programs with the same results.. I doubt that will help. I've also used many different combinations of the options at the bottom of dgpulldown. I guess I'll try over at doom. I really want to thank you for trying to help me. -b

[jagabo]

Does your source AVI file have VBR MP3 audio?

[zambuka42]

yes, but the resulting .mpa file created by CCE is the correct length

[jagabo]

Sorry, I didn't see all the discussion between you and manono of the incorrect pulldown. It sounds like that is the source of your problem but I have never seen DgPulldown do that. I've done dozens of conversions and they've all turned out right. I have 1.0.3 installed now. I have used earlier versions too.

[zambuka42]

well, I guess I'm going to give up on this.. I hate to do that but I can't re-encode this another time or I'll go crazy. I appreciate everyone for taking the time to help me. -b

[jagabo]

Why don't you work with a 1 minute clip. Then you can run test much faster.

[zambuka42]

Actually, I have done that for a few of the tests that I've done.. but to tell you the truth I've just had it with avi altogether. Plus, I really don't know what else to try.

[guns1inger]

One more idea. FAVC uses DGPulldown to do PAL/NTSC NTSC/PAL conversion as well. Give it a run using HCEnc. It will automate pretty much what you have been doing, and if you tell it not to delete the working files, you will have elementary streams to author with when it is done.

I would be curious to see just what FAVC does with this file.

[zambuka42]

Ok, I'll check it out. If it automates CCE encoding, then cool.. but I don't want to use a different encoder, I really like CCE's output. - oh I see, it uses HC or Quenc encoders.. I'll give it a shot, but it would only be used in the future as a backup to fix this problem I have. Thanks for the info.

[guns1inger]

HCEnc is comparable to CCE in most instances, if a little slower. It often produces superior results to CCE when working with lower bitrates.

[zambuka42]

cool, I'm giving it a try right now..

[rhegedus]

This is what has worked successfuly for me in the past:

1) Demux the source file into video and audio streams
2) Load the video stream into VirtualDub and use the resize filter to make your output 720x480. Change the fps to 23.976. Shift the slider all the way to the end of the video and make a note of the new duration of the video stream.
3) Set up the VirtualDub frameserver.
4) Load the original audio stream into Goldwave.
5) Use the Time Warp function (under effects) to warp the audio stream to the new video stream duration.
6) Save as wav.
7) Open TMPGEnc
8) Select DVD NTSC in the wizard.
9) Use the frameserve marker for your video stream
10) Use the new wav file for your audio sstream
11) Under Other Settings in TMPGEnc, the frame rate should be 23.976 (internally 29.97 fps) and the Encode mode should be 3:2 pulldown when playback.
12) Encode.