Join .avi files, different video sample rates

[-mm-]

Hello. I am trying to join two avi files together that have different video sample rates. What is the best tool to use to make these two files successfully join and play without interruption? Thanks!

[AlanHK]

Try Avidemux.
They'll still need to be the same frame size and fps. If not, you can filter them through an AVS script and reencode.

[-mm-]

I'm not sure how to check the frame size and frames/sec. Does Avidemux display that information?

Let me explain in a little more detail what I am looking to do. This might also be helpful as a Pinned Topic/Guide, because I am sure there are other people looking to do this same type of thing.

AVI #1 - I had created using Windows Movie Maker and adding stilll photos as a slideshow and then adding an mp3 file for the music. I then converted the file to .avi using WinAvi.

AVI #2 - is from a video that I shot on my digital video camera. When I transferred the file from the camera to my computer, it saved it as a .mov file. I used a tool called IMTOO .MOV Converter to change it from .mov to .avi

Now I would like to join both of these, so my slideshow plays first and then the video afterwards seemlessly. I also need to remove the audio from both avi's because once they are joined, I have a replacement audio file that I want to add to them after they are joined. The audio should be the exact length for both of the videos combined.

Any suggestions on this would be a terrific help. Thanks in advance!

[AlanHK]

You're making a lot of conversions. Every one loses quality.

I don't know what .mov files are, but if they're made by Windows Movie Maker they might be WMVs. If so, you can join them using Asfbin.

If you want to convert that to AVI after, you can replace the audio in the AVI with many tools, eg VirtualDub or Avidemux.

[-mm-]

.mov files are Apple QuickTime movie files. The camera I had saved the files on my hard drive when I transferred them as .mov I need to add about 1 1/2 minutes of video on the beginning of that video with some other audio I have.... so again what I need to do is:

use this slideshow I created for 1:36 and then join that onto the video from the camera, then I need to remove the audio that's there and add the new audio I have. I know there is a way to do this.

I have already converted the .mov file to avi... and the other file is avi also.. and I now want to join them. The problem is ... as stated above, they are different sample rates.

I just need the information on how to make this work so I can join them. Once that is accomplished I can use another app to remove the current audio and replace it with the new audio.

Thanks!

[AlanHK]

I have already converted the .mov file to avi... and the other file is avi also.. and I now want to join them. The problem is ... as stated above, they are different sample rates.

As I said earlier, try Avidemux.

It's free and quite effective.

If the frame size (height x width) are not the same use its filters to resize first.

[-mm-]

Hey again Alan,

Thanks for restating that, as I was trying to find a tool to do it, because I didn't actually think aviremux would work properly. I was actually right, unless I didn't follow some sort of procedure that I should have. It would be most helpful if there was a guide, or at least some method of madness to follow, instead of just pecking and poking. I have never used this tool before, and having the interface open, to just speculate what I need to do isn't of value.

After I "attempted" to change the frame rate of the first file to that of the second file, and after I "attempted" to append, joining the first to the second... the result was what appeared to be a 6 hour video. In fact the total time should only have been about 35 minutes. The result was disastrous and didn't work properly.

Any guide to follow would help greatly, as I searched in the guide section and nothing was available. Thanks!

[guns1inger]

Are these from a still camera ? If so, they most likely be mjpeg format inside a quicktime container.

What you really need is an video editor with a time line. You might be able to use Windows Movie Maker, however it would probably require converting the video to something WMM can use.

Otherwise, look at the demo version of something like Ulead Video Studio. It should be fully functioning for 30 days - enough to get through this project. If it works, and you like it, it isn't that expensive to buy.

[AlanHK]

After I "attempted" to change the frame rate of the first file

You originally said the video sample rate was different. Now it's the frame rate. They are nothing to do with each other.

You might use a media info app like GSpot or Avicodec to get a report on each file and post it.

[mgh]

if all the files are as per divx ht profile, divxmediabuilder will give you one divx file with a menu to select any one of them and if you start with the first-you can play all of them one after the other automatically. you will need a divx ultra player for playing on your tv. divx player will play it without problems on your pc (also windows media player if you have divx 6 series codec)
works only with divx or xvid file meeting restrictions of divx ht profile-best part - the avis can be as different as chalk and cheese - resolutions, video kbps or audio sampling rate,channels and kbps do not have to match.

[cheyrn]

For converting the video sampling rate, avidemux has a filter that converts fps and keeps the same length, as opposed to my attempts with virtualdub that all resulted in vidfeos with a different length than the original.

[budwzr]

http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/moviestudio $49, and you're all set. Download the trial and see for yourself.

[AlanHK]

For converting the video sampling rate, avidemux has a filter that converts fps and keeps the same length, as opposed to my attempts with virtualdub that all resulted in vidfeos with a different length than the original.

SAMPLING rate is not FRAME rate.


And this is a 6-year-old thread.

[budwzr]

Hahaha.

[cheyrn]

Information doesn't change meaning based on how old it is.

If you can elaborate on the relationship between video sampling rate and frame rate it would be helpful.

Virtualdub does not allow me to append a video with different value for what it lists as FPS. The error message that it gives is that the videos have a different video sampling rate.

Note that this is not audio sampling rate.

The rate at which input is chunked seems to me like it would be sampling rate. So, if you have 10 seconds of visual signal and you sample it 10 times per second, you have 100 chunks and the sampling rate was 10 times per second.

The number of chunks that fit within a given amount of time would be frames per second (I would think). So, if you say that the 100 chunks fit within 1 second you would have 100 FPS (I would think).

If there is a fixed relationship between sampling rate and frames per second then the length of the video changes based on sampling rate and also based on frames per second (I would think).

Virtualdub has a dialog box with which you can change "frame rate" and the top section is "source rate". It gives the source rate in frames per second. The bottom section has framerate conversion where the output can be converted to a different FPS. So, I think virtualdub uses frame rate and sampling rate interchangeably.


In any case, I found out how to do the the same conversion I did with avidemux, in virtualdub. The "interpolate" filter allows you to convert to a different frame rate without changing the length of the video.

[ndjamena]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.264/MPEG-4_AVC#Levels

Samples = Pixels = Samples = Pixels

[cheyrn]

I don't follow what samples = pixels means.

Apparently converting to some fps and using interpolate filter have the same resulting frame rate and duration (in virtualdub). Below is file info:

Original file:

Frame size, fps (µs per frame): 640x480, 29.970 fps (33367 µs)
Length: 1000 frames (0:33.36)
Decompressor: Internal DIB decoder ( )
Number of key frames: 1000
Min/avg/max/total key frame size: 921600/921600/921600 (900000K)
Min/avg/max/total delta size: (no delta frames)
Data rate: 220963 kbps (0.00% overhead)

Converted to 60fps (lower half of frame rate dialog):

Frame size, fps (µs per frame): 640x480, 60.000 fps (16667 µs)
Length: 2002 frames (0:33.36)
Decompressor: Internal DIB decoder ( )
Number of key frames: 2002
Min/avg/max/total key frame size: 921600/921600/921600 (1801800K)
Min/avg/max/total delta size: (no delta frames)
Data rate: 442368 kbps (0.00% overhead)

Source rate 60fps:

Frame size, fps (µs per frame): 640x480, 60.000 fps (16667 µs)
Length: 1000 frames (0:16.66)
Decompressor: Internal DIB decoder ( )
Number of key frames: 1000
Min/avg/max/total key frame size: 921600/921600/921600 (900000K)
Min/avg/max/total delta size: (no delta frames)
Data rate: 442368 kbps (0.00% overhead)

I can append to 60fps videos. If I append a 60fps video to the original, virtualdub complains:

Cannot append segment test.avi. The video streams do not share a common sampling rate:

First stream: 00007530 / 000003e9 29.97003 samples/sec
Second stream: 0000003c / 00000001 60.00000 samples/sec

So, I am pretty sure that virtual dub use samples per second and frames per second interchangeably.

[ndjamena]

So, I am pretty sure that virtual dub use samples per second and frames per second interchangeably.

I'm sure that it does. The question is, is that correct terminology? I'm still open to arguments but the h.264 specifications use the term Sample to mean Pixel exclusively and the developer of VirtualDub isn't exactly an authority on the subject.

[cheyrn]

I'm still not sure you are getting at by that sample means pixel. If you mean it literally means pixel, then that is of course not true. If you mean it concerns pixels and you are saying pixel to mean "luma" on the wikipedia page, then I think that is true.

If you search that article for "samples per second" it appears that it uses samples in the English meaning. When video data is sampled there is rate at which it is sampled. When video data is stored in frames and frames are rendered, they are rendered at a frame rate. Both what is sampled and what is rendered is video data.

It's like saying "cup". Coffee comes in cups. Cup does not mean coffee. When a cup is filled there is a rate at which it is filled (cups filled per second). When coffee is consumed there is a rate at which it is consumed (cups emptied per second).

Cup is a quantity, in the abstract. To empty and to fill are are actions that occur at a rate.

If you say you drank coffee at the rate of 0.01 cups filled per second, it is valid but weirdly phrased. The rate is 0.01 cups per some unit.

If you say you poured coffee at the rate of 0.5 cups emptied per second, it is also valid and weirdly phrased. The rate is 0.5 cups per some unit.

If the dishwasher accepts cups at the rate of 0.2 cups emptied per second, when the wait staff gives the cups she filled to the dishwasher if she does it by pouring cups of coffee and handing them to the dishwasher, these are equally alid:

Cups have been delivered to the dishwasher at the rate of 0.5 cups emptied per second which exeeds the maximum rate of 0.2 cups emptied per second.
Cups have been delivered to the dishwasher at the rate of 0.5 cups filled per second which exeeds the maximum rate of 0.2 cups filled per second.

[budwzr]

Sample is the bitrate. How many Mbps during the recording or capture. The "Capture Quality Rate". Or maybe "Quantity" is a better term. In music, "Gain" would be the sister concept.

If you ate a footlong sub in 5 minutes, then a Big Mac in 5 minutes, the footlong had more bitrate.

[ndjamena]

If we're going to play on the general ambiguity of the word 'sample' then as this site proves pretty much every day, a sample can be an entire movie. The question remains what does the word sample generally mean when used on it's own in the video industry. We all know what a sample is in an audio file and no one expects a anyone to clarify what kind of sample they're talking about whenever they use the word. As far as I'm aware, a sample in the video world is a pixel and yes, that means a luma sample because chroma pixels can be of various configurations. A bit or byte is a sample of digital data and has nothing to do with video as video exists outside the digital world. Either way the way VirtualDub uses the word is confusing, we already have a good word for what it's describing, "frame-rate", it's universal and everyone understands it.

These extensions enabled higher quality video coding by supporting increased sample bit depth precision

-Edit- There are enough references to 'sample' without the Luma component to confirm that sample = Pixel

[cheyrn]

Regarding the original topic of the thread, the point of figuring out the terminology is to understand what is being conveyed by the words.

You can join the two avi files by converting them to have the same frame rate. In virtualdub you do this by setting "convert to fps" in the frame rate conversion section of the frame rate dialog box. "Have the same frame rate" means a rate. It's not a thing. The thing is the video data.

The video data is rendered from frames and it is created by being sampled. Both actions have a rate. The same thing (video data) was input at a rate and it can be output at a rate. But, which rate you refer to references either the rate at which the video data was created (as a result of sampling) or the rate at which the video data shoud be rendered.

That is not obvious because of the source rate adjustment section which also has an option to "change frame rate to (fps)". And because of the error message about different sampling rates, since the difference is a result of the output rate of the two files. Appending is like assembling video data from input. So, that is probably why the difference is described in terms of the rate at which they were created from sampling.

[LMotlow]

You can join the two avi files by converting them to have the same frame rate.

Maybe. Ever heard of an audio sampling rate? Frame size? DAR? Interlaced? Progressive? Telecined? What differences in, uh, "sampling rate" do you think would be involved in each of these factors? Would differences other than frame rate prevent the files from being joined?

Hello. I am trying to join two avi files together that have different video sample rates. What is the best tool to use to make these two files successfully join and play without interruption? Thanks!

Go back in years, and none of the following information was ever determined:

How did the O.P. know the videos have different sampling rates?
What software was used to get that information?
What are the sampling rates reported for the different videos?
Which sampling rate was being talking about? audio encoding? video decoding? The wiki link was for video decoding.
What information did MediaInfo or similar utilities give about the different videos?
How many guesses are yet to come?

Otherwise.....