Non Linear Editor advice?

[jbigfoot]

I'm new to the world of NLE. I've worked in TV for more than 30 years in various production capacities -- including linear editing -- but never non-linear. I need to produce a professional-quality DVD of event footage from a DV tape and rather quickly on my home computer. I have a recent HP computer with Vista Home Premium.

I had originally planned on buying Sony Vegas 8.0 because I read such good things about it here and elsewhere. Now, my friend recommends the newer editions of Adobe Premiere Pro/CS3 because it's easy and effective.

What to do?

[Epicurus8a]

You can download trial versions of each program and decide for yourself. You might even discover the "standard" version of Vegas is adequate for now, then you can upgrade to 8.0 later on.

Good Luck!!!

[guns1inger]

I have never found Premiere to have a particularly helpful or friendly interface. I have also never found it to be particularly stable or trust worthy either, although I have heard CS3 is better in that department.

Honestly though, the previous poster's advice is the most sound. Play with the demos. Work out what suits you - the way you work and the way you think. Bottom line is that they all do pretty much the same thing. It is how they do it that makes the difference (all other things being equal). Yes, each will have specialty areas, but unless they are key areas for you, they don't really figure into the equation.

Certainly don't dismiss your friend's advice out of hand (not the least because it will probably piss him/her off), but don't just take it, or our advice, for that matter, at face value. Do some leg work yourself. After all, your friend (and the rest of us) don't have to live with your decision.

[jbigfoot]

Thanks for the advice. Whichever one I end up using, it will still be a learning curve compared to the linear stuff I've done for the last umpteen years.

[guns1inger]

The leap from linear to non-linear isn't that great once you get your head around the freedom you have. Of course you can always use Virtualdub or AVIDemux if you want to stick with the linear world. Both work well for what they do.

The other thing to consider is the scale of your own projects. Both Adobe and Sony have consumer versions of their flagship products (Premiere Elements, Vegas Movie Studio). Both are very powerful for the home project space, and have a surprising array of features for the price. You lose out on some of the power - unlimited audio and video tracks, for instance, or secondary colour correction - but most consumers wouldn't use primary colour correction or need more than two tracks anyway. You may find these are an easier way in, and at a more reasonable cost.

[Epicurus8a]

I've worked in TV for more than 30 years in various production capacities -- including linear editing -- but never non-linear.

Welcome to the 21st century brother! Like you I'm "seasoned." If you're not intimidated by your computer, you won't have any problems adjusting to NLE. In fact you'll wonder why you didn't make the switch a lot earlier.

Good Luck!

[zoobie]

Regardless of program, you'll find it's all about the computer...not your video...that will stifle your imagination. Wecome to the wonderful world of meaningless error messages that must close your program for some undisclosed reason...leaving you to figure out just where the editor went wrong.
Obviously, I'm not too thrilled with the crapware these major players pass off as NLE's...
I hope you have deep pockets and look good bald
Good Luck!

[jbigfoot]

I've worked in TV for more than 30 years in various production capacities -- including linear editing -- but never non-linear.

Welcome to the 21st century brother! Like you I'm "seasoned." If you're not intimidated by your computer, you won't have any problems adjusting to NLE. In fact you'll wonder why you didn't make the switch a lot earlier.

Good Luck!

Thanks. I tried learning one of the NLE systems we have at work a couple of years ago and I seemed to have a mental block -- it was just a bunch of track lines, icons, and other computerese that I simply couldn't connect to traditional video. I'm in the process of trying again and I'll have to succeed: they're getting rid of my edit suite and all video tapes in a couple of weeks.

I'm not intimidated by my computer, I just want to beat the snot out of it every now and then when it locks up on me.

[jbigfoot]

The leap from linear to non-linear isn't that great once you get your head around the freedom you have.

Everybody says this, but like I said in my last post, I'm having trouble converting the thinking of all my years of linear editing and being a live/commercial TD to NLE, although I'm hell on wheels when it comes to editing music in Cool Edit.

...if you want to stick with the linear world. Both work well for what they do.

This sounds like a good idea, although I'd probably be better served by just jumping in the water.

The other thing to consider is the scale of your own projects. Both Adobe and Sony have consumer versions of their flagship products ...

I had considered this, but this is for a side business run out of my house and I'm doing the official DVD for a major event (contact me privately and I'll tell you what it is), so I wouldn't feel comfortable going in with anything less than the flagship version; and if there's something I find that I need in the middle of the project which I hadn't anticipated then this could cause problems.

[jbigfoot]

Regardless of program, you'll find it's all about the computer...not your video...that will stifle your imagination. Wecome to the wonderful world of meaningless error messages that must close your program for some undisclosed reason...leaving you to figure out just where the editor went wrong.
Obviously, I'm not too thrilled with the crapware these major players pass off as NLE's...
I hope you have deep pockets and look good bald
Good Luck!

Thanks. Well, I am going bald, and even with hair, I still looked like a glass of shit - with an egg in it!

Since I have Vista, error messages, lock-ups, etc., and I are old pals.

[redwudz]

jbigfoot, in the future please use a more descriptive subject title in your posts to allow others to search for similar topics. I will change yours this time. From our rules:

Try to choose a subject that describes your topic.
Please do not use topic subjects like Help me!!! or Problems.

Thanks,
Moderator redwudz

[Epicurus8a]

...I simply couldn't connect to traditional video. I'm in the process of trying again and I'll have to succeed: they're getting rid of my edit suite and all video tapes in a couple of weeks.

This is the way I viewed it at first: Using time lines is kinda like creating sophisticated A-B Rolls. And in some cases A-B-C-D-E rolls. If you can draw them out on paper, there's no reason you won't be able to do it on your computer.

Good Luck!!!

And if you feel the need for a snack, try one of these:

[dun4cheap]

Once you go NLE you will never look back. I think since you have no bad habits yet, while intimidating looking, you would be better served to move to more of a pro tool like Pinnacle Liquid, Vegas or Premiere. I use Liquid myself and do a lot of work with multi cam HD edit etc. There are quite a few free tutorials on line for these editors as well. Keep in mind Liquid is EOL, and pinnacle will be releasing a new generation editor hopefully at the end of the year.

I think the best advice you have been given so far is to try the free trial versions. Lastly it is easy to blame software for problems, but many users try to run these NLE's on the bare minimum requirements. If you intend on doing this then you will get frustrated easily. These systems require good components.

[jbigfoot]

jbigfoot, in the future please use a more descriptive subject title in your posts to allow others to search for similar topics. I will change yours this time. From our rules:

Try to choose a subject that describes your topic.
Please do not use topic subjects like Help me!!! or Problems.

Thanks,
Moderator redwudz

OK, will do.

[jbigfoot]

...I simply couldn't connect to traditional video. I'm in the process of trying again and I'll have to succeed: they're getting rid of my edit suite and all video tapes in a couple of weeks.

This is the way I viewed it at first: Using time lines is kinda like creating sophisticated A-B Rolls. And in some cases A-B-C-D-E rolls. If you can draw them out on paper, there's no reason you won't be able to do it on your computer.

Good Luck!!!

And if you feel the need for a snack, try one of these:

This is terrific! Those are very close to SMPTE bar colors! Good work! I bet it tastes as good as it looks.

I've used drawings of timelines to explain linear editing, especially to demonstrate match-framing.

One of the things I'm having trouble understanding, with our Avid Adrenaline, is all these 'bins' and 'sequences', things that just don't exist in linear editing. I've reached the point where I can do simple edits of extracting, lifting, and things like that.

We're in the middle of a conversion to HD (so I have to learn a new switcher and get used to new digs and a new way of doing TV, on top of everything else), the place is a madhouse, we're never more than 2 hours away from a news show so I can't really sit down and delve into it, but one of these days I'll just have to do that -- dive in with both feet and just play.

[jbigfoot]

Once you go NLE you will never look back. I think since you have no bad habits yet, while intimidating looking, you would be better served to move to more of a pro tool like Pinnacle Liquid, Vegas or Premiere. I use Liquid myself and do a lot of work with multi cam HD edit etc. There are quite a few free tutorials on line for these editors as well. Keep in mind Liquid is EOL, and pinnacle will be releasing a new generation editor hopefully at the end of the year.

I think the best advice you have been given so far is to try the free trial versions. Lastly it is easy to blame software for problems, but many users try to run these NLE's on the bare minimum requirements. If you intend on doing this then you will get frustrated easily. These systems require good components.

Thanks for your advice. I consider myself a very good linear editor, so I'm hoping those habits and modes of thinking will help ease me into it.