dvd writer do not understand ISO9660 UDF format?

[rancid]

Hi,

Pardon the ignorance, but is it possible that a dvd writer does not recognise ISO9660+UDF format?

I have an LG "super multi" DVD writer which I suspect does not recognise ISO9660+UDF format.

I used ImgBurn "Build" option with File System "ISO9660+UDF" to burn a video_ts folder.

The burn (onto a DVD -R) was successful but when popped into a standalone player, it doesn't play. The disc format message kept coming up.

The standalone player is a LG DVD recorder/player. The player can play previously backed up DVD -R (burned using a different writer but this writer has since conked out - the LG "super multi" was the replacement ).

The same burnt disc can play on my PC using mpc

Is it possible that even though I specified ISO9660+UDF, the writer simply ignored it and burn it as normal file system, resulting in a disc that cannot play in a standalone player but playable via mpc?

Thanks

[guns1inger]

Put the disc back in the drive and open Imgburn. It will tell you what filesystem was used.

[jman98]

Why on earth do you blame the writer instead of considering the very real possibility that your writer did exactly what you told it to do and the problem is that your LG DVD player doesn't understand the ISO9660+UDF format? I've heard of standalone DVD players being very fussy about the DVD formats they can recognize.

What you propose that the writer failed is almost certainly NOT what happened. The problem is with your player. Just last night I tested an ISO9660+UDF data disc on my old Philips DVP-642. It took a long time for it to finally recognize the disc, but it finally did so. ISO9660 discs are not a problem for this player. I suspect that the UDF part of the format is causing problems for your player. Note also that PCs are a lot more tolerant about discs and video formats than standalone players. Standalone players have firmware to help them to recognize discs so they can play them correctly and some firmware is just more restrictive than others in what it accepts.

[rancid]

Hi guns1inger

It says "ISO9660+UDF".

Come to think of it, which file system should I be using?

ISO9660
ISO9660 + Joliet
ISO9660 + Joliet + UDF
ISO9660 + UDF
UDF

Thanks

[rancid]

hi jman98,

like i said in my post, i was able to burn successfully a disc using a different writer (which has since broke down) and played it using exactly the same player... the only difference between then and now is the LG super multi... so i guess it could be the cause...

as i'm no expert... i'm merely looking for possible explanation and hopefully get a disc that can play on the standalone player...

[noemi7]

The UDF file system must be 1.02 for a standalone player. Burning programs very often use a newer one - 1.5 and up.

[jman98]

ISO9660 will give you the best compatibility for sure, but it restricts you to what they call "8.3" file names (ie. MYFILE01.AVI is a legal name but MYFILE001.AVI is too long). Joliet allows for longer names, but some weird DVD players actually refuse to play files that don't confirm to the 8.3 limit. Not all players do this, but some do.

I was kind of combative in my first post because I want to shake up your thinking. The worst thing you can do is get into the pattern of thought your original post has - deciding that you know with 100% certainty what the problem is and discounting all other possibilities. In fact, you certainly picked the least likely possibility of all (the writer refused to follow your directions) as your certain cause of failure. We see posts here all the time from guys with problems and they leave out the most important details of what they are doing because they are sure that they don't matter and aren't the cause of the problem. In fact, very often what people think is not the problem is EXACTLY what the problem is. While it is theoretically possible that the writer refused to do what you told it to do, that possibility is so remote that it shouldn't be realistically considered unless other more likely possibilities have failed. Your own follow up post shows that the writer did exactly what you told it to do. Note noemi7's post as this is absolutely a potential problem.

UDF is a great idea, but in reality many manufacturers have failed to adequately support it. It's probably best to avoid it for best results with DVD players.

[rancid]

thanks noemi7 for the info...

how do i burn a disc that conforms to the 1.02 version ? does this mean that i'll have to buy a newer dvd player that will support version 1.5 & above?

[rancid]

hi jman98,

i am no expert and as a layman, i suspect the writer could be the cause... with noemi7's reply, it seems that versioning may be a problem as that explained why i was able to burn discs that were playable with the previous old (now broken) writer but not the new one...

yeah, i may have told the writer to write ISO9660+UDF format... but I certainly do not know that there's version 1.02 or the newer 1.5... and that there's a possibility that the player does not understand v1.5 or newer...

i understand that newbies like me most often get a beating from the more knowledgeable ones... i'm here to learn... a little patience on your part could go a long way... thanks for your reply anyway...

[rancid]

hi jman98,

i am no expert and as a layman, i suspect the writer could be the cause... with noemi7's reply, it seems that versioning may be a problem as that explained why i was able to burn discs that were playable with the previous old (now broken) writer but not the new one...

yeah, i may have told the writer to write ISO9660+UDF format... but I certainly do not know that there's version 1.02 or the newer 1.5... and that there's a possibility that the player does not understand v1.5 or newer...

i understand that "unknowledgeable" ones like me most often get a beating from the more knowledgeable ones... i'm here to learn... a little less "combative" on your part could go a long way... thanks for your reply anyway...

[VegasBud]

rancid,

For dvd-video, only udf v1.02 is used. Since you used ImgBurn, the disk you burned is also using udf v1.02. If you really want to verify that, just put the burned disk in your burner, start ImgBurn, and put it in "Read" mode. On the left, right under the drive drop-down list, where it says "File Sys:", it will say "ISO9660, UDF (1.02)". That means the disk was burned with the right file system for dvd-video, and that's not the problem.

I have some troubleshooting questions:

Just to make sure...if you look at the disk contents in Windows Explorer, there should be a "VIDEO_TS" folder and a "AUDIO_TS" folder in the root folder. If that's what you see, skip to the next question. If that's not what you see, post back with what you are seeing.

What kind of disks are you using? With the disk in the burner, and ImgBurn in "Read" mode, on the right side of the window, what does it say after:

Pre-recorded Information:
Manufacturer ID:

One last question...did you have ImgBurn "Verify" after the burn, and if so, did it successfully verify?

[rancid]

hi vegasbud,

thanks for the reply...

i did some experimenting with ImgBurn and burnt it with only UDF and guess what? it worked !! the !@$$@#@ disc can now play in the standalone player !!!

to answer your questions :

in ImgBurn read mode, it says "ISO9660, UDF (1.02)"... so it's burnt using the correct file system...

in Windows Explorer, i see both "audio_ts" & "video_ts" folder...

here's the pre-recorded info:

Pre-recorded Information:
Manufacturer ID: MCC 02RG20

Recording Management Area Information:
HL-DT-ST DVD-RAM GSA-E60L

Physical Format Information (Last Recorded):
Book Type: DVD-R
Part Version: 5
Disc Size: 120mm
Maximum Read Rate: Not Specified
Number of Layers: 1
Track Path: Parallel Track Path (PTP)
Linear Density: 0.267 um/bit
Track Density: 0.74 um/track
First Physical Sector of Data Area: 196,608
Last Physical Sector of Data Area: 1,201,903
Last Physical Sector in Layer 0: 0

and yes, it was successfully verified...

why did only UDF worked when the recommended "standard format" ISO9660+UDF doesn't?... even ImgBurn displayed a warning when I tried to use only UDF option...

[VegasBud]

rancid,

From your answers to the questions, we know that the file system is correct, you're using good media, and since the burn verified, what was actually written to the disk is identical to the original material on your hard drive. With all the right answers, the disk should have worked.

The ISO9660 part of UDF Bridge (ISO9660+UDF) is only there so older computers that couldn't read UDF natively could still play a dvd-video disk, so it's not like you really need it any more. On the other hand, since you didn't have to do it this way before to get a standalone-playable disk, it would seem to indicate that something isn't quite right, almost certainly with the way the standalone player is interpreting the ISO9660 part. Nothing comes immediately to mind as to why that should be, but I'll give it some thought. It might help if you provide the make and model of the standalone player.

If someone else has any ideas as to what's going on, feel free to share them.

[rancid]

Hi VegasBud,

Thanks for the reply and appreciate your effort and attempt to help.

I, too am puzzled why this is happening. The DVD recorder/player model is LG RH7521W.

The previous writer that worked was a JVC Everio DVD writer that came bundled with the JVC camcorder that I bought. I have used this writer and done numerous DVD movies (not homemade movies but commercial ones) backup using Verbatim -R discs (using ImgBurn and ISO9660+UDF format) and they were all playable with the same LG recorder/player. Unfortunately, this writer is now not functioning.

I bought a new DVD writer - LG "super multi" and this is the writer that's now causing the confusion.

For now, I'm using ImgBurn with this writer to write UDF only as this seemed to work with the player. My only fear is that if there's a need for me to change DVD recorder/player in future, these discs may not work as the new player may require "ISO9660+UDF" format....

Thanks once again for the explanation and help

[hech54]

Although I've read some complaints about newer LG drives...I still highly doubt it is the drive. I wouldn't trade my old faithful LG's(4040B, 4167B) for anything right now. MAYBE a Pioneer for DVD burning....but that Pioneer will have troubles with my oversized CD media.

[noemi7]

Rancid, regarding your question about future use of discs with other players: there is no answer, unfortunately. I believe it very much depends on a vendor and player model. For example most Sony players refuse to play a disc burn in UDF or UDF/ISO mode only - it has to be burn as "DVD-Video", even the format is UDF/ISO.

I'm not expert but maybe the "DVD-Video" mode which is used i.e. by Nero has something to do with files allocation structure on a disc; additional info... who knows, lol.

[VegasBud]

rancid,

I wouldn't worry about future playback compatibility of your UDF-only burns. The UDF Bridge specifications have been recommending using UDF for dvd-video use in standalones for 10 years, so any standalone you would get in the future should be even less likely to have a UDF-only problem than a current model. The only time you should have a problem would be if you tried to play the disk in a pre-windows98 computer.

I'm sorry to say that the additional information you provided hasn't helped me figure out what the heck is going on. I keep coming back to the theory that it must be the standalone, but it's extremely unlikely that it started acting up precisely when you changed burners. Still, if you have access to a different standalone player(s), it would be interesting to see if the UDF Bridge disk would work or not.

The only other thing I can think of is there might be something in a ImgBurn log that would provide a hint. Since you're using -R disks, you could do a "Test Mode" burn to get a ISO9660+UDF log without wasting another disk.

[rancid]

Thanks for all your replies...

@hech54 : I'll bear the limitation of the Pioneer in mind if I need to get one...

@noemi7 : agree with you... things change and there are always newer version of firmware, software and newer models of hardware... guess I just want to play it safe... I didn't know Sony had this "perculiarity" abt "DVD-Video" format... I learnt something new today... thanks !

@VegasBud : again thanks for the help ! I found it strange too that this problem occurred immediately on using the new writer and I couldn't figure out why... anyway for now, I'll just continue to do what works...

I've learnt alot of interesting stuff from you guys... thanks for all the help !!...