If a DVD player has no Macrovision…

[coody]

A DVD player cannot record but play a DVD movie only. What the effect can be produced if a DVD player has no or been disabled Macrovision?

[edDV]

Macrovision is designed to screw up recording devices downstream from the player. Monitors are not affected, just recorders.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macrovision

[CrayonEater]

Usually, not always. I've seen Macrovision cause the usual fading, brightness, and color transitions on some monitors that make video unwatchable. In particular, if you have an older TV with just coax cables and no component/audio inputs, and if you use one of those converter boxes that allow you to hook up a DVD player, Macrovision will make every DVD unwatchable, and I've tried a few different brands of those converters.

To the OP: If Macrovision has been deactivated either on the disc or the player itself, then any DVD recorder or VCR should be able to record. Macrovision is designed to protect against analog recording, and it will stop DVD-to-DVD-Recorder copying as well. All recorders are supposed to honor any video that even slightly appears to be Macrovisioned and simply refuse to record. If you were to try to record to an analog device i.e. a VCR, the video would look like crap as I mentioned above.

[Rich86]

A DVD player cannot record but play a DVD movie only. What the effect can be produced if a DVD player has no or been disabled Macrovision?

If you play a video on a dvd player that has macrovision disabled, the effect is a top quality, undistorted video signal with no signal bursts intended to confound the agc circuitry in recording devices. In other words - it is all good news - video as intended by the folks who produced the source dvd in the first place.

[coody]

That’s what I think some people may be wrong. They thought a DVD recorder could copy DVD if connects with a DVD player without Macrovision. Having tested it with a COBY DVD player disabled Macrovision and connection to a DVD recorder; the DVD recorder still cannot copy a DVD. To copy a DVD, the recorder itself must have no Macrovision or maybe both of them should have no Macrovision (have not tested though). If someone has seen a DVD recorder can record a DVD movie by connecting with a Macrosivion disabled DVD player, please report the brand name and model.

[Rich86]

Are you sure this Coby player has macrovision disabled?
Are you sure it isn't just "code-free" which is a different matter altogether?

[Noahtuck]

I know my Panasonic DMR-E30 standalone recorder will record dvd's from my cyberhome CH-DVD 300 and an old GE standalone.
And i know for a fact the macrovision is disabled on both of those standalone players because i did it myself & the panasonic is store bought stock.

But it's a waste of time because of video quality loss, audio quality loss & it's much faster on a pc in most cases.

[RowMan]

There is another form of copy protection that can be found on DVDs called CGMS/a.

Macrovision is supposed to prevent copying from store bought VHS tapes and DVDs to VHS, but it also affects DVD recorders.

CGMS/a is meant to prevent DVD to DVD copying either through a computer or a DVD player to DVD recorder setup.

If a DVD is copy protected, most will have BOTH of these protections.

I have a Cyberhome CH-500 DVD player that I can hack with a few keystrokes of the remote to turn off Macrovision, but not CGMS/a. This means that if I wanted to copy the contents of a protected DVD, I could record it to VHS, but would not be able to record to a DVD recorder.

There are some LiteOn, ILO, Daytek, and Gateway DVD recorders that can be hacked to actually ignore both Macrovision and CGMS/a, but that's another story.

[coody]

I tested the COBY DVD player by disabling both of region and Macrovision. The code can be found in the DVD hack section. However, the Philip DVD recorder still cannot record the DVD movie. Probably due to the other than Macrovision protection. It seems disabling DVD player Macrovision has become meaningless unless the DVD recorder itself can ignore the DVD protection.

[RowMan]

What's the model # of your Coby player?

[orsetto]

Yes, CGMS/a protection is the culprit in this case. Many Macrovision player hacks do nothing to disable CGMS/a, which means you will get better playback on a monitor if you are passing the signal thru another device but you still won't be able to capture to a DVD recorder. You will also notice this if you try using outdated black-box filters or clarifiers: they predate CGMS/a and will pass it straight across. No go.

Some have suggested just using a PC to make backups instead: this is usually the preferred method but there have been occasions when a digital to analog to digital re-encode has served me better, particularly when I need to capture a small portion of a title that otherwise takes up an entire pressed DVD9. Most of my PC software will be forced into compression mode of the entire title in such cases, while my JVC DRMV5 recorder will make a very nice encode of just the desired portion. Another instance would be if you needed to make your own chapter marks to annotate a title for presentation: you can't do this with a straight PC backup but you can if you make a digital-analog-digital re-encode to a DVD recorder with HDD (such as a Pioneer 640). I'm talking quick 'n' dirty using what most people have on hand: no doubt with some software you can do these things on a PC, I just don't have it.

[coody]

Use of the backup software can disable the protection but sometimes the copied disc is unable to be played in a DVD player due to the picture quality with the disc stop, mostly happened in the portable DVDs. But, the DVD recorder almost certainly makes the copied DVD to be played in a DVD player unless it is not recordable due to the protection. For this reason, I sometimes prefer the DVD recorder than the computer copy unless the copy protection problems. RowMan, check the Pepboys store for the clearance portable COBY DVD players this week, that costs starting from $29 after rebate. Then you can check the hacks list with the COBY models found in the store.

[Noahtuck]

but there have been occasions when a digital to analog to digital re-encode has served me better

How ?? you lose video quality and audio quality... espc. of the original audio is anything other than 2.0 stereo...

particularly when I need to capture a small portion of a title that otherwise takes up an entire pressed DVD9.

If HDD space is a problem you need to buy a larger HDD... and you can get some pretty big one's for very cheap!!

Most of my PC software will be forced into compression mode of the entire title in such cases

Are you saying that most of your pc software will compress what you are trying to copy ??
If so, you need to get better software!!!!!!
On a PC using the CORRECT software, even all freeware, you should be able to rip an entire dvd, even just a few minutes of a dvd, edit it, and burn it back to dvdr or use it for whatever you want with NO compression or loss of quality!!!

while my JVC DRMV5 recorder will make a very nice encode of just the desired portion. Another instance would be if you needed to make your own chapter marks to annotate a title for presentation: you can't do this with a straight PC backup but you can if you make a digital-analog-digital re-encode to a DVD recorder with HDD (such as a Pioneer 640). I'm talking quick 'n' dirty using what most people have on hand: no doubt with some software you can do these things on a PC, I just don't have it.

Definately quick and dirty!!!!!! Because you can change or set chapter points anywhere you want, again with no quality loss or re-encoding and burn back to dvdr, unlike with a standalone to standalone!!

[Noahtuck]

Use of the backup software can disable the protection but sometimes the copied disc is unable to be played in a DVD player due to the picture quality with the disc stop. But, the DVD recorder almost certainly makes the copied DVD to be played in a DVD player unless it is not recordable due to the protection. For this reason, I sometimes prefer the DVD recorder than the computer copy unless the copy protection problems. RowMan, check the Pepboys store for the clearance portable COBY DVD players this week, that costs starting from $29 after rebate. Then you can check the hacks list with the COBY models found in the store.

Man... talk about the blind leading the blind.....

Have either of you guys watched Saw IV yet ?? where the two guys have to try and save themselves...
but one guy has his eye's sown shut, so he can't see but can hear and the other guy has his mouth sown shut so he can see but can't talk ??

[coody]

Man... talk about the blind leading the blind.....

Have either of you guys watched Saw IV yet ?? where the two guys have to try and save themselves...
but one guy has his eye's sown shut, so he can't see but can hear and the other guy has his mouth sown shut so he can see but can't talk ??

It’s really a blind talk, isn't it?

[Noahtuck]

Man... talk about the blind leading the blind.....

Have either of you guys watched Saw IV yet ?? where the two guys have to try and save themselves...
but one guy has his eye's sown shut, so he can't see but can hear and the other guy has his mouth sown shut so he can see but can't talk ??

It’s really a blind talk, isn't it?

Thank you for proving my point

[orsetto]

As my grandmother would say (if she were alive), Aye-aye-aye! Calm down children!

I'm *perfectly* aware there are PC software solutions that will do the simple tasks I gave as examples to why I might occasionally just go thru a wired hookup for a quick dirty dub solution. My point is, not ALL of us here can be bothered to monkey around with that software for rarely-performed tasks, even the free stuff. People are very quick to shoot from the hip and suggest this or that "free" program to do one thing or another: that's fine if you have the head for fooling with it but if you are frazzled as I am most of the time it isn't the right choice. My interpretation of the OPs tone is that he's comparing a straight-off dub using backup software vs a straight-off dub using a wired connection between two machines. He even brings up a point I'd forgotten: if you're backing up a new kid flick for the car portable, and it uses new encryption that "breaks" your backup software, the resulting disc may not play in the car. But a "wired" backup WILL, because it circumvents all the decryption crap. If you're heading out the next day and your decryption software hasn't released an update yet, the wired backup gets the job done while you pack the suitcases. The kids don't care if its hi-def or just adequate, it's on a 7-9" portable screen fer crissakes.

Same diff with grabbing a small portion of a DVD9- if its 5 minutes long and I don't want the entire DVD9 compressed to fit an entire DVD5, I'll do a wired dub. It often comes out clearer than the compression algorithm and again, I didn't want the whole damn disc anyway. Could I do this lossless in software? Sure. Just don't want to be bothered. Don't have the software installed. Ditto adding custom chapters to a pre-authored work: I'd rather do it by remote on my big screen while I relax on the sofa. I alternate between PC and Mac at work all friggin day and half the night, so at home I'm set-top centric and love editing on my Pioneer HDD/DVD. Got no interest whatsoever in PC reauthoring- the generic menu options the Pio gives me are fine for my purposes. The Pio's simple cuts-only editing on the half second is a no-brainer too. Would I be so casual if the project was of vital importance? Of course not! I'd load the necessary software, buckle down, and get to work it. I'm talking about very limited personal-use situations here, that's all. If you want to manage the alphabet soup of freeware necessary to make very occasional clip grabs or once-a-year custom chapter marking for a presentation, more power to you: everyone has their own style.

Most of my burning involves archiving from cable and transferring from VHS: I rarely need to do anything edit-wise with a commercial DVD other than complete backup for use in a portable player or the car. For that chore, I paid the asking fee for CloneDVD/AnyDVD. Not the best quality but pretty good, not the most flexible but pretty good, most importantly it installs/upgrades without a hitch on any PC and works every damn time making perfect backups with functional menus even if I delete unnecessary bonus junk. That's my priority, it may not be yours: that's why there are multiple options out there. And yes, I only back up my own purchased DVDs for repurposing, if I want something I don't have yet, I just wait out the 60 days it takes for the studios to reprice it as $9.95 catalog title and then buy it on sale.

I'm hardly "blind": I hate cable/satellite compression artifacts, I feel most flat panels suck, I switch from my Pioneer to my JVC for recordings over 130 mins, and use insanely expensive DVHS recorders to make my VHS transfers: I'm as quality-conscious as anyone here. I'm just perhaps more flexible with my expectations depending on the final use/situation and less interested in computer solutions for non-critical output. It takes all kinds to make a world, kids, is all I'm saying. Don't rush to judge.

[coody]

You did not made something blind. But, a Sony hater did. He never understands people have their own experience and choices. That Sony hater was so blind to all.

[Noahtuck]

You did not made something blind. But, a Sony hater did. He never understands people have their own experience and choices. That Sony hater was so blind to all.

Ummmm..... yeah....

[CubDukat]

I tested the COBY DVD player by disabling both of region and Macrovision. The code can be found in the DVD hack section. However, the Philip DVD recorder still cannot record the DVD movie. Probably due to the other than Macrovision protection. It seems disabling DVD player Macrovision has become meaningless unless the DVD recorder itself can ignore the DVD protection.

I think that may be because when DVD was first created, there was no Macrovision in the actual video signal on the DVD. Rather, there was a flag in the signal which switched it on in the player's decoder hardware. Needless to say, it was eventually decided that that idea wasn't going to fly (hack the decoder, you have a pure high-quality signal), so they went back to putting it on the actual DVD as well.

But that's a moot point since it's illegal to sell a DVD player in the US without Macrovision anyways. Gotta love that DMCA, huh?

[orsetto]

What's really mind-boggling is how some studios go to more extreme lengths to "protect" obscure catalog titles that sell for $9.95 than they do with new blockbusters that sell for $30. If you ever want to see Macrovision at its ugliest and most difficult to tame, pick up the Fox DVD of the classic B&W comedy-drama "The Ghost And Mrs. Muir". Now, this is a great film well known to fans of 1940s-era flicks, but overall WHO would even think to rip it off? Anyone aware of it enough to want it at all would just pay the $12 street price at any well-stocked megastore. I did, and tried to back it up for my Gran to watch on a long car trip using a machine-to-machine hookup (this was in the days before I discovered backup software).

Lo and behold, this DVD strobes from dark to light rapidly enough to induce hypnotic fits and is utterly unwatchable if patched thru other equipment. Along with the severe Macrovision visual cues, it has other protection nasties. For kicks I tried every clarifier I ever owned, even dug one from the '80s out of my garage. NOTHING would make this thing watchable, not even the self-programming adaptive "The Box" that cost me $300 back in 1989 and still clears every current Macro I throw at it (except this Fox nightmare). Eventually curiosity drove me to borrow a Sima CT-200 from a friend, and that finally fixed it. Nothing else did, not even industrial Panasonic and iDen TBC boxes. All this lockdown for a movie that runs for free 6 times a year on TCM and AMC and PBS. Sheesh.

No other disc ever gave me that much trouble before or since. Of course later I discovered CloneDVD2 and AnyDVD and lived happily ever after, but still.... are they for real?