dvdfab vs lawyers

[nagihcim1]

I'm sure someone out there knows about courts and lawyers for dvd copying more then me and can answer this question. Will dvdfab decrypter be shut down like dvd decrypter? It seems like dvdfab and anydvd are the two major players right now and they would be the ones the movie companies would be going after right now. Any have any insights on this?

[SCDVD]

It's not going to happen unless you plan to invade China.

[jagabo]

Slysoft (AnyDVD) is based in Antigua.

[nagihcim1]

So because they based outside of the US there is nothing legally that Hollywood can do?

[MOVIEGEEK]

So because they based outside of the US there is nothing legally that Hollywood can do?

They can bitch and moan. :P

Seriously,the US government could make it illegal to use the software but there is no way they could enforce it.
It already is illegal in the US to make copies of DVD's under the DMCA and copyright laws...except under certain conditions.

[jagabo]

It's even better than that:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/22/business/worldbusiness/22gambling.html?_r=3

In an unusual ruling on Friday at the World Trade Organization, the Caribbean nation of Antigua won the right to violate copyright protections on goods like films and music from the United States

lol!

[jman98]

So because they based outside of the US there is nothing legally that Hollywood can do?

You are correct. There is NOTHING Hollywood can do unless they can somehow convince Antigua to crack down on this. Given how the US doesn't play fair according to the WTO (see the link in jagabo's post), I'm finding it hard to believe that Hollywood could make tiny Antigua care about it.

[SCDVD]

You know if Hollywood and the sleazes they hang out with would spend as much energy and money on well-conceived marketing plans as they do with their futile copy protection gimmicks, they would be a lot better off. Smartly established price points, promotions and all the things that marketing departments do within well run companies are not being given the attention that should be given to these things. If you sell ten products for $19.95 each or 100 for $11.95 each, in which case do you make the most money? Sure Hollywood has fixed cost of goods like any industry does but you can't convince me they are doing a professional job from a marketing point of view within the Hollywood companies. I honestly believe that all their flap about copy protection stunts is more a smoke screen to cover their asses politically within their companies than anything else. When the management of these Hollywood companies stands before the Board of Directors and the Board of Directors stands before the stockholders, the copy protection issue is their excuse for everything. The Board of Directors in these operations would serve their own interests well if their response to this song and dance was "Bullshit! Now go and come back with a real marketing plan and not a bunch of excuses. If you can't do it, we will find someone who can!"

[oldandinthe way]

The WTO ruling is INSANE.

This provides plenty of ammunition for isolationists everywhere.

Taking individual rights to intellectual property as retaliation for a nations desire to prohibit gambling is beyond the rights of governments let alone international bureaucrats.

I believe the RIAA and MPAA to be a bunch of scumbags but the WTO has them beat by a mile.

A bit more of this crap and they can kiss free trade goodby.

[jagabo]

Taking individual rights to intellectual property as retaliation for a nations desire to prohibit gambling is beyond the rights of governments let alone international bureaucrats.

The USA is not interested in prohibiting gambling. Its trying to prohibit offshore gambling to protect onshore interests.

Every country appeals to the WTO to protect their own interests and ignores it when convenient.

[oldandinthe way]

Taking individual rights to intellectual property as retaliation for a nations desire to prohibit gambling is beyond the rights of governments let alone international bureaucrats.

The USA is not interested in prohibiting gambling. Its trying to prohibit offshore gambling to protect onshore interests.

Every country appeals to the WTO to protect their own interests and ignores it when convenient.

Bullshit

The US allows its individual states to make their own decisions about gambling. Some allow it, some don't.

Although the states who permit gambling, may be interested in eliminating offshore competition, the Federal government has no such agenda.

The WTO complaint and decision were an unforeseen infringement of national sovereignity. No EXPLICIT free trade in gambling exists in any agreement or treaty.

This dispute stems from the US government blocking American banks from transfering credit/debit card p[ayments to casinos. Well within the rights of a nation to control its currency. Similar to the restrictions to the amount of cash you can take out of many countries.

If Antiqua wants to take credit cards in its casinos, let them issue their own - but they won't be Mastercard, Visa, American Express or Discover.

[jagabo]

The US allows its individual states to make their own decisions about gambling. Some allow it, some don't.

Although the states who permit gambling, may be interested in eliminating offshore competition, the Federal government has no such agenda.

States can't appeal to the WTO. The feds do it on their behalf. Of course the real agenda is the taxation of winnings. And of course, it fits in with the far right holier-than-thou agenda.

This dispute stems from the US government blocking American banks from transfering credit/debit card p[ayments to casinos.

No, it's the other way around. The feds wanted to stop offshore gambling. Simply passing laws to make it illegal wasn't effective -- it's too hard to track and prosecute individuals. So they blocked the banks.

Well within the rights of a nation to control its currency.

It has nothing to do with controlling currency. Why don't the feds block other credit card transfers to Antigua if they're interesting in controlling currency? It's all about evil gambling and taxes.

[oldandinthe way]

Damn right its about evil gambling.

If Americans want to gamble they can pass laws to enable them to. In many states they haven't. And where they have there are restrictions.

Plenty of Americans travel abroad and gamble. It is their right so long as the country they visit permits gambling. They have no right to gamble in their living rooms or offices.

There is no right for a casino in Antigua to use American banking institutions and American currency.

If an American wishes to gamble in Antigua they can place funds in an offshore bank (within the limits prescribed by US law) and pay their offshore casino.

If the US wishes to outlaw gambling or any other vice where one of the parties to that vice is in the US, that is its sovereign right. If it wishes to make offshore gambling inconvenient, so be it.

The WTO decision is based solely on cutting off the credit cards. And is more likely to be an attempt to undermine US control of banking channels, than protecting poor little Antigua.

It is likely that the next round of trade talks will face greater than the usual difficulties, as increased scrutiny for unintended activities occurs. And there will be a far lower chance of Congressional ratification of any agreement. Go Antigua.

[orsetto]

From the perspective of someone who owned a popular independent video store in a middle-class New York City neighborhood from 1985-1993, I'd like to say Hollywood Inc. makes me GAG every time I'm subjected to one of their utterly idiotic, misleading, self-serving statements about "casual copying". The number one most irritating bromide they push over and over again is that "they lose 3-5-7-9-100 trillion dollars every year due to the casual home copier who would totally spend $1000 more a year on DVDs (VHS back in the day) if only copying was absolutely impossible".

Bullcrap!!! As SCDVD so aptly said in his post, this is a lame excuse for all these overpaid execs to prop up the status quo and do diddly-squat to produce, innovate, market and price their output more attractively. The plain fact is the vast majority of consumers have absolutely no interest in owning more than a dozen videos, they never have and they never will. About the only thing that would motivate these people to buy a LOT more DVDs would be to make the purchase price competitive with a rental, say $4.99 for a new release. But even in the unlikely event Hollywood agreed to try this, almost immediately some wise-ass at Blockbuster or NetFlix would drop the rental rate to 25 cents a night and strangle the whole idea. So Hollywood needs to get over it- the business as its now structured does better for them than they have any right to expect. They would be drowning in profits if they rolled back the out-of-control budgets. I mean, seriously, is there ANY reason why a film like "Georgia Rules" with Jane Fonda and Lindsay Lohan should cost $75 million to produce? Especially when they know full well said film has no market whatsoever outside the US and Canada? Are they kidding?

Instead of saying, "Geez! We've actually kept this cash-cow home video scam at peak levels for almost 30 years and subsidized all our grossly overpaid theatrical artists with it! Wow!", all they do is bitch and moan and delude themselves that there is a vast untapped market that would inflate sales by 10,000% if only casual copying was impossible. The sad thing is, they delude (and bribe) influential government officials into believing the same nonsense. The truth is, casual copying now has so many hurdles that it IS all but impossible for most people unless they REALLY want to make the effort. And thanks to the convenience of NetFlix rentals and purchase price drops on new releases from $24.99 to $8.99 ninety days after initial marketing, there's much less incentive than there used to be for the average viewer to even bother with casual copying: if they want it, they'll buy it when it hits $10 or less. Hollywood needs to face reality: market conditions are now 90% of where they need to be to encourage the largest number of possible purchases of their product. The pie is not going to magically get bigger if they keep adding more pointless copy protections and burdensome legislation.

Fight large-scale black market and criminal piracy? Absolutely, I'm completely in favor of that. But war on that front requires a different strategy than the one used to frustrate the paying consumer. Hollywood needs to stop "bundling" the occasional (and perfectly legal) consumer DVD backup issue with large scale criminal piracy. It defeats their own goals and in the end drains the support they would otherwise have from consumers.

[Nilfennasion]

I have (almost) never bought a film on any format that I was not already such a big fan of that I wanted to eat, sleep, breathe, and shit it. Been given a few, but that is another story. Hollywood should be grateful for casual copying, because it gives people who might otherwise never buy the film on anything a chance to see something that knocks their socks off.

If I had not been shown someone else's copy of Blade Runner in 1993, I would probably not have recently spent in excess of a hundred dollars (local currency) buying an SD-DVD and importing the Blu-Ray. Considering how easy it already is to copy the former, were I a studio head, I would be putting the most prolific "pirates" on the payroll, asking them to come up with ways to encourage sales.

[oldandinthe way]

Orsetto

Reasonable pricing, and higher quality product would remove some motivation to pirate, but the aggression from too much cocaine would still spur the pursuit of pirates.

[Dv8ted2]

You know if Hollywood and the sleazes they hang out with would spend as much energy and money on well-conceived marketing plans as they do with their futile copy protection gimmicks, they would be a lot better off. Smartly established price points, promotions and all the things that marketing departments do within well run companies are not being given the attention that should be given to these things. If you sell ten products for $19.95 each or 100 for $11.95 each, in which case do you make the most money? Sure Hollywood has fixed cost of goods like any industry does but you can't convince me they are doing a professional job from a marketing point of view within the Hollywood companies. I honestly believe that all their flap about copy protection stunts is more a smoke screen to cover their asses politically within their companies than anything else. When the management of these Hollywood companies stands before the Board of Directors and the Board of Directors stands before the stockholders, the copy protection issue is their excuse for everything. The Board of Directors in these operations would serve their own interests well if their response to this song and dance was "Bullshit! Now go and come back with a real marketing plan and not a bunch of excuses. If you can't do it, we will find someone who can!"

That makes too much sense. That virtually assures you that they will not employ this strategy because it is a well thought out plan. When has the entertainment industry ever been rational with their thinking? They would rather sell you the same thing 50,000 times.

[Seeker47]

Instead of saying, "Geez! We've actually kept this cash-cow home video scam at peak levels for almost 30 years and subsidized all our grossly overpaid theatrical artists with it! Wow!", all they do is bitch and moan and delude themselves that there is a vast untapped market that would inflate sales by 10,000% if only casual copying was impossible. The sad thing is, they delude (and bribe) influential government officials into believing the same nonsense. The truth is, casual copying now has so many hurdles that it IS all but impossible for most people unless they REALLY want to make the effort. And thanks to the convenience of NetFlix rentals and purchase price drops on new releases from $24.99 to $8.99 ninety days after initial marketing, there's much less incentive than there used to be for the average viewer to even bother with casual copying: if they want it, they'll buy it when it hits $10 or less. Hollywood needs to face reality: market conditions are now 90% of where they need to be to encourage the largest number of possible purchases of their product. The pie is not going to magically get bigger if they keep adding more pointless copy protections and burdensome legislation.

Fight large-scale black market and criminal piracy? Absolutely, I'm completely in favor of that. But war on that front requires a different strategy than the one used to frustrate the paying consumer. Hollywood needs to stop "bundling" the occasional (and perfectly legal) consumer DVD backup issue with large scale criminal piracy. It defeats their own goals and in the end drains the support they would otherwise have from consumers.

I couldn't agree with you MORE ! [the entire post]