DVD overburning. Is it possible?

[eroy]

I'm using Nero 6. I have a 4.6MB file I wan to burn. I've enabled DVD Overburning, but still can't burn.
Keep getting error that the burning failed.
I have LG 4167B burner.
Is there anyway to Overburn DVD-R?

Thanks!

[pippas]

Use DVD Shrink to make it fit, and then burn with Imgburn.

[mats.hogberg]

Is there anyway to Overburn DVD-R?

No.

/Mats

[lordsmurf]

Apparently you can overburn, but DVD players tend to halt when reading the disc. One of my very first DVD's back in 2001 was overburned, because the software and hardware at the time was more allowing. It happened, and I didn't know it for several years. These days, a few burners purposely have this built in, but it's silly to use it. Again, players are not made to read outside that area, and it's an out-of-spec DVD-Video disc. Not smart to do that.

[jman98]

In theory Nero will allow you to try this, but DVD discs aren't like CD discs. I would expect failed burns almost all the time and if you are lucky enough to get one to work, you'll have the same problems as lordsmurf talks about. Even coming close to filling a DVD, say at 99% in use, can cause problems for playback on some players. There is no reason for overburning. It's too risky.
Either split the file between 2 discs or use DVDShrink or DVDRebuilder to shrink it down to where it will fit properly.

[ark]

You can go to cdfreaks forum and go through a number of threads on this subject.
I had tried DVD-R overburning using my BENQ writer (it allows) but Nero would not do it. Imageburn would permit but you should prepare an .iso file first

[videobread]

To overburn I shrink to a little over 4464 and the burn. I don't use Nero. Have not found a player yet they don't play in, but the rippers will not make copies of the overshrunk DVD.

[VegasBud]

Is it possible to overburn a dvdr? Yes, if you use specific burners and specific software.

Should you overburn a dvdr? I certainly wouldn't...not even on a drunken dare. Here's why:

Reason #1
The Information Zone on a dvdr is divided into three zones arranged in the following order:
Lead-in Zone
Data Zone
Lead-out Zone

Predictably, the dvd-video data is written to the Data Zone. It has a finite size, which is the normal data capacity of the disk. To overburn (exceed the data capacity of the disk), data is also written to the Lead-out Zone, which is a reserved area on the disk. As lordsmurf pointed out, that makes it out of spec. The Lead-out Zone is there for good reason. Mucking around with it (or any other part of the specifications) is a bad idea.

Reason #2:
As jman98 pointed out, the outer edge of a dvdr is the most susceptible to errors. In joint testing conducted by the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST), the Optical Storage Technology Association (OSTA), and the DVD Association (DVDA), they found that 76% of failures occurred in the outer 10% of the disk, most significantly in the outer 5% of the disk. When the outer 10% of the disk wasn't used, playback compatibilty rose to 98%, which is why they recommend not filling a disk to capacity. Considering their findings, actually overfilling a disk is something to be avoided at all cost.

[videobread]

Overburning is a form of "poor man's" copy protection. If you are burning for your own use, your own collection, there is no reason to overburn.

[lordsmurf]

Overburning is a form of "poor man's" copy protection. If you are burning for your own use, your own collection, there is no reason to overburn.

It's not a copy protection. It's screwing up your disc to non-compliance. It's not the same or even close to the same.

If that's how you want to "protect" discs, then don't half-ass it, go all the way. Microwave the disc, maybe put it in a blender or run it over with the lawnmower. It's basically the same effect, ruining the disc to the point of being useless.

[videobread]

The DVD spec is not something to be afraid of. You are not Sony making runs of millions of copies. The DVD spec police are not going to show up at your door. If you don't have any first hand knowledge with over burning, I suggest you experiment a little before accepting the opinion of others. Come to your own conclusions. Too many opinions and too few facts add to general confusion. It's like the blind leading the deaf, dumb and blind.

I've never tried the microwave tip so I can't comment.

[VegasBud]

The DVD spec is not something to be afraid of.

Not only should you not be afraid of the dvd-video and associated specifications, you should embrace them warmly. They are your friends, and all that stands between you and unplayable dvds.

If you don't have any first hand knowledge with over burning, I suggest you experiment a little before accepting the opinion of others.

I've never stuck my finger in a light socket while standing in a pool of water, but I have a complete understanding of what the result would be, and know that's it's something I want no part of.

Too many opinions and too few facts add to general confusion.

Facts...as in truth and reality are abundant and readily available. All you have to do is use google. I suggest you start with the dvd-video specification, followed by the volume and file structure specifications.

It's not an opinion that overburning violates the specifications, it's a fact. It's not an opinion that the only reason dvd-videos work is the close adherence to the specifications by the manufacturers of the disks, burners, players, and content providers...that's also a fact.

An opinion would be what I have regarding the ill-considered use of any specification-breaking "trick" as a form of cheap copy protection. As far as I'm concerned, the deliberate introduction of a defect in a product offered for sale, especially when the defect is sufficient to affect the usability of said product, is a foolish business practice.

It's like the blind leading the deaf, dumb and blind.

A more appropriate saying would be "None so blind as those who will not see". If you're not familiar with it, here's an interpretation from UsingEnglish.com:

This idiom is used when people refuse to accept facts presented to them.

[Alan69]

I'm using Nero 6. I have a 4.6MB file I wan to burn. I've enabled DVD Overburning, but still can't burn.
Keep getting error that the burning failed.
I have LG 4167B burner.
Is there anyway to Overburn DVD-R?

Thanks!

Considering "4.6MB file" and your rough usage of the term, overburning likely doesn't have anything to do with your problem. Overburning is very specific for putting a little extra data beyond the normal full capacity at the outside edge of the burn. It has nothing to do with fixing any normal burn failure, or rewriting to an already burned DVD, which it sounds like you may be interpreting it as, judging from only these few sentences..

[nwo]

BeAll Extreme eXtended 124-minute (4x) DVD-R

These Extreme eXtended discs from BeAll are unusual in that they have a 124min (4.85GB) capacity to squeeze on a longer movie or more data.

The top surface is soft frosted silver with blue and silver logo marks. May be suitable for part printing with some thermal printers (not inkjet).

ADVDInfo: BeAll G40001
Packaging: Retail branded spindle tubs of 50 discs.

http://svp.co.uk/product/beall_extreme_extended_124_minus_minute_(4x)_dvd_m inus_r_3534#reviews

[videobread]

Hey Bambi, at least we can all agree that there is a way to Overburn DVD-R.

[lordsmurf]

BeAll discs may have been longer in theory, but the media rarely burned well. It was about on par with Princo quality, with errors all over the tail end of the burn. That was a failed experiment. What's available is old stock, they've not made those discs in years. And I believe the discs's size still violated the specification.

[Midzuki]

VegasBud wrote:

Not only should you not be afraid of the dvd-video and associated specifications,
you should embrace them warmly. They are your friends (sic),

I think this pseudo-hijack is somewhat necessary because some people apparently do not
(want to?) make a clear distinction between the volume and file-structure specifications of a
red-laser optical disk and the "official" specifications for the DVD-Video format. They do not
go hand-in-hand together, so to speak, at least the first one does not depend on the latter,
I mean. I have no complaints about the data recording specifications for the red-laser disks,
but I and several other "trolls" do not approve certain parts of the DVD-Video specs.
More precisely, I want to say the VOB container is not incompatible with other
video resolutions/GOP sizes/quantize matrices/whatever/
than the ones dictated by the DVD-Forum *****s (place your favorite insulting word here ).
What would be your opinions if someone came tell you "please do not put CD-DA content
on a recordable disk because the oldest players cannot detect burned media" or "please do not
create mp3-CDs because the older CD players can decode PCM-audio only"

P.S.: Speaking of certain facts:

1) NTSC standalones are not obliged to support MP2-audio;

2) there still is no place for MP3-audio in the DVD-Video specs;

3) however the DVD-Forum specs managed to find some room for the DTS;

In the facts mentioned above, I do not see "friendliness" at all ---
all I see is a mixture of intellectual lazyness and commercial interests.

[videobread]

I get a kick out people blowviating about the "DVD spec" they have never seen let alone read. I bet that I could count the number of people on this forum who have read the "DVD spec", or could understand it, on one hand. Remember, it costs money.

This is a good source for info: http://dvd.wwwdotorg.org/specs/specs.html

The "DVD spec" is a guideline that DVD hardware manufactures and content creators use so that they are all on the same page. To make sure that DVD's play in consumer players. The "DVD spec" is about Sony and Panasonic and DVD-ROM and DVD-9's! DVD-9's! DVD-9's! Some mention is made of DVD-5, but very minimal.

Video Help Forum members are burning DVD-5's! DVD-5's! DVD-5's! No one cares what you do with your DVD-5's. Minimally over burnt DVD-5's play in as many DVD players as other DVD-5's. Over burning is one of many forms of "poor man's" copy protection. Over burning does not apply to DVD-9's. It is not the answer for Hollywood.

(Ps: I know blowviator is not a word, it just seems to apply on the internet.)

[VegasBud]

Midzuki,

I thought that when I said:

I suggest you start with the dvd-video specification, followed by the volume and file structure specifications.

that it was clear that they are different specifications. If that wasn't clear enough, then I have no problem saying it very specifically now. There are also other specifications that relate to different aspects of making a dvd.

I understand that you might have set things up differently, if you were directing the development of the standards. There are things that I might have done differently, too. It really doesn't matter, though, because what we've got is what we've got. I consider the specifications as friends because they allow virtually anyone to make a dvd that will play in virtually any dvd player. I never said, or meant to imply that they are friendly. At least to me, they're two different concepts.

[VegasBud]

Rather than put any more time and effort into beating this dead horse, I'll try to dispel some of the latest myths, and then I'm done here.

Anyone who has seen the official dvd-video specifications would be bound by the required Non-Disclosure Agreement. That doesn't mean you can't find the knowledge it contains. There are places like dvd-replica, mpucoder's site, documentation at sourceforge, etc. that will provide you with anything you want to know. If you're a programmer, the source code for programs that have proven themselves to be reliable can be a valuable resource. The source codes for FixVTS and PgcEdit, in particular, are very well commented.

The specifications for dvd-5 were around long before the specifications for dvd-9. There is more reference material available for dvd-5 than dvd-9. ECMA is a good source for that information.

For the last time (at least from me), overburning adversely affects playback compatibility.

One final piece of advice to anyone reading this thread...anytime someone advocates ignoring specifications, be careful. Dvds are only widely compatible because of those specifications. If you go outside the specifications, the price is paid in playback compatibility.

[videobread]

It's funny how copy protection threads start out as it can't be done and end up as it shouldn't be done. Go figure!!!

[vcd4ever]

Minimally over burnt DVD-5's play in as many DVD players as other DVD-5's.

Yes, my oppinion is also that a minimally overburned dvd shouldn't cause any playback problems in dvd players.

You can also avoid the chance of playback problems by authoring a dvd with a dummy vts and making sure that the dummy vts is placed in the overburn area and that the dummy vts is never played.

Overburning a dvd is most likley against the spec, but you have already violated the spec by adding the protection, so why not also use overburn.

It's funny how copy protection threads start out as it can't be done and end up as it shouldn't be done. Go figure!!!

vcd4ever.

[guns1inger]

It's funny how copy protection threads start out as it can't be done and end up as it shouldn't be done. Go figure!!!

Actually, if you read the responses they are saying that copy protection that does not void the specification or interfere with playback compatibility is annoying, but not an issue. Idiotic schemes hatched by people who simply ignore the specification because they don't like it or don't agree with it, are what people take issue with. VideoHelp prides itself for being a trusted source of information. Handing out poor advice is not something that is encouraged, and therefore such advice will usually be argued against strenuously.

You can also avoid the chance of playback problems by authoring a dvd with a dummy vts and making sure that the dummy vts is placed in the overburn area and that the dummy vts is never played

Surely the safer option, if this is your best advice, is to simply ditch the dummy VTS so that the disc remains within the disc capacity, and there is then no need to overburn and risk problems.

[mats.hogberg]

It's funny how copy protection threads start out as it can't be done and end up as it shouldn't be done. Go figure!!!

It's not so funny at all, lately all threads seems to have turned into DVD Copy Protection threads.
For those who can read, this thread is about if it's possible to overburn a DVD.
Stay on topic please.

/Mats

[[_chef_]]

You can overburn onto DVD+R some MB depending on the used dvd burner.
Either BenQ 1640 or some Plextor 708/716 should allow this.

Browse cdfreaks forum for specific info.

[vcd4ever]

Plextor DVDR PX-760A can also overburn DVD+R. All Plextor burners that supports overburning DVD's only supports overburning on DVD+R media.

vcd4ever.

[Alan69]

It's funny how copy protection threads start out as it can't be done and end up as it shouldn't be done. Go figure!!!

It's not so funny at all, lately all threads seems to have turned into DVD Copy Protection threads.
For those who can read, this thread is about if it's possible to overburn a DVD.
Stay on topic please.

/Mats

Huh?

No, for those who can read past what is likely a neophyte user's mistake, this thread SHOULD be about helping this person get burning or burning again.

That someone saw a setting for 'overburn', mentioned the term in their post, and everone decides to jump on one term instead of trying to read what the person has actually said, does not mean that is what the original poster was talking about.

Another exercise in poor logic by the masses at Videohelp. Even if you made the basic assumption from what they wrote that it WAS something to do with overburning, first thing out of your fingers should be asking for clarification, to make sure that is what they're even talking about and not just mentioning the term from seeing it in settings. And it'd be a piss poor assumption in the first place, when is the last time you wrote only a 4.6MB file and whether or not it burned had anything to do with overburning? From the text in the original poster's message, it doesn't look like even mentioning the overburn setting is anything but a minor mistake that the OP made in thinking that it has anything to do with their burn not working. How anyone can read that text and jump to the conclusion there needs to be a huge discussion on actual overburning is beyond me, not hard to read that and realize they probably don't really understand what the overburn setting even is.

" I have a 4.6MB file I wan to burn. I've enabled DVD Overburning, but still can't burn.
Keep getting error that the burning failed. "

As in tried to write it, didn't work, found a setting called 'DVD Overburning', set it, tried again, and still can't burn. It's quite 'there' that his finding an 'overburn' setting probably doesn't have a thing in the world to do with his not getting a successful burn. Hard to see how so many can fail to read the English, think through what an inexperienced user might do or assume wrong, and realize that.

[videobread]

Over burning is possible on both DVD-R and DVD+R, with all burning software and with any make burner, new or old.

[[_chef_]]

Over burning is possible on both DVD-R and DVD+R, with all burning software and with any make burner, new or old.

Since when?

Please give specific info how that should be possible.

@Alan69,

I think you are wrong with what you wrote.
The OP most likely made a typo, that also shows his sentence "Is there anyway to Overburn DVD-R?"!

And the answers were given.

[mats.hogberg]

How much can you overburn, and still have the disk reliably readable by most readers?

/Mats