Distortion at top of screen

[Theresa]

Hello all--
I am capturing a 7 yr. old VHS-C tape via a JVC HR-S9800U to a Datavideo TBC-1000 to a ADVC110 capture card. The TBC on the VCR is off. I am getting this distortion on the clip I hope I uploaded correctly. Should I mess with the video calibration on the VCR? Any other ideas? I'm still a noob, so I might need a translation with techno-terms.

Thanks
Theresa

thomas%202000.bmp

[Theresa]

I'm so sorry--I just read that I have posted this in the wrong forum--I should have put it in the Newbie/General forum. Can I be moved there?

sorry
Theresa

[redwudz]

Our Restoration forum may be better. Moving you.

[johns0]

Have you tried another vcr?,looks like the tracking could be way off.

[Theresa]

No, I haven't. I don't have another nearly as good as this one, but if this one is off, it isn't doing me any good anyway.

Thanks!
Theresa

[Marvingj]

On your VCR do you have the TBC on , if so it might conflict with the tbc -1000. Try making the adjustment. Also try playing tape in another VCR to see whether or not if its the VCR or tape.....

[Theresa]

Thanks for your reply. It does have a TBC/NR and I have tried capturing with it on and off, taking out the external TBC, putting it back in, all different combinations. The TBC on the VCR makes the tape role, where as with the external one, I see the distortion I posted. *sigh* I'm going to get some needed cables so I can see the picture on a TV and I can fiddle with the VCR functions to see if I can get a difference. It just may be the tape; I tried the tape on my cheapie Quasar and, though I didn't see the same distortion exactly, it rolls and there is some static. So the tape isn't in good shape; I just need to figure out how to capture it without the distortion.

Thanks
Theresa

[Theresa]

I've tried everything I know, but still the same distortion. Is there a filter I can apply that will take this out? Has anyone seen this kind of distortion before?

Thanks
Theresa

[johns0]

That distortion is a tracking problem,if you cant track it out then it was recorded that way and no filter or tbc will clean it up.

[gadgetguy]

Are you connected via S-Video or Composite? I have seen similar distortion from my JVC HR-VP770U over S-Video that didn't appear on Composite.

[Theresa]

Thank you both for replying. I have tried manual tracking, but it is still there. It will 'roll' at the worst part of tracking, until I readjust it.
I am connected via S-Video. So, we have a mystery. Is this also called 'flagging' or 'tearing'? It seems like something could clear it up--it's not on any of the other tapes I have of the same era and recorded with the same camera. And the first part of the tape doesn't have it. Go figure.

Thanks again so much

Theresa

[gadgetguy]

Try it with composite and see if it still looks the same. Otherwise it's probably tape damage and there's not much you'll be able to do.

[Theresa]

By composite, do you mean the red, yellow and white RCA cables? I am using them, also. Are they to be used together? Thanks again for your help with this.

Theresa

[redwudz]

Composite is yellow for video and red and white for the two stereo audio channels.

What you might check: Take the VHS cassette out of the VCR. Push the small button on the left side and open the cover. Take a look at the tape, particularly the edges. If it is cupped and the edges show uneven wear, then the tape may be damaged and there is not much a VCR can do.

More likely it was recorded on a out-of-spec VCR and unless you can find another unit with the same flaw, you may have a hard time playing it back properly. Not much advice there except to try different VCR's.

If it's a valuable tape, you might look to a professional company to recover it. As long as you can see the results before you pay.

[lordsmurf]

I disagree on the tracking issue, at least at first. In my experience, that sort of on-screen glitch appears to be physical damage to the tape itself. Tell me, is the magnetic tape clean and free of crinkles, rips, creases, or other debris?

Skimming posts one more time, it seems redwudz is thinking something similar.

Another experience is regarding the VHS-C format and the JVC HR-S9800U. Mine doesn't like the -C format in an adapter. It never has. I often think it's my one unit, not the series, but I've never had the ability to verify against somebody else. On the other hand, my SR-V10U is just fine with VHS-C and S-VHS-C tapes (part of the reason I bought it).

I'd need to almost see the tape, or at very minimum a video capture (not just a still) of the problem in motion. Some of these tape problems are a real pest, but most of them can be corrected.

[Theresa]

Thank you, so much redwudz & lordsmirf for replying. Sorry, I was gone all morning.
I have looked at the tape and I see just a tiny bit of cupping on the edges. I recorded it on a Panasonic VHS-C player that is now out of commission, so I can't replay it on that camera. I played it on my old Quasar VCR and the distortion showed up as a horizontal line of static a third of the way down from the top. I have captured several tapes of this era and older than this, recorded on the same camera, without this problem
I have a tape-cleaner in which I use isopropyl alcohol and have cleaned it twice with that. I have never uploaded a clip of a video--I'll see if I can figure it out.
Thank you so very much for weighing in on this. It matter more than I can say.

Theresa

[Theresa]

One thing I forgot to mention. Upon doing some research into some conversations here about this problem, which I think was called 'flagging', I saw where the Panasonic ES10 was recommended. Could that help in this instance?

Theresa

[edDV]

The first issue that needs clarification is:

Do other tapes play correctly? Is this a single tape issue?

If so 90% of the responses above don't apply. Single tape issues relate to how that tape was recorded and handled.

Do you have other tapes recorded on that same camcorder around the same time that play correctly? Can you record a tape now on that camcorder and compare?

Issue here is if the problem is with the camcorder or tape. If you can record a good tape now on that camcorder, then the issue is probably a damaged tape.

[Theresa]

Thanks for your reply, edDV, as well as your help with past issues. Other tapes play fine; this is the first tape of many I have captured that has this problem, and yes, other tapes of this same era--I recorded every second, it seems, of my son's life in this time period--have captured perfectly. The camcorder, unfortunatly, was knocked to the ground by a fellow fourth-grader and the door is jammed. I have to find a better technician than what is here locally to fix it. Tapes recorded after this time period have also captured just fine. So, it's probably confined to just this tape. I tried to up load a clip--55.5 MB worth--but I finally just got a 'Cannot find server' page and no upload. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong there, so any suggestions would be put to good use!

Theresa

[edDV]

Next issue is whether the tear shows on just a portion of the tape. Examine the tape in those places for creases or edge damage. Flatten and wind back on the hub as flat as you can.

Restoration experts would unload it from the cassette to an open reel, then attempt to repair the tape.

[Theresa]

Ok, will do. The first 10 minutes of the tape is fine. I started recording again at a different time, and there it is, then it's there for the rest of the tape. All I see is a tiny bit of 'curling', and it's not in every place. I'll rewind it to the place it started the distortion and see if I can see a difference at that point on the tape. What's the safest way to 'flatten' the tape? I don't want to touch it.

Theresa

[edDV]

If it isn't creased, just widing will flatten it some. Not much else you can do beyond unfolding it.

[Theresa]

This is going to be a stupid question: How do I release the lock on the tape to wind it manually? Do I need to take it apart?

[ . . . becoming a pest . . . ]

Theresa

[Theresa]

Ok, a shot in the dark. All the tapes I put into the VCR seem to be kind of put their their paces, so to speak. The VCR winds it forward, rewinds it--it seems to be getting it ready, positioned right. With this particular tape I'm having problems with, it starts playing automatically. Why the difference??

Theresa

[gadgetguy]

Is the record switch set to "off"?

Edit: BTW did you get the manual rewind figured out? If not, turn the tape over, with the flap facing away from you. At the bottom left corner is a hole about an eighth inch diameter. Push a pen or toothpick in the hole. This will release the spindles and you can rewind it manually.

[redwudz]

This is going to be a stupid question: How do I release the lock on the tape to wind it manually? Do I need to take it apart?

[ . . . becoming a pest . . . ]

Theresa

With VHS tapes, there is a small 'window' on the bottom middle of the tape with a spring loaded flap. You push that in and it should release the tape to turn. I have used a pencil on a cassette tape in the drive hole, but your tape may take something larger to turn the spool. Keep a bit of tension on the opposite spool with your finger to keep the tape taunt.

[gadgetguy]

This is going to be a stupid question: How do I release the lock on the tape to wind it manually? Do I need to take it apart?

[ . . . becoming a pest . . . ]

Theresa

With VHS tapes, there is a small 'window' on the bottom middle of the tape with a spring loaded flap. You push that in and it should release the tape to turn. I have used a pencil on a cassette tape in the drive hole, but your tape may take something larger to turn the spool. Keep a bit of tension on the opposite spool with your finger to keep the tape taunt.

I thought we were talking about VHS-C?

[redwudz]

I thought we were talking about VHS-C?

We are, but I assume they are similar to VHS in construction.

[gadgetguy]

This is the hole I was referring to. (Thanks for the pic, redwudz)

[Theresa]

Wow. You guys are so great to take the time to answer in such detail and patience.
Gadgetguy, the tape's record switch was indeed set the 'off'. I switched it to 'on', and the VCR was back to it's 'pre-play' excersizes. Thanks for the tip!
Redwuz, I did as you said, got the tape wound as tight as possible. The distortion is still in evidence. I haven't given up--maybe it's just time for the experts. I was just sure this was within my power to accomplish. I have certainly received the best of advice to that end.
Thank you all so much, and if you have any more ideas, please pass them on.

Theresa