Which DVD Recorder would you recommend?

[DJL82]

Hey everyone,

I'm new here and I enjoy this website a lot. I am interested in purchasing a DVD Recorder that will:

1. Allow me to insert my own chapters when recording from a VHS.
2. Has really good picture quality.

I'm interested in these DVD recorders that have 80 GB of recording or 160 GB. I was considering the Philips DVD Recorder or the Polaroid DVD Recorder with 160 GB.

Does anyone have an opinion on either of the DVD Recorders or can lead me in the right direction on what I should buy?

Thanks a lot,
DJL

[FulciLives]

I like the Pioneer models myself but currently Pioneer has no USA models. This is most likely due to the fact that right now any DVD recorder sold in the USA must have a digital tuner and Pioneer has yet to figure this out. To their credit the first generation of DVD recorders with digital tuners are a bit of a let down so Pioneer is probably waiting for better tuner chipsets to become available ... something that should be happening soon from what I've heard.

However Pioneer is still making DVD recorders and there is an Asian model called the DVR-340H that can be bought from various websites that carry foreign electronics. Here is a link from one such website:

http://www.220-electronics.com/dvdrecorders/pioneer340.htm

The Pioneer DVR-340H is a stand alone DVD recorder with a built-in 80GB HDD. It can record in NTSC or PAL but does no conversion so if you send a NTSC signal to it you must record in NTSC ... if you send a PAL signal to it you must record in PAL etc.

Now why do I like Pioneer models such as this one?

1.) Very easy-to-use

2.) Can set the bitrate in 5-10 minute increments so you can maximize the bitrate for the running time. So if you have a 90 minute movie you can set it to the 90 minute recording mode to max out the bitrate whereas with most other DVD recorders you would have to use the 120 minute mode thus wasting 30 minutes of bitrate.

3.) Exceptional image quality compared to most other DVD recorders. Very good analog to MPEG-2 conversion. Also it can account for 0.0 IRE BLACK LEVEL as well as 7.5 IRE BLACK LEVEL. Has many image adjustment possibilities. Very nice built-in TBC for stabilizing the incoming analog image.

4.) Easy to edit. Easy to place chapters where you want. See point #1

Unfortunately since the DVR-340H is an Asian model the price is a bit on the "high" side but it's as good as you can get right now. Well actually some of the Pioneer Canadian models are nice as well but those seem harder to import into the USA unless you live close enough to Canada that you can go up there and buy one direct from a retail store then drive back to the USA. So for now ... until Pioneer begins making new USA models (which will happen once the digital tuner issues are worked out) ... the DVR-340H is your best bet.

Also please note that there are other Asian models with even bigger built-in Hard Disk Drives but then you are looking at even more money. The DVR-340H has all of the functions that make a Pioneer DVD recorder a Pioneer DVD recorder and 80GB is "enough" although for some people you can never have "enough" HDD space LOL

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[DJL82]

Wow John,

Thanks for the awesome and detailed review. I really appreciate your advice. I see you are from Pittsburgh and was wondering if there are any in your location. I'm further north of Pittsburgh.

So in your opinion then neither the Polaroid or the Philips are really worth purchasing?

DJL

[handyguy]

The two you mentioned are cheap ones. Most of the topics here seem to be about Pinoneer, which you can't buy now, or Panasonics, which can do what you want. Just create a playlist & organize it the way you want to.

Your question is frequently asked, there are lots of reviews:
https://www.videohelp.com/dvdrecorders

[FulciLives]

I was just at the Panasonic website looking at their current line-up of DVD recorders and none of the models listed have a built-in HDD. Very odd since Panasonic always had such models in their past line-ups. The same is true for Toshiba. They once offered a couple of very nice HDD equipped models but right now they only offer non-HDD models.

Pioneer currently makes no DVD recorders at all for the USA market and this is due to the digital tuner issue as I understand it. You have to either buy a Canadian model or one of the Asian models. The model I listed above is one of the Asian models and will work fine in the USA ... it just doesn't have a digital tuner.

Only way to get one of those is to import it or wait for Pioneer to finally make new USA models which I imagine they will once the digital tuner thing is worked out. Although who knows how long that will take? I would imagine sometime in 2008 ... doubt we will see anything in the USA this year.

I guess the one good bit of news here is that although Pioneer has no current USA models they are still making HDD equipped DVD recorders in a variety of other markets. At least they haven't given up on the built-in HDD idea.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[nicky57]

Hey everyone,

I'm new here and I enjoy this website a lot. I am interested in purchasing a DVD Recorder that will:

1. Allow me to insert my own chapters when recording from a VHS.
2. Has really good picture quality.

I'm interested in these DVD recorders that have 80 GB of recording or 160 GB. I was considering the Philips DVD Recorder or the Polaroid DVD Recorder with 160 GB.

Does anyone have an opinion on either of the DVD Recorders or can lead me in the right direction on what I should buy?

Thanks a lot,
DJL

The Phillips seems to be the choice over the Polaroid. You may be able to find a Pioneer or Panasonic on e bay or elsewhere on the net, a much better choice.
Stay away from JVC, do a search and you will see why.

[lordsmurf]

- Phillips has had chronic image quality problems for many years now. Avoid those. Panasonic is the same way. Neither have any advanced functions as requested.
- Pioneer is not the best machine when converting VHS, as it has no quality improvement filters.
- JVC is the best machine, in terms of filtering VHS tapes to better-than-the-tape quality, but it still does not meet your requirements of inserting chapters. Hard drive models are almost non-existent in the USA.

However...
What you want is a Toshiba XS-series machine. It has good hard drives, quality improvement filters, and some flexibility with chapter inserts. You will have to buy this machine online, possibly used or refurbished.

That meets the requirements in your request.

Understand DVD recorders are in a sad state of affairs right now. Most of what is sold in local stores is crap now, with better machines being harder to find and/or discontinued.

[samijubal]

Toshiba, every option you'll ever need and then some. Excellent picture quality, second to none.

[Shopcat]

I have been using a Philips 3575H/37 160 GB HDD
for 3 months.
Both tuners give great quaity, recordings on the HDD & DVD are
great.

I love it and highly recomend it.

Mike

[FulciLives]

Toshiba only ever made a couple of HDD equipped models worth buying and both are long gone ... you might be able to find one on eBay but then chances are something is wrong with it.

Finding a JVC with a HDD is nearly impossible. I think they only ever made one model that disappeared as soon as it came out.

I've heard that the Philips units are junk time and time again. I wouldn't touch them with a 10 foot pole.

I know it sounds silly for me to keep pushing Pioneer since they don't even have any current USA models but they are still turning out DVD recorders elsewhere that do have a built-in HDD and I expect they will be back in the USA with a new model or two etc. once the digital tuner issues get worked out.

If you don't want to to pay a premium for the import Pioneer units then you might want to look for an old Toshiba on eBay or an old Pioneer on eBay. If looking for Pioneer go with the old USA model DVR-640H-s but beware that there is also an import version with the same model number ... you can tell the difference as the USA 640 has a 160GB HDD whereas the import version had a larger HDD (250 if I recall correctly).

I forget the Toshiba models now off the top of my head. Something like SD-XS 34 and SD-XS 35 or something like that. I might have the letters in the wrong order but that's more or less the model numbers.

Someone else confirm please.


- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[lordsmurf]

Confirmed, that is correct. There's a few more too.

[lacywest]

Here are some links for Toshiba

http://www.tacp.toshiba.com/dvr/dvdrecorder.asp

http://www.tacp.toshiba.com/dvd/product.asp?model=rd-xs35

http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/601-3859808-2954517?asin=B000MY38JE&afid=yahoossplp&lnm=B000MY 38JE|Toshiba_DVD_Recorder__DR400&ref=tgt_adv_XSMG1 060

http://www.smarter.com/dvd-recorders/toshiba-rdxs35-dvd-recorder-hdd-recorder/pd--ch-3...pi-209539.html

[FulciLives]

The Toshiba RD-XS34, RD-XS35 and RD-XS55 are the "good" models. All other models should be avoided including the D-R400 model (which has no built-in HDD and lacks bitrate control etc.)

Good luck finding any of those three brand new ... the so-called "in stock" links provided above all say "not available" when you click on them.

I knew all that ... which is why I was telling you to just go with that Asian Pioneer (the DVR-340H) model. At least it is brand new and has a built-in HDD and does all you want ... exceptionally well.

I think I'll bow out of this thread now before I sound like a broken record LOL

Good luck to whatever you end up buying!

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[guns1inger]

Odd that Pioneer are so slow to roll out US models with digital tuners. We started getting them here a couple of months ago. They start at around AUD$699 with a HDD and a single tuner

[trhouse]

I doubt that the manufacturer's are just slow to roll out new hdd models in the US because of available technology when they are using the same technology in non-hdd models. This $74 million judgment for TIVO might slow them down,

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060413-6599.html

considering that their "multimedia time warp system" is,

TiVo's "time warp" patents-the technology that enables users to record and play back programs simultaneously

[DJL82]

Wow all of you guys are amazing. I thank you so much for all of your advice especially in regards to the Pioneer DVD Recorder.

Some questions though in regards to the Toshiba models. Do these models: 1. Allow me to insert my own chapters when recording from a VHS. 2. Have really good picture quality?

If just considering these two concerns I have, would also the Philips model meet my expectation?

I was in Walmart recently and saw the Philips recorder on display, but I saw a note next to it in regards to something about the DVD recorder needing some thing ... I forget what it said but something that things will become digital in 2008 and the recorder is not capatible? I was not quite sure about this. Does anyone know what I'm referring to? Sorry I'm not a great scholar with electronics. Is this a big issue if I purchased the Philips recorder?

Thanks,
DJL

[guns1inger]

They were warning you that it only has an analogue tuner, and that once analogue broadcasts cease, you will need a digital set top box attached to record OTA TV. I already have this type of setup, as do many others here in some form or another (be it OTA or digital cable boxes). Newer recorder models will have digital tuners built-in and so will continue to work.

[DJL82]

Is a digital set top box attached to record OTA TV expensive?

DJL

[handyguy]

To record OTA you need a QAM tuner.

[StuR]

DJL82,
definatly not Philips (no tbc/synch, possible disk coping problems)
if a JVC with HDD was available it would be that, it's likely not so I think Toshiba XS35, Pioneer also. XS have best editting features and best DVD menu creation options, Pioneer are fine in these two elements but has more Rec. Pict. adjustment features (colour, contrast ...)
I'd also constider the two to be reliable.

[Seeker47]

Toshiba only ever made a couple of HDD equipped models worth buying and both are long gone ... you might be able to find one on eBay but then chances are something is wrong with it.

The Toshiba RD-XS34, RD-XS35 and RD-XS55 are the "good" models. All other models should be avoided including the D-R400 model (which has no built-in HDD and lacks bitrate control etc.)

I think it was Davideck who also recommended the KX-50, a somewhat older model. Wasn't the XS34 the one that was said to really need a fan mod (for which there were available Guide links) ? I don't know if this also applied to the XS35 or XS55, but one should probably find out before buying one of these on the used market.

I know it sounds silly for me to keep pushing Pioneer since they don't even have any current USA models but they are still turning out DVD recorders elsewhere that do have a built-in HDD and I expect they will be back in the USA with a new model or two etc. once the digital tuner issues get worked out.

If you don't want to to pay a premium for the import Pioneer units then you might want to look for an old Toshiba on eBay or an old Pioneer on eBay.

Yeah, but I think you are correct about Pio being the class of the field, when they were available. I just hope you are right about the digital tuner issue being the major, temporary stumbling block . . . although past U.S. sales figures for the better, more expensive units and things like that Tivo suit (not to mention MPAA unhappiness about consumers being able to easily record and save their content, or advertisers / networks being unhappy about your ability to zap commercials and otherwise edit) sound like equally convincing factors to me. Keep in mind that those nice Euro models with the digital tuners sell over there for double (or more than double) any price the top U.S. models ever commanded. I also hope that Pioneer won't be carrying through on their once stated intention to have someone else manufacture their DVDRs. A rebranding strikes me as a great opportunity to have a serious drop in quality, whatever price points they wind up at.

By the way -- did you ever try to do anything about that failing burner problem ?

[next]

It is really tough to beat the Toshiba XS series feature for feature. The XS series was not only a DVD recorder but offered substantial editing capabilities not seen in other DVD recorder brands. As I remember the XS series went as follows:

2004
XS32
KX50 (HDMI)
XS52 (HDMI)

2005
XS34
XS54 (HDMI, Networking, Sling Box features)

2006
XS35
XS55 (HDMI, Networking, Sling Box features)

Here's an example of a very little talked about feature - the Sling Box like feature of both the XS54 and XS55. You can sling (stream) content anywhere around the world. This pic is an example of streming to a PC outside of the home network:


Here's full screen streaming:


And here is an example of some of the networking features. You can edit titles, content descriptions, edit content etc using a PC. In this case it is from a notebook PC hooked up to the home network via wifi. The program decription was a cut and paste from IMDB. It is significantly easier to use a computer keyboard as opposed to a remote control for these types of tasks:


I should add that you can log into the recorder from anywhere (in the world) that there is an internet connection - using a Web browser. I use Firefox for this. You can edit content, schedule recordings, etc. You can turn it on remotely if it is powered off after you log in to the XS54/55. And you cn power it down before you log out.

Very powerful.

Discussing the editing features such as custom menus, moving content from machine to machine via ethernet, extensive video mode dubbing options, etc...etc...etc... are really the XS series strengths though.

[DJL82]

OK OK, I admit you guys have sold me on considering a Toshiba. My question now is, are any of these models still available?

[DJL82]

Also what are people's opinions on "refurbished" DVD Recorders, for instance Toshiba? What does this mean?

DJL

[trhouse]

Can any of the Toshiba hdd models do frame accurate edits on the hdd and preserve that accuracy in a high speed copy to dvd? My Pioneer 531H manual says it cannot preserve the accuracy of a frame accurate edit if copied high speed.

[Seeker47]

Can any of the Toshiba hdd models do frame accurate edits on the hdd and preserve that accuracy in a high speed copy to dvd? My Pioneer 531H manual says it cannot preserve the accuracy of a frame accurate edit if copied high speed.

Yeah, but I do frame accurate editing + HS Copy all the time, on the 640 and the earlier 520 model. I guess it's that I-Frame business, but the variance is slight. If you locate your edits carefully, I don't think it's much of a problem.

[FulciLives]

By the way -- did you ever try to do anything about that failing burner problem ?

I gave up on that ... why do you think I know so much about the Asian models ... I plan on buying one myself. Don't have the money at the moment but sooner than later (probably the end of the year) I plan to get the DVR-340H myself from 220-Electronics.com as they seem to have the best price on that stuff. The Canadian models are a hint newer in the production line but I like the idea of PAL recording which the Asian models are capable of (as well as being Region Free) whereas the Canadian models are locked to Region One NTSC recording.

Seems like Pioneer is going strong except in the USA so it seems to me that it is more of a digital tuner issue than anything else. The Canadian and Asian models have no digital tuners. However I could care less about that.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[FulciLives]

I found the following thread over at the AVS FORUM:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=830253

That is all about the Philips DVDR3575H/37 which is the model that has a built-in 160GB HDD and has an ATSC digital tuner.

I haven't read the thread yet but thought I would share. After all this is sold for *cough* only *cough* $298 US Dollars at WALMART.

That does make it nearly $100 less than an imported Pioneer DVR-340H.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
I just read a bit of the thread ... just a tiny bit ... those people at AVS are SO f'ing clueless. They claim with a high quality HDTV source that they can't see the difference between the 1 hour mode and the 4 hour mode. Complete utter nonesense. Some even said 6 hours looks "super" with a high quality HDTV source.

Utter garbage. No wonder they jizz on Panasonic ... they are all blind ... blind I tell you !!!

[next]

By the way -- did you ever try to do anything about that failing burner problem ?

Seems like Pioneer is going strong except in the USA so it seems to me that it is more of a digital tuner issue than anything else. The Canadian and Asian models have no digital tuners. However I could care less about that.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

You're going to have to hurry. Pioneer has repeatedly reported in their quarterly financial statements that they are done as far as SD DVD recorders are concerned. They are just weaning themselves down from their existing investment in SD technology and are in the process of shutting down their SD DVD recorder production lines. Thats's why there was no new development for ATSC SD DVD recorders for the USA market.

It is posted on the Japanese Pioneer site. Check it out.

You might see a rebadged Pioneer DVD recorder in the future as a marketing (profit) strategy - maybe. Similiar to JVC and Philips. Both JVC and Philips have Funai produced models manufactured in China. Nothing wrong with that but they are not the Japanese DVD recorders most are used to.

[next]

I just read a bit of the thread ... just a tiny bit ... those people at AVS are SO f'ing clueless. They claim with a high quality HDTV source that they can't see the difference between the 1 hour mode and the 4 hour mode. Complete utter nonesense. Some even said 6 hours looks "super" with a high quality HDTV source.

Utter garbage. No wonder they jizz on Panasonic ... they are all blind ... blind I tell you !!!

The 3575 thread is pretty humorous I must admit. You can run something through CCE 1,000 times and at 1.2 mb/s (6 hr mode) it is still going to look like a poorly produced VCD. Agreed.

There are a lot of pom poms in that thread. I don't think it represents the entire forum.

edit - I should add though that with a high bit HD source (even at 480i) into any SD DVD recorder the results are pretty surprising as far as PQ is concerned. But 6 hr? Nah.