Anyone using MMC with X800XL VIVO-only (no TV tuner or AIW) for capture?

[palouse]

I need someone with the same system(s) as mine to recommend a functioning combination of MMC and ATI driver/WDM that will work with either of my VIVO enabled cards for capture through S-Video connection.

I have two ATI VIVO enabled cards in separate computers, X800XL and X1800XT. I can't get either card to work with MMC "TV" (video capture) application. With earlier MMC versions, the "TV" application does not fully start, and pops the "Failed to instantiate..." message. Later MMC versions (9.13 & 9.16) open TV app to the view screen, but have only a "No Signal" message in the center.

External hardware works, or has been reasonably tested. The VCR and a tape displays on TV with composite cable, and audio can be heard during tape play through VCR to audio card connection. (Test TV did not have S-Video connection.) I tried two different S-Video cables and two ATI VIVO dongles, and one composit to connect to VIDEO IN for capture. I tried starting VCR then computer, VCR on after computer, different ways of connecting cable, no luck.

On both computers I have tried each of the following drivers (with WDM) using each listed MMC. Prior to installing a driver combo, I used ATI uninstaller app to remove ATI drivers, did a visual check in Add/Remove Programs, and deleted temp and driver files.
Driver/WDM: 6.1, 6.3, 7.2, 7.4
MMC: 9.02, 9.03, 9.06.1, 9.8, 9.13, 9.16

As one other test, on the system with the X1800 (6.1 w/ MMC 9.13), I was able to get the "Video Out" and a TV to be accepted by the Display Control Panel as a "TV monitor", and desktop appeared on TV. At least some portion of the driver/card is working. However, I had to play around with the CP to get the "TV Monitor" to be recognized. I don't know what I tweaked, but it took 30 minutes of playing with it.

When I tried "tweaking" Control Panel while MMC "TV" was running in 9.13, S-Video connected to VCR, I could get no change from "No Signal" message. I did get many BSODs upon tweaking some settings. Of course, rebooting and trying the same CP change did not necessarily BSOD the system again. Overall, I tried every logical CP option, turning on or disabling, no luck. ATI Tool, and any other video related app or service shut off. Went down list of things to try from ATI Knowledge Base (DirectX, Overlay, hardware acceleration, etc.,) no luck.

Computer: WinXP-SP2, AMD A64, 2GB memory. LCD monitors w/ digital cable connections. JVC HR-7500 VCR, old but in like-new condition. X1800 came with 6.1 drivers/WDM, January, 2006. The 9.13 drivers came out Jan 06.

I read other posts about people having better luck with earlier drivers. Do I need to go earlier than 6.1 driver?

I never install CCC, only drivers. I never found anything useful or capture related in CCC. Do I need to have CCC installed?

For those who use MMC and ATI VIVO cards successfully, are they using analog monitors? One consistency between my computers is that both have LCD monitors using digital cable connection to video card. Is it possible that the Display Control Panel detects the LDC as "digital signal" out, and somehow that interferes with the "TV" app detecting the driver or signal-in? I had to return the heavy, old POS TV that I borrowed to run my tests. I don't know that trying to run the TV as a monitor from the "VIDEO OUT" composite connection while at the same time running "VIDEO IN" to the S-Video will work, anyway.

What gives?!? I should be done with the entire project by now. (Thanks for any help.)

[Video Head]

What driver are you using? In my experiences with several ATI AIW's, Catalyst runs the show...I have had the same message before when setting up a system and had to wipe and start over. The sequence you install everything in is important, especially with the TV tuner application.

VH

[Nelson37]

Use something other than a VCR to test input. The "No Signal" could be a designed response to detected Macrovision. Recommend using S-video from cable or satellite, important to get the VCR out of the picture.

Output to TV almost completely irrelevant for capture issues.

In all cases I have dealt with, once the TV app runs, with any kind of display and no errors, the MMC is working. Did you cycle through all the connector types, you should at least get static if you choose Coax, with just the S-video cable connected.

I have older cards, but have never had any issue using Digital monitor.

Your error is not the message in the thread title. You fixed that. Current error is a working program, with no signal detected or displayed. This is completely different.

[palouse]

What I really need is for someone to post who is successfully using X800 or X1800 VIVO with MMC. Let me know what driver and MMC combo they use to make it work. I know AIW cards work. What about VIVO-only users?

Thank you for the replies.

VH:
I have tried each of the drivers with each of the MMC versions I list above. I settled on experimenting with 6.1 driver/WDM and 9.13 because they came out at the same time, and 6.1 was bundled with the X1800. I have followed the ATI recommended install sequence. I will try installing CCC, I have no better alternatives at this point. (Earlier driver versions did not come with CCC.)

N37:
The VCR generates a signal with or without tape, when "Menu" button is pressed or when channel is changed. The tapes I am preserving are home videos with no Macrovision. Composite out on the VCR works with a TV, and I tried composite and s-video connections with the ATI dongle. Keep in mind that the earlier versions pop the "Failed to instantiate..." message, and later versions show "No Signal" after starting "TV" app. I believe they are the same error, just a different way of handling the error was coded into MMC after the 9.08 release.

[Tezla]

The other day I was reinstalling Windows XP SP2 on this computer with an ATI Radeon x800xl 256mb AGP. I was looking for the optimal way to install the ATI drivers and minimal ATI apps to allow:

Max. gaming performance
DVD playback with ATI DVD-Decoder using on-board hardware playback
Lowest background task overhead
Fastest boot-up time
Watching TV (via VCR tuner on composite)
Encoding videos from cable TV and VCR tapes (again, via VCR)
Minimal useless ATI apps loaded (the Library comes to mind)
Burning and mastering video DVDs

I tried a couple of different things. I did try the complete Multi-Media Center install (by the book) and I was also getting a big “No Signal” overlayed right on top of what was obviously a perfect audio and video composite signal. This is where me and the ATI-TV app. part ways after many years (I used to have a AIW 9600xt … still do actually, but that’s in my Home Theater server). If I didn’t like the result I reformatted and started over or loaded the Ghost image back to when XP was first completely installed. I thought I would share with you what I consider to be a good working setup.

Completely install WinXP
Install critical updates.
Get all your devices working in Device Manager (leave ATI card at whatever it auto-detects as for now)
Install .Net Framework 1.1 and critical patches
Upgrade to SP2 (if your install CD was a lesser version).
Install more Microsoft critical updates
Install .Net Framework 2.0 and critical patches
Install a fresh copy of Direct X 9.0c from Microsoft (there are multiple versions of 9.0c … not sure why, so overlay the latest)
Install Catalyst Control Center 7.6 and WDM drivers (for VIVO circuit … ATI T200 AVSteam as I recall)
Install Windows Media Encoder 9 (from Microsoft Downloads)
Install Windows Media 9 Codec Pack (from Microsoft Downloads)
From MMC 9.16 downloads, only grab and install the DVD Decoder Installer Updater (atiCDwiz.exe) Skip other MMC files
Use atiCDwiz.exe and your original Radeon driver CD to install the latest ATI DVD decoder

Everything should be working at this point. Everything (including DVDs) should play from Media Player 9. Go into CCC and verify your settings. I usually setup CCC and then forget about it (hardly go into it).

This is a secondary system now with only one monitor (no more dual monitors), so I also selected the option to turn off the taskbar icon. You can still run CCC from main Program Start Menu if you need to. I also found some ATI tweaking guides on the net. This is what I disabled to fine tune the system (faster boot-up and less background tasks running). If you are running dual monitors or otherwise need to bring up CCC often to change resolutions or profiles, you might need to leave some of these enabled (I think StartCCC and CLIstart.exe are the ones). Anyway, this is what I did:

Load AutoRuns (from Microsoft SysInternals) and DISABLE:
StartCCC
CLIstart.exe
ATIACMXX.DLL
ATI2EVXX.exe (both of them or twice)

Now reboot and you should notice a little boot-time speed increase and a few less tasks running in the background after the system is fully booted.

To watch or record TV or tapes through a VCR or other composite source, start up Windows Media Encoder and create a session called “Watch_TV” (for example) and save it. You can even create a shortcut to that project. It will start and you don’t have to press the record button if you don’t want to (you can just watch).

Since we don’t have tuners in our cards anyway (not AIW cards with cable tuners), this leaner setup provides most of the same basic functionality of what we use MMC for. Of course YMMV but I hope this helps you and others who might read it. It’s still a good card for this AGP system. It does the things listed at the top of this post fine and even plays World of Warcraft (and other 3D games) with no problems.