Converting AVI to either MP4 ofr 3gp on Nokia 5300 phone - a/v sync problem

[johnbdrysdale]

I am at my wits end. Hopefully someone here can help.

I have avi files of a cartoon series and am trying to convert them so I can take them with me when travelling to watch on my Nokia 5300 phone.

No matter what I try, once hte file is on the phone, the audio plays quicker than the video, and gets further ahead the longer the clip plays for. IT is noticeable even during the opening credits though.

I have used the guide at http://www.osnews.com/comment.php?news_id=16983&limit=no&threshold=-1 but without success.

I have also used the following software when doing the encoding:
Nokia multimedia converter
Xilisoft
Super
Mediacoder
Quicktime Pro (although had usability issues with this)

The files created in many instances work fine on the computer, but the sync problem appears when I copy them to the phone for playback.

I can get perfect sync using Nokia multimedia converter to get 3gp, but the video quality is terrible (very grainy) and the audio is too crackly to be able to understand, even with both on maximum quality settings (allowable settigns are not very high though in the Nokia Multimedia converter).

I have updated my phones firmware yesterday but this has done nothing in relation to this issue.

The tutorial link referred to above also has a Fantastic 4 movie trailer as a test file, and this has the sync problem when I put it on my phone as well.

Definately appears to be a software issue in the phone, but if anyone knows if this is solvable and how, or even if it is not sovlable please comment.

I don't know much about frame persecond and bit rate settings etc, so if anyone can suggest any settings to try in any of these programs I will run the tests and let you know the results.

cheers

[theewizard]

I use super exclusively for converting vids for my phones

3 LG's and 2 samsungs

what setings did you use for your nokia with super

I found that setting the FPS to 1/2 of the source FPS and the video bitrate between 160-192k usually gave the best results and the least sync problems

audio at 48k aac

[johnbdrysdale]

I tried a few different settings in super as follows (output container/output video codec/output audiocodec):

3gp/263/aac
3gp/263/amr narrow band
3gp/263/amr narrow band, video at 14.98fps
3gp/mp4/aac

Default video bitrate of 144kpbs was used.

Audio with AMR narrow band is only 13kpbs as the highest, but too crackly (and 3gp with 263 video codec is too grainy to the point where it is impossible to watch the cartoon I am trying to do this with (Southpark). I have tried with various avi files though.

How can I tell what the source FPS is? The avi's I have were not created by me.

thanks

[45tripp]

How can I tell what the source FPS is?

Gspot or mediainfo

[johnbdrysdale]

Using Gspot I found out the fps was 23.976.

I have redone the clip and transferred it to my phone, but a major syncing problem.
The setting from Super that I used are as follows:

Output container: 3gp (Nokia/NEC/Siemens)
Output video codec: MPEG-4
Output Audio Codec - AAC
Video Scale size: 176x144
Aspect: 11:9
Frame/Sec: 11.988
Bitrate: 160kbps
Audio Sampleing freq: 22050
Channels: 2
Audio Bitrate: 48kbps

Anyone got any ideas on other settings I should be trying? What should I be changing? Or is this looking like a firmware issue with the particular model of phone? I've already updated to the latest firmware as well.

[mats.hogberg]

Tried 3gp Converter? That's what I've successfully used to convert AVI to my SE phone.

/Mats

[johnbdrysdale]

MAts,

You mean Xilisoft's 3gp converter? If so then yes I've tried that program already.
I can view the converted files without a problem on my PC, the problem only arises when I transfer them to my Nokia 5300.

I think it is a problem with the forns firmware, but not really sure. Doesn't seem any other explanation to me though.

If anyone has any other ideas though please let me know.

thanks

[mats.hogberg]

No, not Xilisoft. The tool that comes up when you click on 3gp Converter

/Mats

[johnbdrysdale]

I have just tried the 3gp converter again.
Used 3GPP with AAC setting and both the following had the same sync problem

Mono - Normal QVGA
Mono - Normal QCIF

So still no resolution.

[torowl]

I have Nokia 5300 and 6085 models. I think the issue is not software issue, rather than the cell phone issue. Looks like the cell phone CPU doesn't have good performance.

I tried SUPER to convert music video clips. I found the video bitrate can not go higher than 96kps. If encode the video in 96kps, then there is no sync issue.

Also audio bitrate can not go higher than 192kps. If higher than 192kps, then whatever lower video bitrate, sync problem will shows up.

Also please dont select "Top Quality" option.

Here is my settings:

Output Container: 3gp (Nokia/NEC/Siemens)
Output Video Codec: H.263
Output Audio Codec: AAC

Video Settings:
Scale Size: 176:144
Aspect: 4:3
Frame/Sec: 15
Bitrate kpbs: 96
Options: Hi Quality

Audio Settings:
Sampling Freq: 44100
Channels: 2
Bitrate kpbs: 192

This is the best quality setting that I can do. I'm not satisfied with this kind of quality. I'm really disappoint with Nokia.

Also according to the phone spec, it should support H.263/AVC and MPEG-4, but I never get it work.

[johnbdrysdale]

torowl: thanks for the detailed and informative post.

I've tried the settings you detailed using Super, which I've used before, and copied the converted file to my Nokia 5300. I'm still having a major sync problem though betwene audio and video.

Any ideas? Were these settings working for you on your 5300, or only your 6085?

cheers

[torowl]

5300 and 6085 has same ARM9 CPU with 239/242MHz. The settings apply for both model.

I did some more video clips, V96/A192 setting works for most of my videos. However, still have some exceptions. Some video I have to reduce video bitrate to 85kbps to make it better.

I have upload two video clips, you can download to test on your phone.
http://rapidshare.com/files/42405498/test.zip.html

Both videos are using V96/A192 setting. I also added subtitle, it is easy to evaluate the sync quality. A*.3gp has sync issue, B*.3gp is OK to me.

[theewizard]

I would reduce the audio, i never run the audio above 56k, most mp3's are 128k, why would you try using 192k audio on a cell phone

try reducing the audio bit rate, i bet you the sound qaulity difference will be negligiable and it might fix your syncing issues

I have the enV, the chocolate, the 8100, the samsung u740 and the samsung u620 video phone

[torowl]

From my experiment, it will affect A/V sync only encode audio higher than 192kbps. By lower audio bitrate than 192kbps, it doesn't help A/V sync. Seems the bottleneck is video, somehow.

I agree encoding to 128kbps doesn't make much difference than 192kbps. Also most of video clips don't have higher audio bitrate. 128kbps should be good enough for most of the case, IMO.

I didn't use the audio in the video clip. I'm using external 320kbps mp3 audio source for the video clip. I'm using 192kbps just want to keep it better as much as I can.

[theewizard]

I didn't use the audio in the video clip. I'm using external 320kbps mp3 audio source for the video clip. I'm using 192kbps just want to keep it better as much as I can.

I assume you are muxing this before doing the conversion.

with audio & video files that are the same running time length, since you didn't say anything about sync problems

here is what i use on my lg9900


Output Container: 3g2 (Nokia/Siemens)
Output Video Codec: mpeg4
Output Audio Codec: AAC

Video Settings:
Scale Size: 320*240 for the lg8100 176*144
Aspect: 4:3
Frame/Sec: 1/2 of source so it varies , most common is 12.5
Bitrate kpbs: 192
Options: Hi Quality

Audio Settings:
Sampling Freq: 44100
Channels: 2
Bitrate kpbs: 56

[torowl]

Yes. I do muxing before encoding. I manually sync A/V, not very accurate, but I did good jobs.

I tried your settings, didn't resolve the issue for Nokia. I guess "3g2 (Nokia/Siemens)" is a typo, I can not find this container in my SUPER, should be "3g2 (Sony/Ericsson)"?. Here is my steps:

1. encode V192/A96 3G2, video is about 6~7s slack than audio.
2. reduce video to 128kbps, same sh*t.
3. further reduce video to 96kbps, then it is better. Sometime video has a little bit slack, but acceptable.
4. then I increase audio to 192kbps, didn't affect the video at all.

Now my setting is:
Output Container: 3g2 (Sony/Ericsson)
Output Video Codec: MPEG-4
Output Audio Codec: AAC

Video Settings:
Scale Size: 176:144
Aspect: 4:3
Frame/Sec: 15
Bitrate kpbs: 96
Options: Hi Quality

Audio Settings:
Sampling Freq: 44100
Channels: 2
Bitrate kpbs: 192

I'm using 15FPS because I pre-encode the video to 15FPS. I read from somewhere before, setting FPS to half of original video FPS. e.g. original is 23.976, then set 11.988 in SUPER.

Comparing 3GP vs 3G2, 3G2 has much better video quality. I only tried on video clip, tomorrow will try more.

Another intrersting thing is, it happened once, video faster than audio; then following blue screen crash. I was thinking only Windows has blue screen, Nokia as well.

[theewizard]

yes erricson, sorry about the typo

just for the sake of testing

try using source video as is with the source audio

and 1/2 of the original FPS, try a 25 fps avi, with out demuxing OR changing the fps to 15

just drop it into super with a video of 160 kb and audio of 56k and 12.5 fps and 3g2 container/extension

and see how it plays on your phone

I made these for one of my phones, try them on yours

http://rapidshare.com/files/17285629/smiles.3G2 no sound

http://rapidshare.com/files/17285630/earth_spin-mp4.3G2 no sound

http://rapidshare.com/files/8981543/twilight_Zone_intro.MP4.3G2 intro sound 'behind these doors lie the keys' etc about 12 seconds long

i use it as a video ringer, yep my phone has video ringtones

[torowl]

All video can be played in Nokia. The 3rd video is too short, can not check if audio is synced properly with video. Also checking with Gspot, the actual video bitrate is 107kbps. I checked one of mine, the actual video bitrate is 157kbps. But the video is encoded with 96kbps. Dont know what is the correlation between setting bitrate and actual bitrate.