US Digital TV Converter Box Rebate

[joepic]

The Commerce Department approved a plan Monday that would allow every U.S. household to be eligible for two $40 coupons that could be used towards the purchase of a digital-to-analog converter box beginning in January 2008.

Such boxes will be a requirement for any analog television set to continue receiving signals past February 17, 2009. At that time, all full-power television stations would end analog broadcast transmissions.

Digital television brings with it a clearer picture along with additional programming, and will free up spectrum that would be reassigned to advance wireless services and emergency first responders.

"The transition from analog to digital television is a historic change and brings with it considerable benefits for the American consumer," Secretary of Commerce Carlos M. Gutierrez said in a statement.

Congress has appropriated $990 million to pay for the rebate program, with an option to increase it another $510 million if it is deemed the original amount is not sufficient. If more funding is required, only over-the-air households would be eligible for the second round of coupons.

The coupon would cover just about all of the cost of the box, currently expected to range from $50 to $70 a piece. It will not be permitted to be used for any other purpose other than purchasing the box, the Commerce Department said.

"With the Coupon Program and a successful analog-to-digital transition involving the public, industry and government, the switch from analog to digital television will be completed as planned," said Assistant Secretary for Communication and Information John Kneuer.

Kneuer added that it would be highly unlikely that the deadline date would be delayed again, due to the massive need for the spectrum analog television currently takes up.

Consumers will have the option of either requesting the rebates through the mail, phone, or via the Web. All coupons will include a tracking code to ensure the system is not abused.

joepic,

I have adjusted the title as this is country specific. 60% of VH visitors are from countries other than the USA.

Also please follow the correct format for posting news. Thanks

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How to Post News: Click here

[dnix71]

Why two coupons? One for each of two converters?

[edDV]

Why two coupons? One for each of two converters?

I assume two TV sets or a TV and a VCR.

All politics. Only 20% of US homes use over the air as primary TV source. Others lack cable or satellite for a tv in the basement, garage or something. Maybe users will discover over the air is better than cable?

Anyway, the politiwhores want to buy your vote by sending you coupons while lifting your wallet for taxes to pay for it. All the coupon will do is keep ATSC tuner prices higher than they would be without the gov't* coupons. You get to pay more in list price and in taxes.

Can you imagine the target consumer, a 72 year old granny in a wheelchair, knowing what to do with this coupon while her TV shows snow? Meanwhile the kids are making a killing on Ebay trading coupons or tuners bought with coupons.

The "coupon" money should be distributed through service groups willing to set up granny with a working TV including an external antenna if necessary. Cable/Sat users should get none or one.


* If there were no mass distributed government coupons, follow the money, NAB broadcasters, advertising interests, infomercials and public broadcasting pledge drives would be happy to see granny has a signal and would organize to make it happen.

[lordsmurf]

The whole system, quite frankly, is fucked.

When politicians get involved in something like this, no good will come of it.

swearing is not encouraged. Thanks
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[guns1inger]

Why should they get subsidised anyway ? Their TV wasn't subsidised in the first place. We are headed in the same direction over here with digital FTA, and thankfully no-one is yet pushing for it to be subsidised, although I'm sure it they will get round to it. Take up of digital boxes was slow until the general moron punter was convinced he needed a 50 inch TV to make his live complete. TV is not a right, (It's not even a necessity, and when you look at what rates, you wonder if the people watching should even have car licenses) so why should the tax payer be subsidising access to it ?

Over here there was a major outcry recently from welfare groups about how awful it was that the new broadcast contract for Australian Rules Football included only 50% of games on any given week being shown on FTA, the rest being shown onlyon pay TV. Contrary to the US, pay TV take up over here isn't much better than digital take up. AFAIAC, it is because of the outrageous prices charged for content I wouldn't watch on FTA, but that's just me. However it was suggested by some welfare groups that pay TV should be subsidised to allow people to watch all the football.

When we live in supposed first world conditions, and people can't afford proper medication and healthcare, how the hell can governments propose using tax payer money to pay for digital settop boxes ?

[dnix71]

Free tv in the US is worth exactly what we pay for it. Our football games are available to the area near where the game is played ONLY if a certain number of people pay to go to the game. If you live far enough away not to get the local broadcast signal, then you can get the game for free.

Fair enough, I suppose.

I suspect many tv's will simply be retired to play vhs and dvds after the change. They won't need a converter for that.

[FulciLives]

The government is afraid that if people can't afford to watch TV that they might "escape" the mindlessness of the medium and get involved with ... politics LOL

Moderators ... this is NOT a political statement but one said with tongue firmly planted in cheek 8)

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[guns1inger]

Fulcilives - I wouldn't poke my tongue too firmly if I were you - it might well come through.

[BJ_M]

you have to sign an affidavit that you do not subscribe to cable or sat to get the certificates -- btw

[Nitemare]

I believe the government is subsidising it because they've essentially hijacked the bandwidth and frequencies that analog TVs currently run on.

I have no interest in switching to digital cable when my analog works just fine ... I don't watch that much TV to begin with. I thought it hilarious that the cable companies invested so much time and money to "upgrade" their service, (and their rates to match it) and it fell flat on its face. Where I'm from, practically NO ONE was interested.

Now the govt. is forcing everyone to "upgrade" because they want those frequencies for something else. They're claiming "advanced wireless serices and first responders" but I'm sure it won't end there.

Just another example of big business and the govt. in bed together, and using "the peoples" money to do it.

[FulciLives]

I've noticed that with my "digital cable" that the lower 100 channels (the analog channels) look better when the raw RF cable is connected directly to the TV or my stand alone DVD recorder etc. than they look through the digital cable box. The digital cable box actually does somehow manage to create a "cleaner" looking image for the analog channels (which show a bit more "video noise" when viewing via the raw RF cable) but this "cleaner" look is at the expense of some really odd digital artifacts.

As for the digital cable channels ... I see some really strange digital artifacts (I suppose due to low bitrates) that I find rather annoying. Some channels (like VOD and HBO etc.) don't have the artifacts (or very few) and HDTV has none (knock on wood) but digital cable was a big BUST if quality was the main reason for the switch.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[edDV]

I've noticed that with my "digital cable" that the lower 100 channels (the analog channels) look better when the raw RF cable is connected directly to the TV or my stand alone DVD recorder etc. than they look through the digital cable box. The digital cable box actually does somehow manage to create a "cleaner" looking image for the analog channels (which show a bit more "video noise" when viewing via the raw RF cable) but this "cleaner" look is at the expense of some really odd digital artifacts.

As for the digital cable channels ... I see some really strange digital artifacts (I suppose due to low bitrates) that I find rather annoying. Some channels (like VOD and HBO etc.) don't have the artifacts (or very few) and HDTV has none (knock on wood) but digital cable was a big BUST if quality was the main reason for the switch.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

They adjust different bitrates per channel. HBO gets more bitrate.
This varies neighborhood to neighborhood.

[bendixG15]

Can you imagine the target consumer, a 72 year old granny in a wheelchair, knowing what to do with this coupon while her TV shows snow? Meanwhile the kids are making a killing on Ebay trading coupons or tuners bought with coupons.
.

You should learn some manners and not stereotype 72 year old grannys as mentally and physically deficient to require wheelchairs and not have the brains to figure out how the coupons work.

What would your reaction be if you were referred to as a stupid punk kid looking out to screw everyone ??

[edDV]

Can you imagine the target consumer, a 72 year old granny in a wheelchair, knowing what to do with this coupon while her TV shows snow? Meanwhile the kids are making a killing on Ebay trading coupons or tuners bought with coupons.
.

You should learn some manners and not stereotype 72 year old grannys as mentally and physically deficient to require wheelchairs and not have the brains to figure out how the coupons work.

What would your reaction be if you were referred to as a stupid punk kid looking out to screw everyone ??

You clearly failed to get the point.

[stiltman]

Can you imagine the target consumer, a 72 year old granny in a wheelchair, knowing what to do with this coupon while her TV shows snow? Meanwhile the kids are making a killing on Ebay trading coupons or tuners bought with coupons.
.

You should learn some manners and not stereotype 72 year old grannys as mentally and physically deficient to require wheelchairs and not have the brains to figure out how the coupons work.

What would your reaction be if you were referred to as a stupid punk kid looking out to screw everyone ??

You clearly failed to get the point.

Your Grandmother is 72, in a wheelchair and you and your siblings are going to sell stuff on Ebay?

[edDV]

Can you imagine the target consumer, a 72 year old granny in a wheelchair, knowing what to do with this coupon while her TV shows snow? Meanwhile the kids are making a killing on Ebay trading coupons or tuners bought with coupons.
.

You should learn some manners and not stereotype 72 year old grannys as mentally and physically deficient to require wheelchairs and not have the brains to figure out how the coupons work.

What would your reaction be if you were referred to as a stupid punk kid looking out to screw everyone ??

You clearly failed to get the point.

Your Grandmother is 72, in a wheelchair and you and your siblings are going to sell stuff on Ebay?

The coupon may get a tuner box at discount* but getting from there to a picture on the TV requires.

1. An antenna appropriate to the location www.antennaweb.org
2. Connecting the tuner to the TV
3. Selecting the right input in the TV menus
4. Scanning ASTC channels and selecting subchannels in each transmitter direction
5. Buying another antenna and repeating the above.

* Discount will be offset by higher list prices. Simple economics.

[bendixG15]

You just don't get it, do you .... edDV

[AlecWest]

Ultimately, the "big change" of 2009 probably won't be as big of a change to most people ... except perhaps those who use rabbit ears or other physical antennas to get current TV.

Cable-TV companies don't want their consumers to be too inconvenienced. Locally, my cable company has already indicated that (for basic and expanded basic cable - no "box" required) things will remain absolutely the same ... with one exception. The conversion from digital to analog won't take place in a "box" mounted on every analog TV. It will take place at the cable company itself.

Of course, they'll probably use the law as a reason for charging an additional "conversion fee." But in homes like mine where expanded basic cable rules, all the channels will remain the same - and my analog TV will continue to process the signals it receives, just like before.

[SingSing]

The whole system, quite frankly, is fucked.

Report, report, lordsmurF uses the bad word on FCC's list.

[edDV]

Ultimately, the "big change" of 2009 probably won't be as big of a change to most people ... except perhaps those who use rabbit ears or other physical antennas to get current TV.

Cable-TV companies don't want their consumers to be too inconvenienced. Locally, my cable company has already indicated that (for basic and expanded basic cable - no "box" required) things will remain absolutely the same ... with one exception. The conversion from digital to analog won't take place in a "box" mounted on every analog TV. It will take place at the cable company itself.

Of course, they'll probably use the law as a reason for charging an additional "conversion fee." But in homes like mine where expanded basic cable rules, all the channels will remain the same - and my analog TV will continue to process the signals it receives, just like before.

You are referring to the "two digit" 2-99 analog NTSC cable channels.

You are correct that the home user will not "need" new equipment to continue to receive these analog NTSC channels. The local channels will be switched at the head end to the digital feed and then encoded to 4:3 NTSC. The cable company will need to decide if the default NTSC version will be letterboxed 16:9 or side cropped to 4:3 for full height. I'm sure they are doing their market research on that one.

I predict you will see an ongoing reduction in analog channels offered by cable over time. Each 6MHz analog channel takes the bandwidth for 10+ SD MPeg2 or two HD MPeg2 channels. The high paying customers are demanding more SD and HD digital. These are the customers that will take their $120/mo to the satellite companies if something isn't done to increase HD offerings. You can bet the cable companies will be quick to reduce analog offerings down to gov't mandated basic service (i.e. locals + education + local access + CSpan, etc.).

[AlecWest]

Here's an interesting thing to ponder. Currently, digital cable customers need a digital cable "box" to convert the signal for their analog TVs. But what happens when everyone converts to digital TVs? The need for a "box" would disappear as a conversion tool ... and cable companies make a lot of money renting "boxes." How will they make up this?

[BJ_M]

better boxes

[edDV]

Here's an interesting thing to ponder. Currently, digital cable customers need a digital cable "box" to convert the signal for their analog TVs. But what happens when everyone converts to digital TVs? The need for a "box" would disappear as a conversion tool ... and cable companies make a lot of money renting "boxes." How will they make up this?

There is zero overlap between "cable digital" and ATSC digital. They both use forms of MPeg2 but an ATSC (over the air) tuner will not tune cable digital channels.

That said, some "digital" TV tuners include QAM digital cable tuning capability. Most "digital" cable channels are encrypted. Exceptions are called clear QAM which are not encrypted. The government (Bush's FCC) inserted themselves into the cable scene using administrative mandate to require cable companies to offer local over the air digital broadcasts "in the clear" without encryption to QAM capable TV sets or computer tuners. No cable box is required if you have a QAM tuner. This includes both SD and HD locals. Beyond that, they required these cable channels be made available over the IEEE-1394 port as unencrypted MPeg2_TS when tuned on a HD capable cable box. Beyond that, they required cable companies to offer "cable card" smart cards for advanced TV sets that would allow the TV to decrypt the premium cable channels without need for a cable box. The idea was cable companies should not benefit from the broadcast conversion to digital. That is cable companies can not require a cable box to tune local channels.

Cable companies aren't too happy with these requirements and don't publicize these features. I'd bet a change of administration may reverse some of these rulings unless Congress puts them into law.

[NiteLite]

you have to sign an affidavit that you do not subscribe to cable or sat to get the certificates -- btw

What does getting Sat have to do with it?
Is Sat not going Hi-Def or something?
I mean if my Sat company goes HD am I not allowed to convert to analog so as to watch?
I'm missing something.
Regards.
NL

[edDV]

you have to sign an affidavit that you do not subscribe to cable or sat to get the certificates -- btw

What does getting Sat have to do with it?
Is Sat not going Hi-Def or something?
I mean if my Sat company goes HD am I not allowed to convert to analog so as to watch?
I'm missing something.
Regards.
NL

Sat customers are uneffected unless you get your locals from over the air TV. In that case you will need an ATSC tuner.

[edDV]

A related article.

EE Times:
US digital TV converters to sell for about $60 -LG

http://www.eetimes.com/showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=FKVKBQUY3Z1RKQSNDLPCKHSCJUNN2JVN?a...leID=198100060

[NiteLite]

A related article.

EE Times:
US digital TV converters to sell for about $60 -LG

http://www.eetimes.com/showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=FKVKBQUY3Z1RKQSNDLPCKHSCJUNN2JVN?a...leID=198100060

Nice link, edDV, Thanks.
From the link;

"All households will be eligible to request up to two $40 discount coupons to buy converter boxes until $990 million has been exhausted. Congress would then have to approve release of another $510 million for the program, but the coupons would then be limited to households that rely on over-the-air analog television."

So anyone can get in on the first wave of two per household and the 2nd release of funds will be limited to OTA only households.
So I'm a Sat customer. Why dont I need a converter after the switch? What will DishNet do that will allow me to still receive their channels if they go digital and not need the converter?
Sorry, something is not clicking with me on this. Anyone know what I am missing?
I really appreciate any info on how I can bypass the converter or not need it with my Sat system.
Thanks,
NL
Oh yes, I get locals OTA with a typical all band home antenna.

[edDV]

...
So anyone can get in on the first wave of two per household and the 2nd release of funds will be limited to OTA only households.
So I'm a Sat customer. Why dont I need a converter after the switch? What will DishNet do that will allow me to still receive their channels if they go digital and not need the converter?
Sorry, something is not clicking with me on this. Anyone know what I am missing?
I really appreciate any info on how I can bypass the converter or not need it with my Sat system.
Thanks,
NL
Oh yes, I get locals OTA with a typical all band home antenna.

If you get your locals over the Dish satellite, you are uneffected. Dish probably already has a digital feed from local TV stations to their uplink in most markets. Same with cable.

If you get your locals from an antenna, you are affected. You will need to get one of these ATSC tuners and an antenna or multiple antennas aimed at the local digital transmitters. Enter your address into www.antennaweb.org to see where the transmitters are (direction, distance and power). Power will probably increase on the magic day in Feb, 2009.