How to recored OTA HD channels from Comcast cable?

[rbatty11]

I've read a few threads and am still a little confused. All I want to do is record OTA HD channels and those HD channels that are not encrypted from Comcast cable. I thought i could get away with just hooking up the HD receiver/cable box to my pc and use this tutorial: http://hdjunkie.com/tutorials.html Or I could buy an HD tuner/video card, yes? Then I have to decide which card, etc. OR... I could just lease Comcast's HD PVR and would just need to find out how to stream captured video to my pc to xfr to DVD.

But not sure which method is cheaper, efficient, better, etc?? In which scenario will I need an antennae, if any? Can anyone help me out? Thanks.

[jman98]

You need an HD tuner card to record OTA HD signals. The link you listed tells you how to record unencrypted HD channels from a Comcast or other US HD cable box via firewire to a Windows XP PC. In theory, you will not need an HD tuner card to record from the cable box, but without one, you have no way to verify that the HD cable box is OK as you can't see the output from it unless you have an HD TV nearby that you can connect to the cable box.

You WILL need an antenna to record OTA HD signals. You don't need an antenna to record from the cable box. I record using the method in the link you listed and it works great for me. I'm getting HD feeds in crystal clarity. I started originally with an antenna and recording OTA stuff, but the quality began to get worse and worse in my neighborhood and finally I either had to get a cable box (which I did) or put an antenna on my roof and hope it worked. I wasn't real keen on that second choice.

[rbatty11]

Thank you, jman. OK, think I understand now. I have a Mot DCT6200 HD receiver and it does have 2 firewire outs on the back (working or not??). Now I just have to find a very long firewire cable to run to my pc and follow the tutuorial.

[tluxon]

Capturing via firewire doesn't work so great for everybody. If you have any trouble, you can read about just about anything related to firewire recording from the How to record via IEEE 1394 (Firewire) to Windows XP thread on the AVSForum.

I've been capturing via firewire for more than two years and as I've had to have Cable DVRs replaced with newer versions, it has become more and more troublesome. Also, our local cable company's boxes now add a CCI=0x02 flag (copy once - NOT to a PC) to most of our locals (some 5 or 6 of them have the RC_Descriptor set to 0x01, which correlates to a CCI=0x02 100% of the time). On the flip side, networks like ESPN-HD, ESPN2-HD, DiscoveryHD, INHD, and TNT-HD have all come in with CCI=0x00, allowing firewire capture. You'll find that settings vary from provider to provider throughout the country. Some digital cable subscribers have been unable to capture ANY HD content off their DVRs. Their only recourse is to own a box that can be modified by something like the R5000-HD mod which adds a USB port to any non-firewire STB.

Finally, you mentioned putting these shows on DVD. There are DVD recorders appearing now with QAM tuning (not always listed in the specs, so do some research) and HD upconversion. Those two features usually allow you to pass the tuned HD picture right to your TV while downconverting the stream to DVD-spec for recording to disc. You may be interested in something like that.

[jg0001]

The HD Junkie method (firewire from cablebox to PC) works fine for me, but do note that it is almost exclusively for channels that are otherwise available via broadcast. Comcast has the no-copy flag on just about every other channel (including MTV and the other music video channels, though I did get "The Tube" to work... once).

Anyway, if you use the DVHS shareware that he suggests, when you first hit the button to "record" if you are on the tab that shows the recording details, you'll soon learn that it will ONLY show details if it is actually recording something. Otherwise, you can assume the no-copy flag is active and you are SooL.

You can use the above method to try out different channels and shows and see what does and does not work. DVHS would be a bit nicer if it actually told you in english that it isn't recording anything (though it will make a large blank file pretty quickly).

For your first test, trying recording something off of a broadcast channel. BTW, the .ts or .mpg extension thing he suggests didn't make an ounce of difference to me or WMP 11. However, I'd note that I also have the K-Lite codec pack installed (go to www.filehippo.com if you want this).

[jg0001]

Oh.. for playback on TV, I found that vso's ConvertXtoDvD works perfectly to make the video DVD compliant.

[rbatty11]

Man, doesn't even seem to be worth the trouble from the above reading Maybe will give it a shot just to say I tried.

So even if I get a Comcast HD DVR, I can only capture to the DVR once.. and not stream it to my pc to burn to dvd b/c of encryption (only allows copy once)??

Edit: Forgot to mention that I do own a JVC HMD 40000U DVHS VCR.. will that help any?

[jg0001]

I recorded HEROES for example off of ABC (or whatever it's on)... First, I did it WHILE it was playing live straight from the cable box. SECOND, I did it again (as a test) playing back the HD-DVR'd copy in the same manner to my PC.

Both worked just fine.

[jman98]

It depends on what you want to record. I ONLY record local channels, a few things off Discovery or INHD and ESPN. Mostly locals. It works great for me.

Keep in mind that I am talking ONLY about HD channels. MTV isn't on high def with Comcast where I live and I have an analog TV card for those rare analog captures I do, so Comcast can set all the flags they want on MTV and my old analog card is still going to record it. It is possible with DVHS to record analog shows, but it's not worth the trouble if you already have an analog TV capture card.

If you want to record HBO or other premium HD content, you are probably not going to be able to do that.

[tluxon]

Man, doesn't even seem to be worth the trouble from the above reading Maybe will give it a shot just to say I tried.

So even if I get a Comcast HD DVR, I can only capture to the DVR once.. and not stream it to my pc to burn to dvd b/c of encryption (only allows copy once)??

Edit: Forgot to mention that I do own a JVC HMD 40000U DVHS VCR.. will that help any?

Do you want to save full HD or would you be content with just a DVD quality version of it? If you'd like full HD and have the filespace for it, I think it's definitely worth trying. Where are you located and who is your service provider? You should be able to go to the AVS Forum thread I linked and find out what others from your area are able to record.

The "copy" to the DVR doesn't count as a copy when CCI is "copy once". I have a JVC 40k DVHS VCR as well. I haven't found anything that I can't record with it - it's just that if it's flagged "copy once" it can't be captured to a PC. That's the ridiculous part of all the DRM stuff - there's no limit to how many DVHS tapes I can make in full HD, but they won't let me view or capture it to my notebook PC. All they're really accomplishing is making me more reluctant to buy their product because of all the hoops I have to jump through just to play it, let alone make a backup copy for when the original media craps out.

[rbatty11]

Thanks, guys.. Actually, I know i won't be able to record HD premium channels but was more interested in INHD, DiscoveryHD, TNT HD, local programing--ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. Saving in full HD would be great but probably not feasible for me.. so DVD would be ideal. Will check avsforum out.. thanks..

tluxon, can you tell me how you set up your JVC 40k to capture HD programming? I've got a Comcast Cable 6200 HD receiver with firewire outputs.. I'm guessing it's just

1) connecting the Comcast box to the JVC via firewire?? Does that take care of both audio and video or do I still need other cables/connections, ie., component, S-Video, etc. between the JVC and the Comcast box??

2) Then just tune to the HD channel, set the appropriate auxiliary line on the JVC and hit record? If not copy once or never, capture the HD material from the JVC to my pc for editing/authoring/ burning?

3) Or... whenever I want to watch in full HD resolution, simply plop the DVHS tape into the JVC and hit play (JVC 40k is integrated into my system via component video and toslink digital out).

Edit: Also remember reading somewhere a while back that I can actually use S-VHS tapes to record HD. Is that right?

[tluxon]

Yes, you've got it.

The firewire carriies the whole digital stream, including audio and video. You just need to hook up the firewire between the cable box and the 40k, set the JVC input to I-X (X is a single digit number automatically assigned when the JVC identifies the cable box).

S-VHS tapes can be modified to be recognized as a D-VHS tape, and if the quality of the tape is good enough, you're in business. I just use D-VHS tapes myself.

[rbatty11]

Thanks, tluxon and all. Now if I can only find some time do this..

[rbatty11]

Am searching on avsforum right now, but there are a heck of a lot of msgs in the IEEE1394 firewire thread to search thru.. .

I hooked up firewire from my 6200 to my pc (P4 3gh, 2gb ram, integrated onboard audio/video
I tried capturing Tube Network videos and got CapDVHS to record.. but when trying to playback in VLC, I get nothing. When I try PowerDVD 6.0, I get some video, no audio and video is green pixelation.. ??

Going to keep searching avs but was hoping could get advice/solution here.. Thanks.

[jg0001]

You may need a codec pack to get it working...
I use: http://www.filehippo.com/download_klite_codec_pack/
(newest is upper right link on that site)

Also, if you ARE recording, the datainfo tab will display resolution, bitrate, etc. If it is just creating a blank file due to an encryption flag, you'll get a whole lot of nothing, but a giant file nonetheless.

Oddly, my Comcast (north NJ) has some broadcast channels flagged and others open... weird.

Here's what I determined works or not "x = not working".

042 - SciFi

149 - moveplex
162 - G4
185 - OXygen

201 - x
202 - x
203 - x
204 - TNTHD
205 - DHDTV
207 - VSGLF
208 - UHD
209 - x

231 - x (? ABCHD)
232 - NBCHD
233 - X (? WCBSD)
234 - WNYWD (Fox5)
235 - WPIXD (CW11)
245 - WABC+

250 - WPIXT (TheTube)

[rbatty11]

I just captured House M.D. and downloaded a trial version of PowerDVD Ultra.. damn! What clarity.

But question, I was expecting a huge file ~50gb.. Why is the file an mpg at 4.2gb size?? Thought I'd have to convert the file to DVD using some app in the tools section (mpeg2dvd or hd2dvd or something like that???). If not, can I just author the mpg file (4.2g) and burn to DVD? The bitrate fluxes between 7-15mbps and audio is DD 5.1 at 448kbps.

As for not being able to play on regular PowerDVD 6.0, you're saying it will play if install the klite codec? I'm just leary of dowloading certain codec, as I've found some cause havoc with the OS. Any known problems with the codec? Thanks!

[jg0001]

Well I used the K-Lite Codec pack on a fresh install of WinXP ... It's a jumbo package and may not be worth the trouble if you already have a slew of other codecs that seem to be working for you. With that codec, however, I am able to play the .ts files back in Windows Media Player 11 ALTHOUGH they do seem to stutter (even on a high powered PC; e6700 @ 3.5 ghz, high speed ram & HDD's). CPU usage is modest, so that isn't the issue. My vid card is an 8800 GTX. Playing the files back using VLC Media player resulted in much smoother playback.

[jman98]

rbatty11 - The size of your recorded file sounds about right for a 720p capture in my experience. I record The Simpsons through the method I posted about and my files are roughly half your size.

You DO have to convert the captured file to burn it to DVD. The resolution and bit rate are too high. The HDTVtoMPEG2 program is just what you want and I think it's still free.

You shouldn't need to install the Klite codec to play back these files. 720p playback should be OK on most systems without it. 1080i playback is another story.

[jg0001]

ConvertXToDVD worked well for me on those files to get them DVD compliant and they played back very well with very little noticeable loss in quality when converted (I did this on a 1080i file of Heroes).

[rbatty11]

Hmm.. OK, if I don't need the Klite codec pack to playback the mpg HD file (btw, it was a 1hr 1280x720 capture), why is regular PowerDVD6.0 not able to do it? All I get is green pixelation across most of the video and no audio. I could not playback in VLC either, but I think this is attributed to incorrect setup on my part. Will try again. Maybe my system? (P4 3g, 1g ram, XP Pro)

Also, would I be able to use a professional mpeg encoder on the captured file, i.e., procoder or cce? (not sure what encoder HDTVtoMPEG2 uses?). Was wondering if there would be a significant difference in using procoder/cce vs. HDTVtoMPEG2? Thanks for everyone's help.

Edit: Confused: I keep reading about a "TS" file (transport stream) but I ended up with an .mpg file. Difference?