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  1. Member
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    I'd have to say a Harddisk (that is if you keep them hooked up regul. I think
    magnetic media needs refresshing/spinning or it will loos its capabilities very soon?)

    Or those memory chips in USB sticks (if they get any bigger in the future they should be the way to go?)

    I really dislike CD-r's en DVD's. had far too many bad experiences with them.
    En I did keep them safe/dirt free (even finger prints)
    And after 6 months you start losing bits... Valuable bits!

    What's you ropinion?
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  2. Member
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    1: Never had cdr issue's .

    a: Use quality media
    b: Burn at 4x
    c: Never to the max fill
    d: Alway's check read back from media to hd ... error control checking
    e: Placed in dvd case's
    f: Place inside cupboard away from direct light
    g: Temp never reach's above 30 degree's .

    Cd's from year's ago are only a problem because the drive reading them is not the drive that generated them in the first place ... so it may take a couple of run's to retrieve file's .

    2: Hd storage .

    a: Still got drive's from 91 that have been used for storage , and there still 100% .

    3: Usb / flash drive's

    a: Have been known to develope corruption ... they can only be counted on as "temporary transitional storage" .
    b: Writen once , confirmed , stored = ok
    c: Writen too / from constantly = file corruption ... sooner or later .

    4: Dvd

    a: If it's that important ... do not store it here ... your mad if you do .

    5: Dlt's

    a: Good storage performance ... but dislike's high humidity .
    b: Storage capacity limited .
    c: Dislike's handling .
    d: Write too , confirm data , put in case , somewhere cool away from direct light
    e: Leave them alone unless you absolutely need them .

    Got dlt tape's older than 12 year's here , and the data is still 100% .
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  3. Member
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    I'd have to agree with you that an external HDD is probably a good compromise between convenience and reliability for data storage.
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  4. How about "on line" storage, I know it costs but if its that important
    PAL/NTSC problem solver.
    USED TO BE A UK Equipment owner., NOW FINISHED WITH VHS CONVERSIONS-THANKS
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  5. Member edDV's Avatar
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    Backup frequently.

    Since I use several computers, backup discipline has been a problem. My new years resolution is to place all important data on a single network drive (visible to all computers on the network) and back that up every day to a second hard drive.
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  6. Member oldandinthe way's Avatar
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    I've recycled the myriad hard disks I've replaced in upgrades over the years and put them in external USB boxes.

    At $10 for a 2.5" box without powersupply, and $25 for a 3.5" box with powersupply & fan, a have an assortment of 20gb, 40gb, 160gb backup drives.
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  7. Master of Time & Space Capmaster's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by 20/20
    I'd have to say a Harddisk (that is if you keep them hooked up regul. I think
    magnetic media needs refresshing/spinning or it will loos its capabilities very soon?)
    No. A harddisk is "non-volatile" storage, You could disconnect it and store it in the closet for 10 years, take it down and hook it up, and it would be just fine.

    Originally Posted by edDV
    Backup frequently.
    Absolutely. Positively. There are two types of people in the world - those who backup ....and those who will

    When you lose data on a hard disk, it's not because of the retentive properties of the media, it's due to a bad sector or another physical cause. Hard disks don't lose data over reasonable time, at least not as how you'd be able to notice
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  8. Yeah, but who is to say there is going to be a computer of dvd drive that can read them in 20 years?

    What if you backed up to those 8" floppy disks 20 years ago? Just think how you'd read them today.
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  9. I do a belt-and-suspenders approach where I backup to hard drive and DVD, but it can be a bit of a pain to keep track of stuff after a while -- I've got easily a terabyte (sp?) of stuff, in various forms (music, images, programs) on various drives and DVDs (for redundancy), and hopefully one of them will work when my system fails!

    That being said, for the most part I do love the convenience and speed of a hard drive for backup. True, there's always a risk of mechanical failure, but I've worked with computers for over 10 years and I've had better luck recovering data from "dead" hard drives over the years, compared to recovering data from CDs or DVDs that have bit the dust. That may just be my luck, and again I do backup to DVD for the bulk of my stuff ... but I'm loathe to delete stuff from my hard drives (even if backed up to other media), just in case my backups fail, too.

    Now if I could just find where I put my original install CD for "Duke Nukem 3D" ... :P
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  10. Originally Posted by Bjs

    4: Dvd

    a: If it's that important ... do not store it here ... your mad if you do .
    Why is backing files up onto DVD-Rs a bad idea?

    I have just recently started putting pictures and videos from home onto DVD-Rs because my Digital camera takes videos at 640x480 which are huge file sizes. Usually only a few 1-2 min videos fit onto a CD-R, whereas a DVD-R hold 4x as much. Makes it very inefficient to use CD-Rs. But if file loss is a possiblity then I may re-think my situation.
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  11. Originally Posted by chewie8008
    I have just recently started putting pictures and videos from home onto DVD-Rs because my Digital camera takes videos at 640x480 which are huge file sizes. Usually only a few 1-2 min videos fit onto a CD-R, whereas a DVD-R hold 4x as much. Makes it very inefficient to use CD-Rs. But if file loss is a possiblity then I may re-think my situation.
    File loss is always a possibility, using any backup method or media, but I definitely think you're smart to backup to DVD. The problem is not the method, but the media -- there's a heck of a lot of variation in the quality of DVD (and CD) media (for home burning) and it definitely does pay to get the best media.

    What's the best media? You can't go wrong by reading up at www.nomorecoasters.com -- the price difference between excellent media and coaster-fodder is literally pennies per disc, and it absolutely never pays off (in the long run) to cut corners on DVD blanks.

    So keep doing what you're doing and backup, backup, BACKUP all those precious one-of-a-kind digital images! And it never hurts to make backups of your backups!
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  12. Member ahhaa's Avatar
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    Check the warranty on DVDs; nobody will give you even 2 years on a home-burnable disc.

    As far as longevity, my record is a Phillips cassette holding still data from a 1987 Tandy 100.

    I'd bet on CDs as being the safest media with the longest half-life, because of the audio market mostly.
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  13. Member ranchhand's Avatar
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    Okay, an honest (not intended as a challenge!) question for those who distrust DVDs for backup: look at all the movies with complicated soundtracks that are sold/stored on DVDs commercially. In our home we have movies years old that look as good as the day they were burned with no glitches, hiccups or crashes. Do commercial manufacturers use a different format/method/disc etc. from the ones we buy?
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  14. Originally Posted by ranchhand
    Do commercial manufacturers use a different format/method/disc etc. from the ones we buy?
    Yes. Movie DVDs are made by stamping pits onto aluminum sheets and sealing them between two pieces of plastic. Recordable DVDs use dyes and a flat reflective layer between two pieces of plastic. The laser in a DVD burner writes patterns into the dyes. The dyes aren't as stable as pits in a sheet of aluminum.
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  15. Member Soopafresh's Avatar
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    I have 3 year old DVD backups which I cannot read any longer - tried the media on several different machines. I even have some of the same pristine blank disks which I've tried to write to and it fails every time. Eventually, the rot sets in....
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  16. Member ranchhand's Avatar
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    Jagabo, thanks, you helped me again. Very good information on that, I was wondering for a long time how these several-year old movies could last and yet folks reported that home-burned DVDs failed. Thanks Soopafresh, you are the first one that actually had several bad experiences.

    Okay, here's what I think I will do: I got a new 160 gig WD hard drive I never used; I am going to install it in my computer (this month I am building a new 2/core-AM2 AMD since the Newegg prices are dropping after Christmas) and use it dedicated for my "raw" mpeg2 files and finished Pinnacle movies. When I am done with my family project, the hd gets removed and stored. Sound like a plan to you guys?
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  17. Master of Time & Space Capmaster's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by jagabo
    Originally Posted by ranchhand
    Do commercial manufacturers use a different format/method/disc etc. from the ones we buy?
    Yes. Movie DVDs are made by stamping pits onto aluminum sheets and sealing them between two pieces of plastic. Recordable DVDs use dyes and a flat reflective layer between two pieces of plastic. The laser in a DVD burner writes patterns into the dyes. The dyes aren't as stable as pits in a sheet of aluminum.
    Sorry to disagree, but there is good evidence that home-burned DVDs (and CDs) last longer than commercial pressed discs. The issue isn't the stability of the pits themselves, but rather the corrosion of the aluminum, affecting readability.

    General industry guidelines now estimate office-burned copies of CDs and DVDs could remain readable for 100 to 200 years.
    NIST has found that recordable disks seem to last much longer than rewritable disks, Byers said, and even longer than manufactured disks such as CDs for installing commercial software.
    But the weakness of the ROM disks stems largely from their aluminum reflective layer, Byers said.

    When exposed to humidity and atmospheric oxygen through scratches, cracks or delaminated areas in the label, the aluminum breaks down.
    Here's the full article:

    http://www.gcn.com/23_5/news/25166-1.html
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  18. Member edDV's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ranchhand
    Jagabo, thanks, you helped me again. Very good information on that, I was wondering for a long time how these several-year old movies could last and yet folks reported that home-burned DVDs failed. Thanks Soopafresh, you are the first one that actually had several bad experiences.

    Okay, here's what I think I will do: I got a new 160 gig WD hard drive I never used; I am going to install it in my computer (this month I am building a new 2/core-AM2 AMD since the Newegg prices are dropping after Christmas) and use it dedicated for my "raw" mpeg2 files and finished Pinnacle movies. When I am done with my family project, the hd gets removed and stored. Sound like a plan to you guys?
    I'd do that plus back the 160GB drive to another drive. Big hard drives are getting cheaper every day. Hard drives fail but seldom two go at once.
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  19. Master of Time & Space Capmaster's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by edDV
    Originally Posted by ranchhand
    Jagabo, thanks, you helped me again. Very good information on that, I was wondering for a long time how these several-year old movies could last and yet folks reported that home-burned DVDs failed. Thanks Soopafresh, you are the first one that actually had several bad experiences.

    Okay, here's what I think I will do: I got a new 160 gig WD hard drive I never used; I am going to install it in my computer (this month I am building a new 2/core-AM2 AMD since the Newegg prices are dropping after Christmas) and use it dedicated for my "raw" mpeg2 files and finished Pinnacle movies. When I am done with my family project, the hd gets removed and stored. Sound like a plan to you guys?
    I'd do that plus back the 160GB drive to another drive. Big hard drives are getting cheaper every day. Hard drives fail but seldom two go at once.
    Or set up RAID 1. Mirror your drive with a duplicate, constantly being updated.

    You can buy a decent Seagate 160GB SATA drive for $55 nowadays, even less if you go Maxtor or WD.

    http://www.upgrade-solution.com/detail.cfm?show=yes&PID=892&add=yes
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  20. Member
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    Originally Posted by victoriabears
    How about "on line" storage, I know it costs but if its that important
    I've been playing around with that idea for a while now.

    All your data, in chunks stored twice or thrice on different parts of the internet.
    All chunks pass-protected and only I have the pass and know where the different parts are
    You can even attach bits of rar to other fileformats like pictures.

    But that's possibly a no go/bad idea :N
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  21. Member
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    It's so cool computer-data needs no passport and can cross borders very easily 8)
    Don't you just love the internet?
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  22. Member ahhaa's Avatar
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    On the Media reported today on these Web 3.0 guys who wear a cam 24/7 taking a snap every minute... extremely interesting! how many HDs would a whole life take?:]

    here's the blurb:
    The Persistence of Memory
    Computer scientist Gordon Bell is at the vanguard of a movement called “lifelogging,” digitally recording every moment of his day in an effort to create a complete virtual memory of his life. But why? We talk with Bell and also technology writer Clive Thompson about the implications.

    http://www.onthemedia.org/
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