Good blank DVD media? TDK, Imation and Verbatim?

[Rauli]

Hi all,

I am looking to reduce the cost of dvd authoring. I have so far used the TDK printable dvd+r media with very good compatibility results. Last time I purchased a stack I only paid AUS$30 for 50 discs but that was in a sale at officeworks. TDK discs i been using seem to cost about $1 each but lately I have paid attention to imation and verbatim brand dvd+r printable media that cos as low as 50 cents per disc. What is peoples opinion or experience with the verbatim and imation media? Can their compatibility and general quality compare enough to warrant purchasing them instead of the more expensive TDK brand?

Thanks,
Rauli

[primus_fan2001]

In my opinion, it goes like this (in order from best to worst):

Verbatim>>>>>>>TDK>>>>>>>Imation

[JimboS]

http://www.digitalfaq.com/media/index.htm

[Krispy Kritter]

Verbatim and TY are currently considered among the "best". Although, everyones results may differ. I generally only use TY, but I have used various other brands (Memorex, TDK, Playo, a few others) without any issues.

[FulciLives]

If buying retail stick to Verbatim unless you want to learn the "tricks" of identifying what is and isn't Taiyo Yuden.

The easier way to buy Taiyo Yuden is to do so direct ---> http://www.rima.com/

Always use DVD-R instead of DVD+R unless you want to go Dual Layer then use Verbatim DVD+R DL discs.

- John "FulciLives" coleman

[mwkurt]

I have used 100's of +R Verbatim printables purchased in cakes of 100 from Sam's Club and have never had a problem with them. I purchase them probably once every two weeks. I find them to be very good media.
And I disagree with FulciLives about only using -R. Using +R and setting the bit to ROM will get you just as much if not more compatability than using -R disks.
Mark

[oldandinthe way]

I too prefer DVD+R with bitsetting.

[bbanderic]

If buying retail stick to Verbatim unless you want to learn the "tricks" of identifying what is and isn't Taiyo Yuden.

The easier way to buy Taiyo Yuden is to do so direct ---> http://www.rima.com/

Always use DVD-R instead of DVD+R unless you want to go Dual Layer then use Verbatim DVD+R DL discs.

- John "FulciLives" coleman

I use only TY from Rima, if buying retail I'd go with Verbatim, forget about the rest.

I disagree with only using -R over the +R SL media, these days compatibility is equal IMO, even without bitsetting. 90% of my collection is on TY 8X DVD+R (YUDEN000T02) without bitsetting, both of my burners, PIO 111 and NEC 3520 don't support SL bitsetting, automatically bitsets DVD+R DL. Never had trouble with compatibility and I do a lot of trading. The 8X TY DVD+R is some of the best media ever produced IMO.

[FulciLives]

Fan boys make me sick.

Anyone in the real world knows that you only use -R for single layer especially if you are doing it as a business (or *cough* trading) where it will be out amoung a wide variety of different hardware.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[bbanderic]

Fan boys make me sick.

Anyone in the real world knows that you only use -R for single layer especially if you are doing it as a business (or *cough* trading) where it will be out amoung a wide variety of different hardware.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

I don't know, you're the one who sounds like a fanboy to me, I don't necessarily favor one format over the other, it just so happens that the 8X TY DVD+R have worked the best for ME. And no, I don't sell DVD's as you seem to imply. I usually enjoy your posts, you usually don't exibit such an arrogant attitude, too bad.

Sounds like you're living in the past, times have changed, it's well documented that compatibilty is equal unless you're using an ancient DVD player.

[mwkurt]

Fanboy? What does that mean?
Not to turn this into a p-ssing contest but here are the facts. When comparing compatability of
-R vs. +R only, -R DVD's will be more compatible. However, if bitsetting is brought into the equation for +R DVD's. then the bitset +R will be more compatible every time. Nothing fanboyish about it, that's just the way it is. Here are a couple articles for you if you doubt this.
Mark

http://www.signvideo.com/btst-d.htm

http://www.cdfreaks.com/reviews/Increased-compatibility-DVD-bitsetting.html

[FulciLives]

I favor the one that tends to work best across a wide range of platforms and that happens to be DVD-R ... end of story.

As for that FACT being "in the past" ... well ... I suggest your sense of time is rather on the short side.

Those that favor DVD-R for compatability always get bashed by the +R crowd who think we are "inferior" for some reason that I have never been able to fathom ... well other than maybe they started off on the "wrong foot" by starting with +R to begin with.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[bbanderic]

Fanboy? What does that mean?
Not to turn this into a p-ssing contest but here are the facts. When comparing compatability of
-R vs. +R only, -R DVD's will be more compatible. However, if bitsetting is brought into the equation for +R DVD's. then the bitset +R will be more compatible every time. Nothing fanboyish about it, that's just the way it is. Here are a couple articles for you if you doubt this.
Mark

http://www.signvideo.com/btst-d.htm

http://www.cdfreaks.com/reviews/Increased-compatibility-DVD-bitsetting.html

First paragraph in the Signvideo link above:

A great debate continues over which is the "most compatible" recordable DVD format - DVD+R or DVD-R?

"Most studies seem to show that under "normal conditions" the two formats are about equal and that something like 80-90% of modern DVD players can handle them, if the DVD's are encoded and burned properly."

This is without bitsetting. Obviously bitsetting will make +R even more compatible in most cases.

Best advise, whether it's -R or +R, use what's best for you and the equipment that you're using.

[oldandinthe way]

I started with -R media. Discovered that when a DVD player was too damned old it wouldn't play them or +R. Had a Samsung DVD writer at that time.

Discovered it had fewer burn errors on +R media and so I started to use +R. After that I only bought -R when the stores had sold out of the great specials on +R.

My current LG writers can bitset so I only buy +R. It provides an advantage with some marginal players (players which interpreted the specs too tightly) and I have not found a difference on the other antiques which reject all burned media.

Its really tough that the folks who were early adoptors at a high price have equpment which is pickier than the cheapskates who waited until DVD hardware was a commodity. Especially since all the knowledge gained about good results has become largely irrelevant.

The consumer who buys a factory assembled machine from a low end vendor like e-machines and a spindle of this weeks sale DVDs, has few problems once he learns to use the bundled software. Never worries about firmware updates (handled automatically), media IDs (everything works pretty well), or other minutia. When he wants to play pirate he buys some software like anyDVD and gets frequent updates/

[Capmaster]

I use only TY from Rima

Same here 8)

[J. Baker]

I've never had any burn issues ever. I currently use Maxell -R disc with my Pioneer DVR-A08XL.

[Rauli]

Thanks for the input. I agree DVD+R is best since it supports the book type dvd-rom which all factory pressed commericial dvds are set at. DVD-R supports pseudo book typing done as a work around on compatible burners and burner software and I know some dvd players don't get tricked by this work around. Seems to me verbatim is the way to go, I cant find a place that sells this TY brand.

[budz]

I walked into Office Depot this morning to find on their clearance table VERBATIM PRINTABLE 16x DVD+R media 100 pack spindle for $20.00!!!!

They were on clearance because the spindles were cracked on the bottom or on the sides. I checked the discs to make sure they were not damaged or cracked so I bought what I could carry back to my office.

[FulciLives]

Must I point out that the +R format is a bastard child of a greedy group of companies that didn't want to play ball with the official DVD Forum ratification of DVD-R being the standard?

What's that famous quote ... [excuse me as I check with the google god] ...

OK I found it:

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
- George Santayana

In a very general way that quote sums up the concept that one must know the past in order to make sense of the present or the near future.

How does that apply here?

Well in this context it means to please remember how the whole DVD-R and then DVD+R thing came about.

Do try to remember that DVD-R was (IS) the OFFICIAL STANDARD and that DVD+R was nothing but the product of a disgruntled and greedy and [insert more negative stuff of your own imagination thank you] group of companies.

I mean this is old news that you should be aware of ... we aren't even talking anywhere near THAT old ... not old enough for the truth to have been "twisted" just yet.

So the entire CONCEPT that DVD+R is better than DVD-R totally disregards the historical fact ... yes fact ... that DVD-R is the official format created.

I submit that any DVD player that somehow plays DVD+R (bitset or not) better than DVD-R is a DVD player that was MADE in some way to do this and as such that piece of hardware (the DVD player) disregards the fact that DVD-R is the OFFICIAL format.

This thread is like talking to a bunch of brainwashed fan boys that are under the utter delusion that Picard is somehow better than Kirk. I mean c'mon!

I feel like slapping the lot of you like a man slaps a hysterical woman to bring her back to her senses.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[mwkurt]

You're wrong John, I don't watch Star Trek. And I really could care less about the history of DVD's, blah, blah, blah...
All of your rhetoric doesn't change the facts.
Mark

[oldandinthe way]

It really is a shame that this forum includes independant minded heretics who do not accept the fact that DVD-R , TY and made in japan are superior.

If there are fan-boys posting it is likely they are fans of the above.

I use what works for me, and do not pay extra for any of the above.

Much of the compatibility isssues stem from the early interpreters of the DVDV spec who chose to implement the specification in a manner which was more restrictive than required. Recordable DVDs required a loosening of the implementation. And the silicon implementations were looser.

DVD+R represents an alternative approach to that taken by the rigid adherents of DVD-R. Given the overall issues with reliability in optical media, it is clear this innovation is well received.

At the retailers I visit, DVD+R sells out far before DVD-R. And the clearance bins are full of slow (4x and 8x) DVD-R media.

[lordsmurf]

"Most studies seem to show that under "normal conditions" the two formats are about equal and that something like 80-90% of modern DVD players can handle them, if the DVD's are encoded and burned properly."
This is without bitsetting. Obviously bitsetting will make +R even more compatible in most cases.

Incorrect.

Prior to bitsetting, DVD+R had a compatibility in the 70-75% range. It was bitsetting that raised it to nearly the same level as DVD-R, in the 85-90% range. Most people either forget this too easily, or simply were not around in the earlier days of burning. There is nothing that will make DVD+R more compatible than DVD-R, on single-layer media.

The inverse is true for dual-layer/double-layer media. DVD+R DL is far more compatible than DVD-R DL media.

[bbanderic]

Must I point out that the +R format is a bastard child of a greedy group of companies that didn't want to play ball with the official DVD Forum ratification of DVD-R being the standard?

What's that famous quote ... [excuse me as I check with the google god] ...

OK I found it:

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
- George Santayana

In a very general way that quote sums up the concept that one must know the past in order to make sense of the present or the near future.

How does that apply here?

Well in this context it means to please remember how the whole DVD-R and then DVD+R thing came about.

Do try to remember that DVD-R was (IS) the OFFICIAL STANDARD and that DVD+R was nothing but the product of a disgruntled and greedy and [insert more negative stuff of your own imagination thank you] group of companies.

I mean this is old news that you should be aware of ... we aren't even talking anywhere near THAT old ... not old enough for the truth to have been "twisted" just yet.

So the entire CONCEPT that DVD+R is better than DVD-R totally disregards the historical fact ... yes fact ... that DVD-R is the official format created.

I submit that any DVD player that somehow plays DVD+R (bitset or not) better than DVD-R is a DVD player that was MADE in some way to do this and as such that piece of hardware (the DVD player) disregards the fact that DVD-R is the OFFICIAL format.

This thread is like talking to a bunch of brainwashed fan boys that are under the utter delusion that Picard is somehow better than Kirk. I mean c'mon!

I feel like slapping the lot of you like a man slaps a hysterical woman to bring her back to her senses.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

Again, you're the ONLY one on this thread talking like a brainwashed fanboy, very radically I might say. No one, except yourself, is saying one format is better than the other.

All the new PC burners these days burn and play both formats. Same with most new standalone DVD players/recorders. In fact, two company's off the top of my head, Panasonic and Pioneer both staunch supporters of only DVD-R in the beginning, support both formats on their SA players/recorders and advertise this feature, where in the past they didn't.

The average consumer doesn't want confusion, they don't know, or care, about which format was/is historically the "official" one, all they know is what's on the store shelf. Most, if not all, manufacturers understand this....Pioneer, Panasonic, Sony to name a few....support both formats to compete in today's market....that's just the way it is.

[lordsmurf]

In case some of your missed it, the "format war" sort of faded away about 2 years ago. When DVD+R caught up to DVD-R, more or less (less, but not by much), and drives started to ALL go dual-format, the "war" ended.

It's over fellas.

You remind me of Civil War reenactors.

[FulciLives]

Perhaps DVD+R is now nearly as compatible as DVD-R but I am still very suspicious of it being AS and definately not MORE-SO.

Also I was there in the early days when only DVD-R worked well and it is fact that DVD+R was a rogue off-shoot so ...

Maybe DVD+R caught up but that is all that it is.

Don't dare try to make it out like it is superior or some bullshit.

Hence my argument about knowing your history.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[hech54]

I use both and never had a problem with either of them....before or after bitsetting. I've sent probably hundreds of DVD's all over the world....using what I had on hand....not taking into consideration whether it was + or - and have never had a single problem.
Granted most of what I sent was in trade or free and the recipient had no right to complain....but still....no complaints at all.


As far as the original poster....Verbatim would be my first choice if I were in a store and had to purchase blanks and I didn't have my stash of Taiyo Yudens handy.

[kissvid]

I have to jump in on this band wagon. I can't honestly give an opinion on the +r format because when this all started years ago they were not that compatible. I just did away with it then. I have a video company for the past 3 years. I do mainly Dance recitals and I am booked the entire summer every year. I use TY's Pre-labeled 8x -R's. I purchase from rima or super media store only and average 800 burns per summer. That's 2400 dvd's for the past 3 years just for the summer alone. That's a lot of customers and a lot of different dvd players. I have yet to get a return. I burn using my plextor drive that is in my primera Bravo 2 or my Pioneer dvr-108 drive. Still no issues. In my opinion, spend the little extra money in media and most of problems always go away.

Marc Sico
Sico Productions

[Constant Gardener]

VHS or Beta. +R or -R. HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. Protestant or Catholic. Next, please.

[Rauli]

I am not sure where the logic fails, dvd+r supports proper booktyping to dvd-rom which all factory pressed dvds are set at. I also find I get better compatibility especially with older dvd players if i burn at the slowest possible rate. I decided to try this when years ago when i made backup audio cds when burning with my creative cd burner at 16x the sound would skip or the cd would not initialize at all but when burnt at 2x they always worked and I got less frisbees, this was for an old cd player. Anyway thanks for everyones input, even though it got a bit fanatical and flamy.

[zoobie]

Kirk would kick that eggheads ass...

hic