Convert 16:9 to 14:9

[Alex_ander]

Checking ITU-R BT.601-4 compliancy box gives 544x480.

[FulciLives]

Checking ITU-R BT.601-4 compliancy box gives 544x480.

I didn't realize that.

Ahhh the great debate ... to ITU or to not ITU ... LOL

This argument is about inconclusive as the dreaded TMPGEnc Plus option, "Output YUV data as Basic YCbCr not CCIR601"

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[guns1inger]

When you two have finished your pissing contest, can we get back to the matter at hand ?

The source is anamorphic 16:9, being converted to 14:9 in a 4:3 letterbox format. So 16:9 going in, 4:3 coming out.

I still stand by my previous calculation, which resizes from anamorphic to correctly scaled 4:3, then crops the width to fit the video frame and adds borders to get back to full frame height.

Can you prove it's wrong ?

[FulciLives]

Well using FitCD I get the following:

1.) Not using ITU resizing:
Take the original PAL and crop from 720x576 to 628x576 ... crop 46 from the left and 46 from the right. Then resize from 628x576 to 704x416 then pad with black to 720x480

In AviSynth it would look like this:

Crop(46,0,-46,-0)
LanczosResize(704,416)
AddBorders(8,32,8,32)

2.) Using ITU resizing:
Take the original PAL and crop from 720x576 to 612x576 ... crop 54 from the left and 54 from the right. Then resize from 612x576 to 704x416 then pad with black to 720x480

In AviSynth it would look like this:

Crop(54,0,-54,-0)
LanczosResize(704,416)
AddBorders(8,32,8,32)

Whichever way you pick this is more "direct" then the way first proposed by guns1inger in that this way you are only resizing once whereas with guns1inger's way you had to resize twice.

I'm guessing Alex_ander will pick the ITU resize method. I'm curious which way guns1inger thinks is best? In this instance I have no idea truth-be-told to go ITU or not.

Anyways if you want to go total 4:3 1.33:1 then I stand by my figures earlier for that method.

Oh and the two methods I just out-lined will give you 14:9 in a 4:3 frame.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

*** EDIT ***
Corrected a mistake in my sample AviSynth lines of code

[guns1inger]

ITU probably isn't relevant as DV uses the entire 720 width, not the broadcast 704, although a purist will probably tell you to adjust for it anyway.

I wonder if the OP thinks all this is worth it ?

[Alex_ander]

I suggested something like this in the beginning for NTSC target:

Crop(46,0,-46,-0)
LanczosResize(720,416)
AddBorders(0,32,0,32)

It is close to the second John's version in keeping displayed proportions.
As already mentioned, the fields should be separated before crop/resize lines, then weaved back.
If resizing is performed in VDubMod, unfold/fold modes of deinterlace filter can be used.

[dvd3500]

Maybe this can help...
Video Size Calculator (at the bottom)
http://www.guthspot.se/video/index.htm

[dvd3500]

I wonder if the OP thinks all this is worth it ?

Most definately. As I said in another post I am not sure how to handle the non-square pixels of the 16:9 picture etc.
Most likely the best thing to do at this point is to test all the theories and see what it look like.

[dvd3500]

Made some progress. On the BBC websirte they compare square to non-square pixels. So a 16:9 pciture in PAL in square pixels is actually 1024X576:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/commissioning/tvbranding/picturesize.shtml
I was able to create what appeared to be a decent 4:3 full screenm and 14:9 PAL trasnfer.
Next step is to ensure that I get circles and not eggs when I go to NTSC.

[Alex_ander]

You don't need to keep in mind these numbers and square pixels when resizing for PAL(NTSC) target. It is only important to crop the proper left/right part (2/16 or 46+46 pix if your original PAL/NTSC image had 720 horisontal pixels) of image before resizing and to use the correct height value for letterboxing the image (416 for NTSC or 496 for PAL 14/9 target).
If you look at our final resize recommendations, they are almost the same and were confirmed using the trusted FitCD calculation utility. The second version by John gives the same proportions and is only different in adding 8+8 vertical borders instead of additionally cropped 8+8 pix. The borders will be hidden on TV due overscan and will be visible on PC.
You'll be only able to check circles/ovals/squares after resizing the 3:2 (720x480) NTSC encoding to a 4:3 screen (e.g. by encoding a short fragment for a media player).

[guns1inger]

If you use avisynth you can open the avs script in virtualdub and set the display for NTSC 4:3 to test the proportions before encoding.

[dvd3500]

Thanks guys, (Alex_ander: Sposiba!)
I will try to get to it this week.

[dvd3500]

Hi Guys,
So far so good. The only issue thusfar is that I am adding stills from a digital camera and Media Studio Pro (MSP) is stretching them so much that cropping to 14:9 makes them look a little wide.
I think I am setting something wrong in MSP but actual 16:9 footage looks really good at 14:9 on a 4:3 TV.
Thanks for your help. I might post the results :-)