Good DVD Bitrate?

[bobafett573]

hi I just got a tv tuner card for my laptop. i had another one but it was crap so I'm sorta familiar with video capturing and editing. However, this new program allows you to record it directly into DVD-compatible MPEG2 format but it makes me choose a bitrate. It's default bitrate is like 7500ish but that means I can only fit about 1.5 hours onto a DVD but I was hoping to be able to put 2 hour movies on it. I used the bitrate calculator and found that they said to make the bitrate around 5000. Is a bitrate of 5000 still good quality or will there be a very noticeable decrease in quality?

[mats.hogberg]

Depending on how good signal you got (static/noise) you may need as high bitrate as you can "afford".
If you get macro blocks with 5000 kbps (which is plenty, from a clean source), drop the resolution to 1/2 D1 to see if it looks better. I use 4000 kbps @1/2 D1 res with results indistinguishable from "live".

/Mats

[edDV]

Your 1.6GHz CPU isn't fast enough for real time encoding to MPeg2. The more you compress, the faster the CPU needs to be.

Most get around the problem by buying a capture card with hardware encoding such as the Hauppauge PVR series. That will work well with low power CPUs and leave the CPU free for use during capture.

[bobafett573]

yes i have a hardware encoder so the whole 1.6 ghz thing ain't a problem. I'm still not understanding what you mean by 5000 bit macro or whatever it was called. how do i go about doing that? my program has an option of recording "1/2 NTSC DVD" is what it calls it. is that what you're talking about?

[ultramarine]

Good quality check is the your eye. I've done good dvd with tvtuner. I can cram about 5.5 hours to a dvd with mpeg2 vbr average video bitrate of 1600 and sound bitrate of 160. I use tmpgenc3 xpress and set to 1/2D1 with progressive scan. The quality is very similar to the actual transmission depending on the type of show. This generally works if the movie is mostly talking heads.

I think the quality of the final encoding software is the most imprtant.

[edDV]

yes i have a hardware encoder so the whole 1.6 ghz thing ain't a problem. I'm still not understanding what you mean by 5000 bit macro or whatever it was called. how do i go about doing that? my program has an option of recording "1/2 NTSC DVD" is what it calls it. is that what you're talking about?

I think we need a reset and start over.

What is this hardware encoder?
I've even searched your profile and looked at the Geforce 7900GS to see if it encodes.

Start over. Tell us all about your secret hardware encoder and restate what your problem is exactly?

5000 Kbps is a low MPeg2 rate with compromise at 720x480.
1/2 NTSC would be 352x240 or 352x480 which would work at 5000 Kbps or lower but with the compromise of 352 horizontal pixels and/or 240 lines with half motion resolution.

[Scorpion King]

Your 7.5Mbps for an hour and a half, and your 5.0Mbps for two hours of video sound a lot like CBR (constant bitrate) settings. You can probably get your two hour DVD by simply selecting VBR (variable bitrate) with your 7.5Mbps (7500kbps) setting. You will just haft to try it to find out.

With CBR the bitrate is supposed to remain constaint so you should be able to calculate the final filesize, but with VBR the amount of action in the video will have an effect on the final filesize. The more action the larger the filesize. This again you will just haft to test with your setup.

[edDV]

With CBR the bitrate is supposed to remain constaint so you should be able to calculate the final filesize, but with VBR the amount of action in the video will have an effect on the final filesize. The more action the larger the filesize. This again you will just haft to test with your setup.

And two pass will fit to specified average file size.

[mats.hogberg]

And two pass will fit to specified average file size.

...but isn't an option for a realtime hardware encoder.
1/2 D1 NTSC would be 352*480 - enough to do TV broadcast full justice. I suspect that's what's meant by "half NTSC" (even if it could also be 352x240 - which would equal a slightly worn VHS tape in quality).
But the bottom line is: You have to try the different settings out by yourself, and find out what's good quality and not to you.

/Mats

[SatStorm]

704 x 480/576 @ 6000kb/s looks "OK" if the source is good.
5000kb/s gonna look good on static scenes and slow camera movements. Most movies gonna look "OK". For music videos, athletic tv material, home movies, etc, gonna look bad.
352 x 576/480 at 4000kb/s gonna look excellent.

If your capture card allows VBR, use it: I suggest you something like 704 x 480 @ 2000 min - 5000 average - 8000 max. That should do the trick

[MOVIEGEEK]

When I capture MPEG I use CBR:
352x240=~2000kbps
352x480=~4000kbps
720x480=~8000kbps
If I capture AVI I will usually encode VBR.
As others have said it depends on the source and how much I want to put on a DVD.

[AlecWest]

While I may use a different capture card than you do, here's a link to my video bitrate cheatsheet. It might be of value to you:

https://forum.videohelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=309331

[sepultura]

msg posted in error.

[lordsmurf]

Good quality check is the your eye. I've done good dvd with tvtuner. I can cram about 5.5 hours to a dvd with mpeg2 vbr average video bitrate of 1600 and sound bitrate of 160. I use tmpgenc3 xpress and set to 1/2D1 with progressive scan. The quality is very similar to the actual transmission depending on the type of show. This generally works if the movie is mostly talking heads.

I would hate to watch that. For starters, the audio bitrate is really out-of-spec. And then the video is starved for bitrate. There will be noise, probably lots of it, mostly blocks. Talking heads means they will be static blocks with visible mosquito noise, but blocks all the same.

An extra disc costs almost nothing, and takes almost no extra room, yet the benefit would be video that is vastly superior.

[Nelson37]

I have a question for you, BobaFett.

When you eat dinner, do you decide for yourself what tastes good and what does not, or do you ask someone else to make this decision for you? If you don't like seafood and someone recommends Red Lobster, do you eat there? How did you decide what color to paint your house, or what kind of car to buy?

There is no correct answer to your question, nor is there an incorrect one, either. What is acceptable to you, and what is not, is something only you can answer.

Note Ultramarine's post. I would not use those settings in general, but for that person it seems to work. It is a sliding scale with Resolution and Bitrate vs Filesize and Disk Cost.

You would also need to do some detailed analysis as simply entering someone else's suggested bitrate may very well result in something completely different depending on your software and hardware, both of which are unknown. CBR and VBR will impact this significantly, as will any applied filters (some are beyond user control), source type, size of viewing display, distance from said display, quality of eyesight, type of video encoded, and several other variables.

Try different methods and settings. Look at the result, and compare it to others. Then decide. There is no other way. It is simple to pick just one, think "this is great", and never try anything else. Then you will be astonished at the improvement possible, and be very upset you have already made several substandard recordings that could have been much better.

Or, eat at Wendy's, avoid all seafood, paint your house light blue, and drive a Chevy.

[dadrab]

What is this hardware encoder?
I've even searched your profile and looked at the Geforce 7900GS to see if it encodes.

Start over. Tell us all about your secret hardware encoder and restate what your problem is exactly?

...still waiting...

[ultramarine]

My setting to cram 5.5 hours looks ok on some players but blocky on others. Tried on 2 samsung with progressive scan and it looks good. I can tell its not DVD quality if i sit 2 feet away but if i sit 5-6 feet away its hard to tell. I think the player and the TV makes a difference but i'm not sure. Any advise?

I think it depends on shows. If record mostly drama with talking heads then why bother with 6000 bitrates? Its still TV quality.

If backing up DVD, then just rip and copy. Much easier.

If want to put 10 VCD into 1 dvd then use 1150 bitrate.

It all depends....

[lordsmurf]

Its still TV quality.

What's that supposed to mean?
Broadcast quality is not as perfect as a studio DVD, but it's still pretty good. It's certainly a hell of a lot better than 1500k bitrate MPEG-2. For example, DVB (digital satellite tv) averages in the 2000-3000k range, and uses a special MPEG-2 setup (not compliant to DVD) that allows for better compression.