100 MB for Each Minute for AVI! How? Why?

[moviebuff2]

Hi everyone:

I have a WinTV (by Hauppauge!) that says AVI uses 100 MB for each minute. However, most of AVIs (DivX) I got from the Internet are 2 hours long each, but the size is only 700 MB per file.

Per WinTV, a 2-hr AVI would take up 12 GB (100 MB/min X 60 min/hr X 2 hrs).

I think the difference is caused by the bitrate set for each AVI file. The higher the bitrate, the larger the file. Am I correct?

But, is it really necessary to apply such high bitrate? The 700-MB AVIs that cetainly have a much lower bitrate look just fine on my 20-inch TV monitor.

Is there any way I can make WinTV use less disk space?

Thanks

[LloydAZ]

AVI is just a wrapper for different codecs. The 700 MB files that contain 2 hours of video are probably using a dirivitive of MPG-4 such as the DivX or Xvid codec which will compress a lot smaller than a lossless codec, but requires a bit more horsepower out of your CPU for compression or decompression.

I'm not sure which codec WinTV uses as I don't have one. I have the "AVerTV GO 007 FM Plus" TV tuner card. It will let me choose which codec I want to utilize while capturing TV. If I try to use Xvid it doesn't work right, the sound goes out of sync. HuffYUV works pretty good if I want to capture as an AVI, otherwise I can just capture directly into an MPG-2 file.

[moviebuff2]

Thanks, LloydAZ.

[moviebuff2]

OK. I have cleaned up my hard drive and now have enough disk space to transfer my 1-hr video tape to an AVI, using WinTV. The file is estimated at 6GB (100MB/min X 60min).

I plan to convert this 6-GB AVI to DVD. Will this 1-hr video data fit a 4.75-GB DVD disc? I remember reading somewhere in this forum that the size of an AVI does not matter when converted to DVD and only the length of the video does. Please tell me if this is correct.

Thanks

[BobK]

I plan to convert this 6-GB AVI to DVD. Will this 1-hr video data fit a 4.75-GB DVD disc? I remember reading somewhere in this forum that the size of an AVI does not matter when converted to DVD and only the length of the video does. Please tell me if this is correct.

Not quite correct. The AVI must be converted to Mpeg-2. The size of the mpeg-2 file is determined by the length of the video AND the bitrate.

[LloydAZ]

OK. I have cleaned up my hard drive and now have enough disk space to transfer my 1-hr video tape to an AVI, using WinTV. The file is estimated at 6GB (100MB/min X 60min).

I plan to convert this 6-GB AVI to DVD. Will this 1-hr video data fit a 4.75-GB DVD disc? I remember reading somewhere in this forum that the size of an AVI does not matter when converted to DVD and only the length of the video does. Please tell me if this is correct.

Thanks

You are correct. Just make sure that you also have disc space available for your MPG-2 file that you are going to be creating and for your authoring process as well. You will probably have to free up around another 10 GB of hard drive space.

Video is a drivespace hog! Most people here will tell you the best thing to do is to have a dedicated second hard drive in their system set aside only for video conversion. Use the space, do the conversion and authoring, clean off the drive and defrag it so that it is nice and clean for the next time.

Your AVI file is going to be encoded into an MPG-2 file that is DVD compliant. Hopefully you have all of the tools that you'll need to encode and author the file to DVD. You'll need:

1 - MPG Encoder (TMPGEnc, CCE, etc...)
2 - Audio Transcoder for AC3 Audio (BeSweet with BeLight GUI, ffmpeg, etc...)
3 - A Bitrate Calculator (VideoCalc, etc...)
4 - Authoring Software (TDA, DLP, etc...)

Using VideoCalc, I have determined the following:

For a 1-Hour video using an AC3 audio track set at 256 Kbps, and leaving 200 MB available for authoring menus I get an Average Bitrate of 9483, and a Maximum Bitrate of 9544.

Check the tutorials online here. There are plenty of them on how to properly encode and author DVD's.

Take Care,
Lloyd

[hardhatmac]

I have a WinTV (by Hauppauge!) that says AVI uses 100 MB for each minute.

100 MB per minue is something I dream of.....I deal alot with uncompressed video......which for me is usually around 1.18 GB per minute.

100 MB compared to 1.18 GB is heavenly...but then I rarely deal with AVI's

[moviebuff2]

Hi Lloyd:

I just test-recorded a portion of my vacation video. The result was very bad!

The connection is pretty simple: VCR (composite video out) to WinTV (S-video in) via a small video converter (composite video at one end, S-video at the other).

Then I opened WinTV and recorded the video for approximately 2 minutes. The picture was very grainy. However, the original video is very clear when I watch it on a TV monitor. I don't know why the video became so bad after it was fed through WinTV with an S-video.

Would you have any suggestions?

Thanks

[dadrab]

Are you veiwing your capture on your computer monitor or have you burned a test DVD to watch on your TV? Watching interlaced video on the monitor will produce poor results.

I'm told to also use high quality cables. Perhaps that converter in the line is causing a problem too.

[moviebuff2]

Hi dadrab:

Thanks for the tip.

I burnt the test AVI file and watched it on the TV monitor. The result was even worse.

I used VirtualDubMod to get the file's information and found the cause (I think). The size of the video was only 320 x 240. The highest setting available with this WinTV is 352 x 288. This is too small to play on a 20-inch TV monitor. Am I thinking correctly?

Cheers

[LloydAZ]

Hi dadrab:

Thanks for the tip.

I burnt the test AVI file and watched it on the TV monitor. The result was even worse.

I used VirtualDubMod to get the file's information and found the cause (I think). The size of the video was only 320 x 240. The highest setting available with this WinTV is 352 x 288. This is too small to play on a 20-inch TV monitor. Am I thinking correctly?

Cheers

352x240 is NTSC standard size for VCD. 352x288 is PAL standard size for VCD. Though, both are also legal sizes for DVD as well (NTSC and PAL respectively.) I'm not sure which part of the world you live in, so I can't tell you which resolution is the correct one to choose.

The quickest and easiet way to capture VHS to DVD is to purchase a set top DVD Recorder and hook your VCR up directly to that. Your editing options are a bit limited, unless you don't mind messing around with ripping the DVD to the computer and doing a bit of manipulation with the files there. There are plenty of tools available here for that task.

Which model of Hauppauge WinTV are you using? Perhaps someone here is using the same one and can give you a bit more information about it than I can as I do not use WinTV. I have the "AverTV GO 007 FM Plus" but I never have used it to capture from VHS tapes, I use the DVD recorder for that.

What codec are you using to capture with? Does it allow you to change the codec? Have you tried changing the cables and doing another test? Are there any software updates available for the device?

Sometimes capturing from a VHS source requires the use of a video stabilizer or TBC box (Time Base Corrector.) It can look good on the TV, but look like crap when you capture the video on the computer because the TV is a little more forgiving and can compensate for discrepencies that converting to digital can not without the aid of a stabilizer or TBC.

I hate to say it, but it sounds like you have a low-end model that was designed primarily for watching TV on the computer with the ability to capture at a low resolution for later playback or VCD creation.

I don't want to discourage you with some of the answers that I have provided. I applaud you trying to get this to work. I was in your shoes at one point as well, and still have to look for answers here quite often when I can't figure something out. I love this site for that reason. The people here are good and can give you lots of good advice and help you with the situation. I'm sure that the answers that you are looking for are somewhere lurking around on this site. I'll help you as much as I can, though I am far from being an expert at this, and if I can't help with the problem, I don't mind poking around looking for a solution as well.

Take Care, and good luck!
Lloyd

[guns1inger]

At those resolutions you are going to get sub-VHS quality. I have never seen a VCD that was as good as a good VHS recording. If you are restricted to VCD resolutions, then it is time to upgrade if you value quality.

[moviebuff2]

LloudAZ wrote:

I hate to say it, but it sounds like you have a low-end model that was designed primarily for watching TV on the computer with the ability to capture at a low resolution for later playback or VCD creation

.

guns1inger wrote:

If you are restricted to VCD resolutions, then it is time to upgrade if you value quality.

Thanks. I think that's my case.

Can video capturing hardwares and softwares work interchangeably with other brands? I am asking this question because I have an Umax scanner (hardware) but I am not using their VistaScane (software) to capture the images of my photos. In other words, I am hoping that there are some softwares (with higher resolution) that will work with WinTV.


Added message:

I found it. VirtualDubMod allows me better resolutions. Another project for me.

[guns1inger]

Some software will work with a variety of hardware, some is restricted to certain chipsets only. SOme resolutions are restricted purely by hardware, and only a firmware upgrade will change that.

If virtualdub gives you a better range of options, then go for it. Get as close to full d1 as your system will allow.

[moviebuff2]

SOme resolutions are restricted purely by hardware, and only a firmware upgrade will change that.

Soooo true!

I was prematurely optimistic when I saw all those higher settings of VirtualDubMod. I chose 640 x 480 and an error message appeared "Format not supported". I chose several more settings, all resulted in error.

I am reading the stickies to learn more about capturing video to better prepare myself.

This is a VHS recording I made way back in 1987. The tape has been well kept so its conditions are excellent. I just watched it on my 20-inch TV monitor.

Thanks for all of your help.

[jagabo]

Hauppauge makes many devices that fall under the WinTV moniker. Nobody can give you specific recommendations unless you reveal exactly which product you have.

There are only a few manufacturers of video capture chips (Brooktree, Conexant, Philips). All the vendors use those chips. Often a vendor will have two products at different price points that use the same chip. The only difference is the drivers supplied with them. The cheap one comes with a driver that only captures at low resolution, the expensive one comes with a driver that can capture at higher resolutions. You can often download a generic driver (from the chip manufacturer) that works better than the vendor supplied drivers.

[moviebuff2]

Hi jagabo:

Mine is a WinTV-USB. I'm afraid that's all it says on the equipment.

Cheers

[jagabo]

Mine is a WinTV-USB. I'm afraid that's all it says on the equipment.

Since that is a USB 1.1 device without any hardware compression you won't be able to get more than about 352x240 (352x288 PAL) out of it.

[terjeber]

Mine is a WinTV-USB. I'm afraid that's all it says on the equipment.

The problem is your hardware is not up to snuff. You are going to have to get a better capture solution. The ADVC 1xx series gets some good reviews.

[moviebuff2]

Thanks!

This costed me $100 six years ago. Now, I will probably have to sell it for $.99 on eBay (pssttt, with $99.01 S&H )

[sanlyn]

moviebuff2: Get ye immediately to www.digitalfaq.com. Start on page 1. LordSmurf's work on that site is both invaluable and ingenious.