No Full HD Playback for 32-bit Vista

[akrako1]

http://www.apcstart.com/site/dwarne/2006/08/1139/microsoft-cuts-another-feature-full-h...in-32bit-vista

Microsoft cuts ANOTHER feature:
full HD playback in 32bit Vista goes

Microsoft revealed today that no 32-bit versions of Windows Vista will be able to play back “next generation high definition protected content” (translation – studio-released BluRay and HD-DVD movies).

By far the majority of PCs use 32-bit processors, because despite AMD’s efforts to push 64-bit CPUs into the marketplace early, Intel’s first widely-promoted 64-bit CPU is the just-released Core 2 Duo.

PC users will now have to choose between a PC that can play high definition content (64 bit) versus one that can potentially run older devices that only have unsigned drivers available (32 bit).

...

The surprising disclosure was made by Senior Program Manager Steve Riley during a presentation on Windows Vista security at Tech.Ed 2006 Sydney today.

“Any next-generation high definition content will not play in x32 at all,” said Riley.

“This is a decision that the Media Player folks made because there are just too many ways right now for unsigned kernel mode code [to compromise content protection]. The media companies asked us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition content to play in x32 at all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode can get around content protection, so we had to do this,” he said.

Now not only will you need fully HDCP compatible hardware, but now you'll also need a 64-bit processor to watch HD DVD or BR content on your computer... it can only contribute to sinking the new formats...

[waheed]

Wll, it wasn't entirely Microsofts decision, though I still blame them for listening to movie studios:

The media companies asked us to do this and said they don’t want any of their high definition content to play in x32 at all, because of all of the unsigned malware that runs in kernel mode can get around content protection, so we had to do this,”

I dont see why an operating system should have any impact of content playback. This should be entirely dependant on software players like PowerDVD, WinDVD etc, not OS.

I can see many people already now boycotting the new formats

Another nail in the coffin

[dphirschler]

Every time they lock another piece down, they close off another group of potential customers. The end result will be no customers... which is what they want, right?


Darryl

[somebodeez]

I don't understand - people can play HD content on their 32 bit PCs now, can't they

[painkiller]

While it might be that we can play/run HD content on our current machines, I interpret this article to mean there won't be any drivers made to allow the use of BlueRay or HD-DVD machines in our pcs.

For the 32 bit OSs.

Windows up to XP.

Meaning if they implement anything at all - it will be in a 64 bit Vista platorm and forwards.
And that's if the content providers don't change their mind. Again.

Besides, if one has the next generation HDTV camcorders - then I would expect you can input/edit/record/offload your video even now using Win2K, XP. The trouble is, there isn't yet a recorder for our PCs.

What a hullabulloo.

(anybody, please correct me if I made any mistakes here.)

What's really being said here - the Hollywood moguls don't want their disks anywhere inside a computer.
Anymore.

[somebodeez]

Thanks, PK
Another question :
If the Hollywood moguls don't want their disks anywhere inside a computer, what kind of effect would this have on Blu Ray or HD burners for computers?

[akrako1]

I'm also wondering about the "WinDVD BD for VAIO" that comes with the BR Vaio PC. This CPU is a "fast 3.2GHz dual-core Pentium D processor 940" - which isn't 64-bit. Maybe this will be the only piece of software for 32-bit machines that will ever play BR (with HDCP?). Someone needs to buy this Vaio PC just to reengineer, crack, and distribute the software for all the 32-bit folks (fortunatley, not for me... AthlonXP 64 3200+ ) )

http://www.mobilewhack.com/reviews/sony_rc204_-_first_vaio_blu-ray_disc_pc.html

[akrako1]

Thanks, PK
Another question :
If the Hollywood moguls don't want their disks anywhere inside a computer, what kind of effect would this have on Blu Ray or HD burners for computers?

They seem to be happy letting us burn home-movies and data to BR/HD DVD's. I've been using DVD-Roms for archiving all my data and mp3's. Once BR becomes cheap, I'd highly consider using it for backup. I also create many home made DVD's to archive various music-related footage I find on-line, convert, and author. It'll be nice to have many DVD-quality hours available on a disc - and with no stupid HDCP bullsh*t, my discs should work just fine with any HDTV.

Who watches DVD's on their computers anyways? I don't, but maybe that's just 'cuz I just have a 19" 4:3 monitor...

[Cornucopia]

Who watches DVD's on their computers anyways?...

More than 1/2 of all current college students use only their computers-for video watching and for music listening. Those who do have a TV usually use it for OTA/Cable reception.

Not everybody, but a large chunk of BUYERS (and FUTURE BUYERS).

This won't sink the format, but it will pigeonhole it into ALSO RAN status.

Weird to think that the people who are "enthusiasts", the people who help drive the engines of commerce, are the very same people whom the studios seem to be most afraid of. Talk about Killing the Golden Goose. So many missed opportunities...


Scott

[akrako1]

Who watches DVD's on their computers anyways?...

More than 1/2 of all current college students use only their computers-for video watching and for music listening. Those who do have a TV usually use it for OTA/Cable reception.

True true.. I've been removed from my college days for long enough they get forgotten... in cramped dorm rooms, I'd imaging you'd want to use your computer monitor for both...

As for killing the golden goose.... it's been dead a few times by now. The early-adopters (like myself) who quickly went out a bought a HDTV without HDCP will be screwed with BR/HD DVD. We'll all have to go and buy new sets. Again, these are exactly the people you WOULDN'T want to piss off - the early adopters that would be the first to buy BR/HD DVD devices...

[TwistedLincoln]

Well I have no desire to ever buy Vista, but this news has other side effects -- when Blu-Ray and HD-DVD drives become inexpensive, more and more people will want them. Since the average computer user doesn't know the difference between a 32bit and 64bit OS, the end result will be people buying these players to upgrade their existing PCs. When they discover that the drives won't play movies on their 32 bit systems, they will return the drives. If this happens often enough, fewer places will carry them (due to the extra labor and lost profit that comes from lots of RMAs). If fewer places carry them, the prices will remain high.

I really have no desire to ever buy either of these formats for watching movies. But I would have an interest in the re-writable formats for archival purposes. If the read-only drives stay expensive due to issues like this, however, the re-writable ones will likey stay expensive as well. As will the media. How unfortunate.

[edDV]

I really have no desire to ever buy either of these formats for watching movies. But I would have an interest in the re-writable formats for archival purposes. If the read-only drives stay expensive due to issues like this, however, the re-writable ones will likey stay expensive as well. As will the media. How unfortunate.

There is a huge opportunity for somebody to launch a separate high density recordable optical format with no DRM requirements. A format for users to save their own encoded DV, MPeg2 and MPeg4 material.

[akrako1]

I really have no desire to ever buy either of these formats for watching movies. But I would have an interest in the re-writable formats for archival purposes. If the read-only drives stay expensive due to issues like this, however, the re-writable ones will likey stay expensive as well. As will the media. How unfortunate.

There is a huge opportunity for somebody to launch a separate high density recordable optical format with no DRM requirements. A format for users to save their own encoded DV, MPeg2 and MPeg4 material.

Maybe Holographic DVD's will fit this niche... 300GB initial size, up to 1.6TB per Disc! Now that's archiving!

http://www.betanews.com/article/Holographic_DVD_to_Hold_16_Terabytes/1133197797

[painkiller]

I do believe that edDV got it right.

We need another 'player' to get into this field to make [equivalent] BD/HD-DVD burners for PCs.

Otherwise, I expect, there won't be any. For PCs.

Right now the high dollar players (NOT burners) on the market for these formats are for your entertainment system - and not for plugging into the PC. (I believe that's right.)

And considering the MPAAs grief over the DVD protections being cracked, I wouldn't be surprised if (as I think it is implied in this article above) they no longer want any burner/recorder for these new formats for a PC. Certainly not without the program flags as implimented for our cable/sat/OTA distributions.

Ever.

Just my paranoia workin' here. But hey, I could be wrong....

You think?

[RabidDog]

I think they are just saying no hidef pre-recorded movie playback under 32 bit OS big burners ok and even readers but no movies on unsigned untrusted OS platforms especially not you godlam linux hippy freaks!

[mlofaso]

There's a thread at AVSForum where a Microsoft VP says the story was misreported. He tells us to remain calm, there's nothing to see here

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8281327

Mark
www.TheHTPCRecord.com

[oldandinthe way]

It is arguable that anyone other than a congenital early-adopter would upgrade to Vista.

It is similarly arguable for blueray or HD-dvd upgrades.

PC sales forecasts are disappointing, and new machines are the most-likely source of Vista users.

Short Microsoft, PC makers, SONY, Toshiba and anyone else who is dependant on these new products for their success. Bad news will precede good news on all of these fronts.

[BJ_M]

Check your PC for Blu-ray & HD DVD compatibility

the straight facts on what you will need

http://www.cyberlink.com/english/support/bdhd_support/diagnosis.jsp

[edDV]

Can any current PC pass that test?

Maybe I should "check again".

[BJ_M]

Can any current PC pass that test?

Maybe I should "check again".

yes -- except for the right version of powerdvd ... plus pretty rare to have BOTH a hdcp card AND monitor

OS and the rest are pretty common

[akrako1]

According to Cyberlink's site: http://www.cyberlink.com/english/support/bdhd_support/system_requirement.jsp
you'll need:

CPU

Intel Pentium EE 840 (3.2 GHz)
Intel Pentium EE 955 (3.4 GHz)
Intel Pentium D 9xx series 945 (3.4 GHz), 950 (3.4 GHz), 960 (3.6 GHz)
Intel Core Duo T2xxx series T2500 (2 GHz), T2600 (2.16 GHz), T2700 (2.33 GHz)
Intel Core 2 Duo E6xxx series E6300 (1.8 GHz), E6400 (2.13 GHz), E6600 (2.4 GHz), E6700 (2.66 GHz), E6800 (2.93 GHz)

AMD Athlon 64 FX series FX-60 (2.6 GHz), FX-62 (2.8 GHz)
AMD Athlon 64 X2 series 4200+ (2.2 GHz), 4400+ (2.2 GHz), 4600+ (2.4 GHz), 4800+ (2.4 GHz), 5000+ (2.6 GHz)
AMD Turion 64 X2 TL-60 (2 GHz)

System Memory (RAM)

512 MB or above, 1 GB is recommended
Disc Drive

Blu-ray Disc drive or HD DVD drive
Graphics Card

NVidia
GeForce

6600 GT
7600 GT
7800 GTX 512
7900 GX2
7900 GTX
7950 GX2

ATi
X1600 series
X1800 series
X1900 series


Video RAM

256 MB graphics card memory or above
Display Devices

* HDCP (High-Bandwidth Digital Content Protection) compliant display (DVI, HDMI connections) for digital output
* TV (composite, componet, S-Video) or computer monitor (VGA) for analog output

Operating System

Supports only Windows XP with Service Pack 2 installed
Software

PowerDVD HD DVD or BD version. Note: An easy way to determine whether your version of PowerDVD supports Blu-ray Disc or HD DVD is to look for the Blu-ray Disc or HD DVD logo on the main screen of PowerDVD. If you don’t see either of those logos, it is likely your version of PowerDVD doesn’t support Blu-ray Disc and HD DVD title playback.

I run XP x64 edition 2003 version w/ SP1 - and their utility says I fail. I again read the title of my thread, and say WTF?

[BJ_M]

MS doesnt seem to be really supporting XP x64 in a major way , IMO

[tfcmaximus]

Jeez I am glad I caught this when I did, THIS WHOLE POST IS NOT TRUE, the Microsoft employee that revealed this information was simply wrong, he was not well informed enough to know that HD will be supported in 32-bit versions of Windows Vista.

I read an article similar to this one at www.wbeta.com and then just 24hrs later, someone higher up issued the statement that it was untrue, if you can find it at wbeta.com feel free to post it here, as it will prove that all of this is just not true, don't worry guys when Vista comes HD will be supported in one fashion or another, just chill, I promise.

[DereX888]

Aside from this news being true r not...
What is REALLY needed to play HD/BR on a PC?

1 device drivers
2 software player

so, whats the problem?
Very quick there will be asome upstart company (anyone remember Lite-On?) who will provide both the device (hd/br drive) and working drivers for 32 bit Windows (just "unsigned' by microcrap company).
Who are the 'studios' or 'microshit' to stop me or anyone else from designing, making and marketing a blueray or hd-dvd compatible drive and working drivers for it? ROTFL! Think, people, before just sounding any false alarms.

The player (software player for 32bit windoze) might be a trickier part, as I imagine any writer will need to talk to hd-dvd/br-dvd copyright/patent owners, and I bet i.e. sony will never allow it since this company is more into making crappy movies than solid electronics anymore, but... there are always those damn students who got nothing to loose (literally) and lots of talent in their brains same as it was with DVD's CSS...

[waheed]

Thanks for the link BJ_M

But I beleive that tool is pretty useless. Its says my processor is not HD ready (red dot), yet I can play 1080P sample clips quite smoothly on my PC. Its says my Graphics Card is HD Ready (green dot) yet no card on the market supports HDCP yet.

[DereX888]

/repeated sys reqs by mistake, sorry/

[SatStorm]

3rd party software gonna appear, capable to playback commercial BluRay/HDDVD content, soon or later. Even for older OS' like Win2K and WinXP . There is a market for this.

[BJ_M]

the question is -- is there a market for bluray and HDDVD ?

[SatStorm]

Those grabbing satellite HDTV channels in Europe. A small market for now, but it is a start. Those need those discs....

[waheed]

But HDTV channels in Europe are not subject to ridiculous copy protection schemes as is the case for HD-DVD and Blu Ray. Theres no requirement for a HDMI port or any of the HDCP crap with watching HDTV channels.