Pio DVR220s closeouts priced at $100 at WalMart!

[garyjo]

Could not believe WalMart dropped the price to $100 on remaining Pio 220s!

I thought I had purchased all remaining stock at local B&M, only to find 2 more available a month later. One, made in Japan; and the other, made in China. YMMV.

WalMart price protected me.
I received a $40 price adjustment (per unit) on several Pio 220s purchased recently.

[handyguy]

Easy. Pioneer is no longer making dvd recorders.

[ROF]

Most manufacturers are going to stop production either now or in the near future. There are probably warehouses full of this technology so it's not likely they will simply dry up they will just become harder to find. DVD is being phased out by newer products with greater storage capacity. Good news to the consumer of yesterday tech though as the prices will drop drop drop for this old stuff.

[oldandinthe way]

DVD recorders have not been a successful market segment. Sales have never met VCR levels. With cable and satellite providers offering PVR capability the demand is low.

Many of the folks who are offering DVRs, will not offer HD-DVD or Blu-Ray recorders, when they phase out the current generation of product, they will leave this market segment.

All that will remain are commodity vendors assembling from standard chipsets and drives. Expect more relabeled low cost product if any residual demand exists.

The new technology will not drop in cost as quickly as ROF suggests because of confuson as to the right product, lack of volume, and patent licensing issues and fees.

[ROF]

The new technology will not drop in cost as quickly as ROF suggests because of confuson as to the right product, lack of volume, and patent licensing issues and fees.

I meant the old technology(DVD Recorders) prices will drop drop drop. Sorry about the confusion.

[Frobozz]

A Pioneer DVR-220 is an excellent machine that was discontinued by Pioneer in June 2005 when the stripped-down 233 came out. Anyone who finds a new one for $100 is getting a great buy.

[Wile_E]

Maybe people are getting wiser? There are several strikes against all these new electronics. Who wants to buy a DVD Recorder when it includes copy protection flag? I would be pissed, if I tried to record my favorite show for time-shifting, and the recorder wouldn't allow it.

Also the build quality has gone down the hill for all audio/video components. Who wants to buy a crappy and flimsy looking component? Over the past several years, I've overheard some people in the retail stores, complaining about how everything is poorly manufactured. Every year it seems the build quality gets cheaper. I remember in the 80's and early 90's, things were built much better. You could get a nice audio receiver for $300. Hell, even Radio Shack stuff made back then, beats the cheap crap of today. I still have my Realistic Mach II Speakers that sound better than a lot of so-called high-end speakers of today.

[samijubal]

The majority of people in the U.S. want stuff as cheap as they can get it, regardless of quality. Manufacterers just give the people what they want. If there were more people willing to pay for quality products, there would be better quality stuff.

[MeekloBraca]

Does the Pioneer have 3 hour mode/FR Mode?

[ROF]

Maybe people are getting wiser? There are several strikes against all these new electronics. Who wants to buy a DVD Recorder when it includes copy protection flag? I would be pissed, if I tried to record my favorite show for time-shifting, and the recorder wouldn't allow it.

Most people are uneffected by this. My DVD Recorder will record any station the cable company allows me to. These flags are in the broadcast signal, not inside the recorder. The recorder is just setup to receive the flags and prevent the signal from being recorded. Since I do not own the broadcast it is their right to prevent me from recording. Sure it stinks but something has to be done to prevent mass archival of TV that is now being sold individually on the internet or as whole season worth of episodes on hard copy media.

lso the build quality has gone down the hill for all audio/video components. Who wants to buy a crappy and flimsy looking component? Over the past several years, I've overheard some people in the retail stores, complaining about how everything is poorly manufactured. Every year it seems the build quality gets cheaper. I remember in the 80's and early 90's, things were built much better. You could get a nice audio receiver for $300. Hell, even Radio Shack stuff made back then, beats the cheap crap of today.

I can't agree more. The quality of a product decreases the longer it is on the market. Not surprisingly the quality of the product and the amount of sturdy material used decreases with the price reduction. If you notice there are people who are complaining on here about the price of $1000 Blu-ray players or $1000 Blu-ray Drive Burners. Anyone here bought one? I have now bought and installed 3 burners and I can tell you that just from the weight alone these burners were built to last. They easily weigh twice what current DVD Burners weigh. The weight comes from the solid construction not from added materials. Anyone remember when VCR were made of mostly metal and had few plastic parts? Even the gears inside were metal at one time. Now when you open a case on a VCR everything inside is plastic. Cheap Cheap Cheap. That is what the typical consumer is so that is what the typical manufacturer provides.

[Frobozz]

Does the Pioneer have 3 hour mode/FR Mode?

The Pioneer DVR-220 has 32 FR modes from 1 hour to 6 hours per disc. After 2:20 the resolution changes from 720X480 to 360X480 and then drops to lower resolutions for the much longer recording to disc. The 3-hour mode is 360x480 and looks pretty good.

The DVR-233 does not have the 32 FR modes. I believe it only has 4 modes with the longest one at 10 hours per disc. Its build quality also is very poor compared with the 220. I mention this because Walmart sold the 233 as well and I wouldn't want you to get one of those thinking it would be the same as a 220.

[MeekloBraca]

Is this Pioneer worth getting?

[pixel zombie]

i have one and it works great...what i'd like to know is whether the dvd's from costco(TDK-16x-dvd-r) will work with the 220...

[MeekloBraca]

How is this DVD Recorder for artifacting at the 3 hour mark?

[Frobozz]

How is this DVD Recorder for artifacting at the 3 hour mark?

It depends on how big a TV screen you're watching it on. The resolution at the 3-hour mode is 360x480 in order to keep the bit rate high and minimize artifacting. The 720 x 480 resolution extends to the 2 hour 20 minute mode. Overall I find the 3 hour mode from this generation of Pioneer recorders to be very acceptable when displayed on my 32" digital TV.

[lordsmurf]

Since I do not own the broadcast it is their right to prevent me from recording.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_shifting
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_v._Universal

The legality of time-shifting programming in the United States was proven by a landmark court case of Universal Studios versus Sony Corporation (Sony v. Universal), when Sony argued successfully that the advent of its Betamax video recorder in 1976 did not violate the copyright of the owners of shows which it recorded.

[lordsmurf]

DVD recorders have not been a successful market segment. Sales have never met VCR levels.

I disagree.
Also, you cannot compare 2-3 years of DVD recorder sales to 20-30 years of VCR sales.

Most manufacturers are going to stop production either now or in the near future. .....DVD is being phased out by newer products with greater storage capacity.

Totally disagree.
Those "new products" offer only marginal advances in storage, quality and features.

[davideck]

DVD recorders have not been a successful market segment. Sales have never met VCR levels.

I disagree.
Also, you cannot compare 2-3 years of DVD recorder sales to 20-30 years of VCR sales.

VCRs were dependable. Even so, people had trouble setting the clock. The introduction of the DVD Recorder as a reliable and easy to use replacement for the VCR has not gone well. Sales might have been better if...

Most manufacturers are going to stop production either now or in the near future. .....DVD is being phased out by newer products with greater storage capacity.

Totally disagree.
Those "new products" offer only marginal advances in storage, quality and features.

IMO, the shift to HDTV is also helping to dry up the demand for DVD Recorders, particularly the hard drive units. I want my next "DVD Recorder" to be HDTV capable.

[Frobozz]

IMO, the shift to HDTV is also helping to dry up the demand for DVD Recorders, particularly the hard drive units. I want my next "DVD Recorder" to be HDTV capable.

That's one of many reasons. The popularity of the satellite and cable PVRs made recording the DVD or VHS less important because most people only want to time shift, not keep old TV shows. DVD recorders also were very expensive and the cheap ones were (are?) unreliable.

The inability by many users to get anamorphic widescreen 480i output from cable boxes also makes owning a DVD recorder disappointing. My Pioneer recorder recognizes widescreen sources but my Motorola cable box won't deliver them. Why would I want to keep DVD's of letterboxed shows when my real desire is for true 16:9 recordings? Fix that defect in the Motorola boxes (or replace it with one that does offer this option) and I won't care that it isn't HDTV for some time to come.

[MeekloBraca]

This machine is A++

[jonnymorris]

IMO, the shift to HDTV is also helping to dry up the demand for DVD Recorders, particularly the hard drive units. I want my next "DVD Recorder" to be HDTV capable.

Panasonic have a new range which are all HDTV capable, with HDTV sockets etc. I assume other manufacturers will soon follow suit if they haven't done so already.

[jonnymorris]

If you notice there are people who are complaining on here about the price of $1000 Blu-ray players or $1000 Blu-ray Drive Burners. Anyone here bought one? I have now bought and installed 3 burners and I can tell you that just from the weight alone these burners were built to last.

While not quite rich enough to afford one of those, I would certainly buy one at a reduced price if it was end-of-line or ex-display. Any idea when Blu-ray (or whatever) will come to the consumer DVD recorder market? I'm sure I've seen it somewhere, but I forget - any idea how long one might expect to get out of one Blu-ray DVD-RAM type of disc at good quality?

I have seriously thought about getting a DVD recorder to replace my broken Panasonic VHS recorder, but right now I'm thinking that I should hold on with VHS a while longer (buy a replacement VHS recorder) to see how the DVD technology develops (i.e. Blu-ray). As things are I just don't think I can get the equivalent of a VHS recorder (in terms of versatility) in a DVD recorder.

I certainly don't expect the DVD recorder technology to die out, though trends are shifting so nobody can really say for certain which way things will go; I feel there will always be a demand for consumer TV recorders in some form though.

[davideck]

IMO, the shift to HDTV is also helping to dry up the demand for DVD Recorders, particularly the hard drive units. I want my next "DVD Recorder" to be HDTV capable.

Panasonic have a new range which are all HDTV capable, with HDTV sockets etc. I assume other manufacturers will soon follow suit if they haven't done so already.

By "HDTV capable", I am asking for an ATSC/QAM tuner and the ability to record HD formats. 30 minutes of HDTV on a 4.7GB DVD, or 60 minutes on a DL DVD sounds like a nifty new format to me...
Add a hard drive into the mix and I am ready to buy today!

[jonnymorris]

IMO, the shift to HDTV is also helping to dry up the demand for DVD Recorders, particularly the hard drive units. I want my next "DVD Recorder" to be HDTV capable.

Panasonic have a new range which are all HDTV capable, with HDTV sockets etc. I assume other manufacturers will soon follow suit if they haven't done so already.

By "HDTV capable", I am asking for an ATSC/QAM tuner and the ability to record HD formats. 30 minutes of HDTV on a 4.7GB DVD, or 60 minutes on a DL DVD sounds like a nifty new format to me...
Add a hard drive into the mix and I am ready to buy today!

Having looked into it and had a think, I don't think I will buy any of the DVD-R recorders (even DL), they simply don't offer enough high quality recording time on one disc to make the upgrade from VHS worth the money. I will wait.

[TwistedLincoln]

I have never had any interest in any DVD recorder that doesn't have a hard drive built in. Why? Mostly because the ones with DVR functions aren't that much more expensive anymore, and they give me the DVD recording ability as well...

As for the broadcast flag, I haven't encountered it, but I am completely against the idea. Time shifting has been around for many, many years. Sure, there were those that sold bootleg VHS tapes on the street. But for most of us, we used our VCRs to catch programs we would otherwise never see. Using broadcast flags to keep me from doing this is totally stupid-- on pay channels like HBO, I would simply cancel my subscription. And on free channels, they've missed their opportunity to show me ads -- I can't watch the commercials if my DVR won't record them...

Back to the topic at hand: I've never cared much for Panasonic DVD Recorders, despite the fact that I very much like Panasonic as a company. I just don't see the need to record to DVD-RAM...and with most of their standalone recorders, that's the only re-writable format you can use. When I do use the DVD Recorder in my DVR, I always use DVD+RWs or DVD-RWs, so I can re-use the disc in the same way I would a VHS tape...

[davideck]

DVD-RAM provides timeslip capability on units without a hard drive. But then what to do if you want to save the program?

For daily viewing, a hard drive is a must IMO. 40+ hours of quality recording is infinitely better than 1 or 2.

[humbled]

DVD-RAM provides timeslip capability on units without a hard drive. But then what to do if you want to save the program?

For daily viewing, a hard drive is a must IMO. 40+ hours of quality recording is infinitely better than 1 or 2.

Are you saying that I can avoid the broadcast flag problem if I am willing to buy enough DVD-RAM disks? (and limit playback to the machine that records to that format). I have Verizon FIOS, stunning quality but everything seems to be flagged even at S-Video quality (at least I cannot get my Polaroid DRM2001G to handle any of it).