Warez naming standards?

[Supreme2k]

From this post:
https://forum.videohelp.com/viewtopic.php?p=1538627#1538627

https://forum.videohelp.com/viewtopic.php?p=1504601#1504601

My Downloads\Bubba Ho Tep DVDrip ???

Warez.

Available to buy on DVD here:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0001LQJMQ/002-8600724-7922438?v=glance&n=130


possibly but not enough evidence. Naming does not match warez convention.
Thanks / offline

Why does warez have to match a specific naming convention? I know that some of the mods want to give the benefit of the doubt, but this particular case (among others) seems quite excessive.

The person in question has a downloaded dvd rip of a commercially available film. Is it not warez simply because it's not from a well-known warez group?

My narc days are long over, but it seems like VH now has a much more lenient stance on warez, while trivial issues (NWS, swearing, off-topic behavior) have become felonies.

There are MANY more places to get help with warez (video, games, drm) than there are places like VH. These warez posters need to be sent packing so that the message against it is clear, rather than a "You may or may not be talking about warez (where the question is about an avi of the latest film), so PM me and I will unlock this thread"

or maybe I'm wrong. There's probably thousands of sites where one can legally download dvd rips.

[lordsmurf]

You're not alone s2k. Same thoughts here.

[Noahtuck]

Yeah, that is kinda strange....
Espc. when i saw a thread locked the other day & a formal warning issued for wanting to know how to get around the DRM of some files downloaded that were PAID for when i have seen many many other threads about defeating DRM with no problems, the mod did not seem to certain either as he stated he had to consult other mods
In doubt, lock it, in doubt, don't lock it...
Which way did he go......

[smearbrick1]

Yes, God forbid we have any questionable material in OT.

Does this violate rules concerning religion since I included the word "God"?

[ROF]

Yes, God forbid we have any questionable material in OT.

Does this violate rules concerning religion since I included the word "God"?

Yes. specifically a violation of theocratic copyright.

[smitbret]

If anyone has any doubts about which way this forum should go, take a trip to the forums on Doom9 and ask yourself if you want your forum moderated into the same barren wasteland.
-Brett

[Cobra]

I always try to call those issues I have to deal with as fairly as I can, but in the future I will bear your concerns in mind, Supreme2k. Thanks for letting us know about your concerns!

It is extremely difficult sometimes to be consistent, which is why a mod will often have to take every case on an individual basis and try to make it fair at that particular time. We'll see what we can do, though. I'll create a thread in the mod forum about it.

Thanks again,

Cobra

[Supreme2k]

Thanks for the response

What I was trying to say is that VH is a one-of-a-kind place. Let the warez kids go to those dime-a-dozen, bajillion porn pop-ups places (yeah, I've been there ).

As far as doom9 goes, that is a good example of VH's uniqueness.
On the other hand, I don't mind a little heavy handedness when it comes to (even potential) warez.

I posted (somewhat of) a rant a while back that became a sticky for a little while. It was basically a common sense when posting guideline. I know that VH will never get rid of warez posts, but I wish these "Free Movies!" people could be the tiniest bit smarter when asking for help on obvious illegal activities.
Do we need to know that you downloaded from bittorrent? No.
Do we need to know the name of the file? No.
Do we need to know for what purpose you will be ripping/converting/burning the disc (I'm making a copy for my cousin; It's so my neighbor can "borrow" it, but he'll destroy it right after watching it.)? No.
Does the warez site where you obtained your cam "rip" from have a FAQ? Yes.

After hearing "Wear Sunscreen" by Baz Luhrman for the umpteenth time this month, I'm tempted to write a parody dealing with how to post about your sources correctly.

Yeah, I know it's pretty hard to make those judgement calls, and I'd hate to see a "Zero-Tolerance" code enforced here, but some of these guys are just asking for it.

[jimmalenko]

Let's be honest here:

Cobra, your "method" of locking a dubious thread until proven otherwise is the best way to go here IMHO. Surely it's not rocket-science to figure out that a lot of P2P programs use "My Downloads" as the default folder. Also, how many people here can honestly say that when they do their own DVD to AVI conversion, they put DVDRip in the filename ?

The other thing that perplexed me was this: The OP says " ... I have a dvd compliant mpeg video file ... ". So in the context of the original question, it means that they originally had a NTSC DVD, supposedly converted it to AVI themselves, converted the audio to mp3 in the process, included DVDRip in the filename and saved it into their My Downloads directory, with the end goal to convert back to PAL DVD. Seems to be going the very long way about things for a NTSC DVD -> PAL DVD conversion, no ?

Offline's "excuse" that it doesn't follow a naming convention is a crock of shit IMHO. Not to get too far off the track but this, as well as the shenanigans in the world cup thread (the inconsistency between mods) really makes it tough to keep faith in the system.


Oh well ....

I know what I should do if I don't like it ...

[kitty]

I used to be a moderator - I locked any thread that had words ending in "z".

[Supreme2k]

What if someone was looking for a good place to buy Pez?

How about if they wanted to add more pizazz to their project? ("I'm faaabulous!")

A dyslexic person wondering what is your favorite ooz animal?

[steveryan]

To be fair to the original (original) poster, I often capture a VHS tape then re-name the file, say for instance it was Neighbours 23/11/2001, I re-name it SUPERMAN.TS.NOBHEADGROUP, it's much easier for me.

[Cobra]

Let's be honest here:

Cobra, your "method" of locking a dubious thread until proven otherwise is the best way to go here IMHO.

I actually saw tgpo doing that first, and thought that it was a really good way of doing things, so I copied him.

Offline's "excuse" that it doesn't follow a naming convention is a crock of shit IMHO. Not to get too far off the track but this, as well as the shenanigans in the world cup thread (the inconsistency between mods) really makes it tough to keep faith in the system.

Sometimes it's very difficult to keep consistency over such a vast range of posts. Every mod here does what they can, and as long as general decency is maintained there shouldn't be a problem. It's not really that important if there are minor differences between mods, and if it does have a significant impact for a user then it can be sorted out if the user lets us know. I'd rather that happened, because I can then learn and adapt to better help everyone here.

Even then, mods can make mistakes from time to time. We're only human!

[Nelson37]

I had no idea that just by looking at the name of a file, it can be determined with absolute certainty what the content of the file is. Must be something new.

If having a file with a name which appears to indicate that the source just might be questionable is against forum rules, so be it.

However I strongly object to the blanket statement that someone has performed a criminal act with the only "proof" being the name of a file.

Having legally copied a copyrighted disk, I previously outlined that scenario simply as proof that the act of copying a copyrighted disk is not necessarily illegal. I had both verbal and written permission to do so and was still told by several here that I had broken the law. They were wrong, and the accusations were false.

The mods of this forum have the power to determine that such discussion is against forum rules and prohibit it. Neither they nor anyone else has the right to act as judge and jury and determine that a criminal act has taken place.

A while back someone was flamed for making a Divx movie, and breaking it up into several RAR files, to email to someone else. The statement made was "no one does this for their home skateboarding movie". A few days previous to reading this, I had helped a client do just exactly that, though their home video was not of skateboarding.

Stating "we do not want that here and it will not be allowed" is perfectly acceptable and well within the mods perogative. Stating "you are a criminal" is not.

[Supreme2k]

I had no idea that just by looking at the name of a file, it can be determined with absolute certainty what the content of the file is. Must be something new.

Actually, it's been around for a while. Quite simple, really.

If having a file with a name which appears to indicate that the source just might be questionable is against forum rules, so be it.

However I strongly object to the blanket statement that someone has performed a criminal act with the only "proof" being the name of a file.

Where does "criminal act" ever enter into the discussion? Even if someone posts something to that extent, this is a message board, not a court of law. They can do what they want to enforce the rules of this board (including getting help from its members).

Having legally copied a copyrighted disk, I previously outlined that scenario simply as proof that the act of copying a copyrighted disk is not necessarily illegal. I had both verbal and written permission to do so and was still told by several here that I had broken the law. They were wrong, and the accusations were false.

Only after severely baiting for many posts. You gave information that indicated illegal activity (which was unneeded), and very slowly revealed the whole situation after people came to a logical conclusion.

The mods of this forum have the power to determine that such discussion is against forum rules and prohibit it. Neither they nor anyone else has the right to act as judge and jury and determine that a criminal act has taken place.

Again, they are just trying to enforce their rules and look after this particular site. You seem to suffer from a persecution complex.

A while back someone was flamed for making a Divx movie, and breaking it up into several RAR files, to email to someone else. The statement made was "no one does this for their home skateboarding movie". A few days previous to reading this, I had helped a client do just exactly that, though their home video was not of skateboarding.

That was a while back, and I was in the thick of it. That person was full of crap. They didn't know how to unrar the movie that they (or someone they know) supposedly rar'ed, nor could they figure out how to convert or play it. If they did all of this themselves, why ask people for help who are completely out of the loop? I think that your story is equally as full of crap, and meant only to garner sympathy. What kind of backwards thinking is that? Is your client in a fledgling warez group? Could you not have burnt them a 30 cent DVD or elightened them to the beauty of the post office?

Stating "we do not want that here and it will not be allowed" is perfectly acceptable and well within the mods perogative. Stating "you are a criminal" is not.

Why is it not? It simply boils down to opinion, based on what is given.
I've (correctly) called a few people alcoholics, even though the drinks that they purchase are legal and they are over 21.

[Nelson37]

Really? I have a file called "ErnestBorgnineNude.jpg". Wanna bet $100.00 whats in it?

It is not a complex, I have in fact been unjustly persecuted. Makes you a little bit alert to what is reasonable evidence and what is simply jumping to conclusions.

The "logical conclusion" everybody leapt to was in fact wrong, and based on not enough information. That was the point of the excercise. You said it yourself, "indication of illegal activity". The action was perfectly legal, the accusation was wrong. There was no criminal act whatsoever. Purchaser of the product is in effect granted a limited, "in-house" copyright.

The clients video in question was something involving his children, he had already Divx'ed it and the size was too large for an email inclusion. DVD was not practical at that time, and email was what he wanted to do and paid me to make happen. It was also the most reasonable alternative at the time.

Whether you or anyone else believes this or not, I could care less. I believe the mods on this site have the right and duty to enforce site rules as they see fit, and have said so repeatedly. I also believe that on several occassions people who have done, or may have done, completely legitimate acts have been unfairly flamed and accused of being a criminal with very little real information. The word "lynching" comes to mind, and the mentality is not far off.

[Supreme2k]

For the sake of n00bs, I found the "friend's skating vid" thread.

Ah, memories. I've become such a quiet, old man since then

Here is the type of bait-logic that Nelson employs. Check out the whole thread. Pretty entertaining read.

More Nelson37 goodness.

[G)-(OST]

For the sake of n00bs, I found the "friend's skating vid" thread.

Ah, memories. I've become such a quiet, old man since then

Here is the type of bait-logic that Nelson employs. Check out the whole thread. Pretty entertaining read.

More Nelson37 goodness.

You & Jimboh must feel you are the saviours of VideoHelp. Non of the mods are woffling on like you, but have more reason to. It seams they don't really want to make this kind of thing stand out this much, but your insistant ruling makes you look like a goose. To know so much, you must be guilty your self!!!

[BJ_M]

"ErnestBorgnineNude.jpg" - hmmm, don't post that please

[jimmalenko]

"ErnestBorgnineNude.jpg" - hmmm, don't post that please

Oh c'mon ... surely you're just a little curious ?

[BJ_M]

let me think .....






nope !

[Supreme2k]

To know so much, you must be guilty your self!!!

I've actually stated a few times on this board that I used to be active in the warez scene (back when they were on floppies), but have since learned the error of my ways (though I still know people who use).

Besides, warez is utter shit these days. Crippled games and apps, horrid cam vids with aspect ratios from Neptune, etc.

[G)-(OST]

To know so much, you must be guilty your self!!!

I've actually stated a few times on this board that I used to be active in the warez scene (back when they were on floppies), but have since learned the error of my ways (though I still know people who use).

Besides, warez is utter shit these days. Crippled games and apps, horrid cam vids with aspect ratios from Neptune, etc.

Have you ever been sentenced??? No??? Well IMHO, YOUR a crim...........

[Supreme2k]

your != you are

Why don't you take your own advice and stay out of a thread that is just going to upset you.

[offline]

Offline's "excuse" that it doesn't follow a naming convention is a crock of shit IMHO.

Really? People often rip DVD films and save as the filmname followed by "DVD_RIP".
I do too. I was just giving the user the benefit of the doubt. A filename like "This.Film.2006.DVDSCR.XviD.avi" is so obviously warez. it could be used by authorities to issue legal threats against VH. No authority is going to issue a legal letter of demand over "DVD_RIP" as it is too ambiguous.

People forget that I was THE ONE who started the anti-warez campaign at VH. Before my chats with Stefan and some of the Mods who are no longer with us, warez was not prohibited at VH. I just saw the crap the warez crowd were filling up some forums with, and after a chat to a copyright lawyer (a friend) decided that not only would VH be taken over by the 1337 crowd, it could also cause legal issues if authorities began to react.

Not to get too far off the track but this, as well as the shenanigans in the world cup thread (the inconsistency between mods) really makes it tough to keep faith in the system.

Please Every single Mod has asked you in different ways not to disrupt that thread. If everyone followed the letter of the law all the time VH would be as fun a place to hang out as Doom9.org. It was a poll thread on the World Cup for goodness sakes! With all due respect, lighten up.

If my decision is viewed as wrong by some, it won't be the first or the last. Many decisions made are done so on a borderline basis. People will always agree and disagree. Some days I get thank you PM's, most days I just get complaints. Most of the complaints are trivial, but I try and deal respectfully with each and every one.

Here is a quote from the post I made in the Mod Forum to Cobra about this thread:

Adam was also right when he said we were cyber cleaners. If we miss a spot. it is no big deal in the real world.

'Nuff said

[jimmalenko]

I can see it's a lost cause

[offline]

I can see it's a lost cause

Nothings lost. I'm taking S2K's feedback on board. While I'm not changing my ruling on the post in question, S2K's remarks made sense. I don't wish to give the impression that there is any leniency towards warez; but it seems that opinion says otherwise. That can be fixed I think. I also think his observation that there is a "much more lenient stance on warez, while trivial issues (NWS, swearing, off-topic behavior) have become felonies." has merit too. That perception can be worked on as well.

As far as your observation that "the shenanigans in the world cup thread (the inconsistency between mods) really makes it tough to keep faith in the system" ...well I disagree to a point on that one. I've always tended to allow for a little leeway in special circumstances and for the off topic forum.

If you so much as question the ruling of a mod at Doom9 you are likely to be out on your ass. Here at VH, constructive feedback (even the odd rant) is welcomed. That is part of what makes VH great.

[Supreme2k]

Why does doom9 keep getting brought up?

We know it's bad over there. That's why we're here.

It's like some of these guys that I deal with in my job(s). They take the "If you don't like it, see how they treat you in Vee-Eht-Nam" or such other rubbish. Yes, I know elsewhere it's worse, but sometimes it's best to rest on your own merits, rather than merely trying to seem okay by comparison to something bad.
"I know that you don't like the pasta that I'm serving tonight, but have ever eaten a turd sandwich? Wooo, not good."

Also, doom9 is probably the extreme. There are many shades of grey before you hit that mark. There are also boards that are less strict to the point of no rules and complete chaos (those that haven't been shut down), so again, VH has enough positive to rest on its own merits.

[Cobra]

I can see it's a lost cause

What would you like to see changed or introduced? Nobody has stopped listening to you.

Remember that perfect consistency across the whole mod team here with varied circumstances in each case is nearly impossible. That is why we must be flexible. If you can suggest a way that we can increase consistency whilst maintaining fairness, we will consider (or rather, jump at) it. It would certainly make our jobs easier and less time-consuming.

[jimmalenko]

I can see it's a lost cause

What would you like to see changed or introduced? Nobody has stopped listening to you.

It's fine, really

I've had the opportunity to well and truly put my 2c in and have had all the issues I raised dealt with satisfactorily more or less. Whilst I still maintain that the post in question was probably warez, there's no real point or achievement in continually arguing about it - the end result does not justify the effort involved IMHO.

I've voiced my disagreement, and it's been given a fair hearing, so now we move on.

Remember that perfect consistency across the whole mod team here with varied circumstances in each case is nearly impossible. That is why we must be flexible. If you can suggest a way that we can increase consistency whilst maintaining fairness, we will consider (or rather, jump at) it. It would certainly make our jobs easier and less time-consuming.

Well, you guys are only human and not bots, after all