VCR fast forward causes tape jams - why?

[anitract]

Well, not exactly sure whether this is off-topic, or general, but it _is_ video-related. Anyway, a couple of months ago I purchased a used JVC HR-S9500U vcr. It was actually through a member on the boards here and had (supposively) low usage. I really haven't used it much since I bought it, but it played the few tapes I threw in it fine (I love the picture quality), and rewound them without issue.

Yesterday, however, I had the need to fast forward through a large portion of a tape for the first time. So I hit stop and then the fast forward button. Within about 10 seconds of doing this the machine suddenly stops and ejects my tape. When I pulled the tape out, the actual tape (ribbon) was caught in the machine (looped around something inside - I am assuming the mechanism that feeds the tape). Now my tape has some nice wrinkles in a 6 inch section.

Suffice to say, I was a little ticked. I decided to repeat the test (with a different tape I did not care about) in case it was just "one of those things". Well, it did it again - pretty much exactly the same way. Now, please note that I have not tested my rewinding or playing functionality much since this happened, so I'm not sure they still work.....BUT let's assume that they do, until I can test more.

Here's where I need your input: what might cause just fast forward to not work? Is it common? And is it fixable?

[redwudz]

The FF is probably working fine. What the problem likely is is the 'brake' isn't working properly. The device that controls the tape tension when FF'ing may be slipping. If you feel adventurous, you could open up the unit. The side the tape is feeding from should have some drag on it to keep the tension on the tape.

Some machines have a lever with a pad that drags against part of the spindle that the tape is feeding from. Try cleaning that pad with isopropyl alcohol. It may have a weak spring also, but that is more difficult to repair. There are probably electronic systems for tape tension also, but most of the VCRs I've seen have the 'brake' type of tensioner. Bad news is the tensioner may be on the bottom side of the spindle and a little hard to get to.

This might be a 'shop' repair if you don't feel confident working on the 'internals'. In that case, have them do a general cleaning and adjustment while they are at it.

[anitract]

Are you saying that this is nothing to get an ulcer over? ^_^

So do VCRs have different breaks or other mechanisms for rewind and fast forward? It just seems odd that one would work, and not the other!

[anitract]

Can anyone recommend any quality places for repairs? It'd be great if they had a web-site.

I live in a small city, and not so sure of the 2 repair sites mentioned in my yellow pages...JVC, I've had bad experience with.

[mikel]

If you would like to see (or work on) what is under the coverplate of VCRs

This is a great site...

http://www.fixer.com/osm/parts.html

They also have an on-line vcr repair manual

Mikel

[anitract]

I don't think I'm comfortable enough to do this myself. I like the idea, but...naw, not for me. So, the question is, who do I send it to?

[redwudz]

I really can't think of a specific company that would do cleaning or repairs in your area. Sometimes the Sears stores have access to repair companies, but it might take a while. Or you can go to the JVC site and see if they have a list of recommended repair facilities.

It is a problem if the machine eats a tape.

Every VCR is different, but they all have some mechanism to maintain tape tension during playing, fast forward and rewind. The friction brake is fairly common, but some may have an electronic system for this. It's usually a felt covered band on the underside of the spindles that drives the tape reels. If the band tension is too low or the felt falls off or is glazed, the tension will be too low and the tape can wad up. This usually shows up with FF or RW when not actually playing the tape. There is also a brake to stop the reels when using FF or RW. If it wasn't working the problem would occur when you hit the stop button.

It would probably be a good idea to go to a site like mikel posted to at least see what is involved, even if you don't do the work yourself.

[anitract]

I am looking through that site. There's sure a lot to digest.

Based just on what I witnessed yesterday, I don't think the vcr messes up when I hit the stop button. So maybe it is the tape tension. Perhaps there's enough tension to play the tape ok, but the highspeed stuff is just too much.

I did find a couple of authorized service centers close by, but I am also interested in recommended repair centers (anywhere in the US) that take mail-ins.

[anitract]

I just got off the phone with the JVC authorized repair place closest to me. They charge $75 for most repairs (unless something more exotic). They'll also only charge $35 if you want them to just diagnose/look at the unit, then if you decide to get it repaired, they'll deduct that from the $75. Kind of expensive IMO. Anyone know how this stacks up to other repair centers?

Also, I told him "when I hit ff, my vcr eats my tape". He said, "sounds like an alignment issue".

[lordsmurf]

I would concur with the tech, it sounds like an alignment issue.

If that used 9500 has never had its alignment maintained (that things is at least 10 years old), then that would be typical. Most users forget to keep their stuff in alignment. They start to fall out of alignment after a few years, used or not. Gravity, mechanical settling.

Anytime you buy a used VCR, spending $50-75 to get it aligned and cleaned, unless you know how to do it yourself, is a wise choice. If you can, ask the seller about its repair history, just so you know where it is in its maintenance cycle.

The 'brake' could be issue too, but I doubt it.

[TBoneit]

In my past experience many VCRs will do what you just described if you change modes too quickly.

To decide if it really is a problem use a scrap tape, Fast Forward and hit stop. wait a 10 count to let the tape settle down than FF again. I guess it will be fine. In one way what you describe is a common IMHO defect in the way the VCRs are programmed by setting a delay between mode changes.

[The_Doman]

Very often such tape transport problems are caused by a worn out pinch roller.
These need replacement after long time use.

The same was wrong with my JVC HRS8600 I picked up for free because it was "eating tapes".

Pinch Roller Video

[anitract]

It sounds so tempting to try this myself, but the potential for screwing something up is pretty high. heh

The_Doman, how did you know it was the Pinch Roller for your VCR?

[The_Doman]

The_Doman, how did you know it was the Pinch Roller for your VCR?

Well it was a bit of a guess ofcourse, but I have seen the same problems on a lot of older VCR's i have had.

You can easily recognize a worn out pinch roller because it will look shiny and feel polished.
Cleaning does not help, you need to replace it.
A worn out pinch roller is one of the most common faults in older used VCR's.

http://www.videointerchange.com/tips.htm

Reasons for tapes being "eaten" are varied, but a common cause that warrants discussion, is a defective pinch roller.

Regardless of the format, manufacturer or machine model, from the very first Quadruplex VTR to the latest MiniDV camcorder, ALL video recorders use a pinch roller which presses up against the tape and forces it into a rotating capstan to pull the tape thru the mechanism,

Over time (whether the camcorder or vcr has been used or not) the pinch roller begins to deform as part of the normal aging process. As the rubber ages & hardens, it does not do so evenly, resulting in an "out of round" pinch roller. Even the slightest distortion (especially in the small tape formats) results first in tape flutter - and as the problem worsens, is exhibited by tape edge damage, as the tape is skewed into the upper or lower guidepost stops. In severe cases, the tape will be forced out of the guideposts altogether, resulting in severe tape creasing and an inevitable catastrophic jam.

The rubber pinch roller is a critical tape path component and is a scheduled maintenance item. Of all the mechanical components in a camcorder or vcr, it is usually the very first to need replacement.

Many camcorders and Vcr's have ended up in landfills due to nothing more than a simple rubber pinch roller in need of replacement. In it's wake, there's usually left behind a long trail of trashed tapes & lost memories.

[davideck]

anitract -
Your problem doesn't sound like a pinch roller to me.
The pinch roller is not engaged during Rewind or Fast Forward.

If the VCR records, plays, and searches fine, then the pinch roller is not likely to be a problem.

[BrainStorm69]

anitract, as I mentioned in my PM, the following is a good site for troubleshooting VCR issues. Just thought I'd post it here for others also.

http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/vcrfaq.htm

BTW, that Fixer site posted by mikel is also a good one.

[anitract]

I love this site. Everyone is so dang nice and helpful!

I think what I will probably do is take it in to be serviced at the local shop. I _may_ (if I get the nerve) open it up and look to see if anything is obviously worn or out of wack.

The thing that worries me is that the tape that it did this to the first time is a home video (irreplacable). The 6-10 inches of tape that is ruined probably only amounts to a couple of seconds, but according to the links posted here, you don't want to play tapes with crinkles because they can damage the VCR heads...so I will need to repair, or have someone else repair this. Another hurdle.

Thanks for the help everyone - I appreciate it!

[davideck]

You might discover a lot just by popping the top and watching the transport malfunction. You don't have to touch anything inside.

Stay away from bright lights. They can confuse the end of tape sensors.