Forbes Magazine says Madagascar WAS a true RIPGuard disc

[GullyFoyle]

it is true that dvd's are much cheaper than music cd's based on amount of content and cost of production - as well as manuf. costs ......

It's also true not much has changed since the pricefixing settlement.
I guarantee both could be reduced anywhere from $2 to $5 or more and still not cut into profit. Remember the artists makes more from concerts and associated sales/marketing than they do from cd's.
Here is how to do it.
Fair to the fans fair to the artist no greedy middlemen.
Jane Siberry Opens a Window On a Better Download World
http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/archives/004201.php

At a time when the music industry appears intent on pitting itself against digital music fans, at least one artist is staking out the opposite end of the spectrum.

Jane Siberry is a Canadian singer-songwriter, probably best known for the song "Calling All Angels," which featured kd lang and appeared on soundtracks for Wim Wenders' Until the End of the World and, later, Pay It Forward. She's enjoyed considerable success in both Canada and the US, has more than 10 albums to her name since 1981, and is often compared to Kate Bush and Joni Mitchell.

Her new download store, recently unveiled at her site, is a model of what the music downloading world could be. All of her songs are available as plain MP3s, which means they will play on your iPod and are not loaded with DRM restrictions (much less evil rootkits).

And you pay whatever you like for them. Yes, you set whatever price you like. Options include:

* free ("gift from Jane");
* a standard price (CAN$0.99);
* self-determined price - pay now; or
* self-determined price - pay later (to facilitate try-before-you-buy).

When you purchase the song, moreover, you can select up to 5 people to whom you can email a link to the song.

I just saw her perform in concert here in SF, and she summed it up this way: "I want to treat people the way I'd like to be treated. I don't like being treated like a child, so I won't be doing that to other people."

This is so blindingly, obviously right on so many levels, it demonstrates how far the "authorized music services" like iTunes Music Store and eMusic have yet to come.

[BJ_M]

to be fair -- itunes sets its price on what it is charged -- often up to 75cents a tune for its cost ... which after expenses - doesnt often leave much profit ...

that is not always the case -- and apple SHOULD make a profit also ....

[dafoe]

I own zero CDs- I just have very little interest in music. But I own hundreds of DVDs. When I first got my DVD burner, I went through a backup phase. But I eventually realized it would just be much easier and cheaper to replace most anything that happened to break.

At any rate, once I've seen a movie I don't generally watch it again. So why do I collect DVDs? The same reason most people do. I have plenty of disposable income. I enjoy the thrill of the hunt- Ebay/bargain bins etc I almost never pay $20 for a DVD. I have several movies that have never even been unwrapped. I just enjoy collecting.

However, anybody that thinks owning a shitty dark cam of a movie is going to stop someone from buying a DVD is seriously delusional. If movie downloads are affecting anything, it's the rental and theatre industries.

Think about it: I can watch Star Wars on my WS HDTV with surround sound. Or I can save a whopping $15 by watching a crappy cam with people talking in the background. Make any sense to you? Me neither.

[VegasBud]

From an article on BusinessWeek.com titled "Macrovision shares fall on RipGuard review":

Anti-piracy software maker Macrovision Corp. shares took a beating in afternoon trading on Tuesday after a Piper Jaffray analyst said he was able to circumvent the company's copy protection software and illegally rip, or duplicate, a copy of the recently released DVD "Madagascar."

Shares of Macrovision dropped by $1.37, or 8 percent, to $15.11 in recent Nasdaq trading on three times the average daily volume.

Since the story, Macrovision shares have dropped another 2 percent. At the start of this year, their stock was going for $28. In 2000, it was worth over $105.

[thecoalman]

Although I doubt the billions of dollars spent this year alone on ticket sales, pay per view, pay channels and movie merchandise agrees with your assessment of the industry.

Let's examine the numbers and titles:

http://www.filmsite.org/boxoffice.html - the top 100 Box office films of all times.... adjusted for inflation.

A film made after 2000 doesn't appear until # 33, Shrek 2. All the films listed on the list after 2000 and many for the late 90's have very big similarities....

1.They are primarily aimed at kids, granted some of those films are enjoyable to watch as an adult but I want "The Godfather" Not Harry Potter.

2. For post 2000 the majority are sequels not originals.

3. There's not an adult film on the list post 2000.

Nothing but overated crap being forced upon adults...... all flash no substance.

[DereX888]

ROF, dude, quit lurking on msg boards like this. Reading just 3 of your posts in a single thread tells everyone who you are, so please stop spamming boards like this.

This message board, and entire website's purpose of existence, is to help people rip commercial DVDs (among other of course). All this is assuming that the people legally own the discs, and it is directly in conflict with the point of view shared by RIAA/MPAA cartel's loudmouth dogs. Ofcourse you have a right to your opinion, however if you disagree with one of the purposes of this website/msg boards, perhaps you should go preach your utter crap smewhere else. I.e. if youre a Muslim you don't go to a Catholic church and preach Islam there (and vice-versa, ofcourse), isn't it obvious? Such common-sense is one of the principles of democratic freedoms in the western countries.
So either you acknowledge the existence of huge "pirate community" (in your opinion) such as this one, if you wish to be respected by other members, or just get lost or suffer consequences (which in my single case is treating you from now on like a moron and suspecting youre an MPAA running dog). <--that is my opinion, in a response to your opinions stated in this thread.
have a good barking day

[DereX888]

From an article on BusinessWeek.com titled "Macrovision shares fall on RipGuard review":

Anti-piracy software maker Macrovision Corp. shares took a beating in afternoon trading on Tuesday after a Piper Jaffray analyst said he was able to circumvent the company's copy protection software and illegally rip, or duplicate, a copy of the recently released DVD "Madagascar."

Shares of Macrovision dropped by $1.37, or 8 percent, to $15.11 in recent Nasdaq trading on three times the average daily volume.

Since the story, Macrovision shares have dropped another 2 percent. At the start of this year, their stock was going for $28. In 2000, it was worth over $105.

When it comes to money, no politically-correct crap propaganda can fool people
People had voted (with their money) and this kind of vote is the most democratic as it can be.
Thats what I call ultimate justice.
Too bad MPAA is not a freely traded asset on the market, hehe

[Seeker47]

it is true that dvd's are much cheaper than music cd's based on amount of content and cost of production - as well as manuf. costs ......

And that's smart marketing on their part. Typical music CDs at $18. (and more than a few priced higher than that) is most likely what put Tower Records into bankruptcy.

OTOH, how many times are you gonna watch a movie ?

[DereX888]

it is true that dvd's are much cheaper than music cd's based on amount of content and cost of production - as well as manuf. costs ......

And that's smart marketing on their part. Typical music CDs at $18. (and more than a few priced higher than that) is most likely what put Tower Records into bankruptcy.

Yet another 'ultimate justice' example of people voting with their monies.
The only sad part in such case is that through this rigged music distribution system, most of the musicians suffer as well.

[GullyFoyle]

it is true that dvd's are much cheaper than music cd's based on amount of content and cost of production - as well as manuf. costs ......

And that's smart marketing on their part. Typical music CDs at $18. (and more than a few priced higher than that) is most likely what put Tower Records into bankruptcy.

OTOH, how many times are you gonna watch a movie ?

Depends on the movie.
Most of todays films aren't worth the price of the plastic wrap.
Something like The Wild Bunch, The Professionals, or Musa (the Warrior) can be watched until your eyes fall out of their sockets.

[GullyFoyle]

I own zero CDs- I just have very little interest in music. But I own hundreds of DVDs. When I first got my DVD burner, I went through a backup phase. But I eventually realized it would just be much easier and cheaper to replace most anything that happened to break.

At any rate, once I've seen a movie I don't generally watch it again. So why do I collect DVDs? The same reason most people do. I have plenty of disposable income. I enjoy the thrill of the hunt- Ebay/bargain bins etc I almost never pay $20 for a DVD. I have several movies that have never even been unwrapped. I just enjoy collecting.

However, anybody that thinks owning a shitty dark cam of a movie is going to stop someone from buying a DVD is seriously delusional. If movie downloads are affecting anything, it's the rental and theatre industries.

Think about it: I can watch Star Wars on my WS HDTV with surround sound. Or I can save a whopping $15 by watching a crappy cam with people talking in the background. Make any sense to you? Me neither.

I agree i did the same thing. Then I hit the wall where there was so few things worth buying. Now I buy something really interesting.
There are a few things worth downloading. Fansubs not available on the market with English translations. Television I will never see in the US.
Obscure out of print films or anime.
If they were available I would buy them.
I can't comprehend the cam thing. I bought my home theater because I wanted as close to a theater experience as possible.

[GullyFoyle]

to be fair -- itunes sets its price on what it is charged -- often up to 75cents a tune for its cost ... which after expenses - doesnt often leave much profit ...

that is not always the case -- and apple SHOULD make a profit also ....

But those profits do not substantially go to the artist. Some lard assed CEO gets a bigger cut than mosdt artists do.
The other question is when an obscene profit is made on an item should prices then be cut? Clearly there is overcharging with that type of return.
But instead we see prices inflate beyond justification.
What Siberry did was take the fans into account. She also put her music ahead of the corporate bottom line. Kind of reminds me of the Greatful Dead and their encouragement of fans concert recordings. they new they made money off the audience and they gave something back.
They didn't go broke either.

[DereX888]

I can't comprehend the cam thing. I bought my home theater because I wanted as close to a theater experience as possible.

so did probably all of us.
I always find out that "cam thing" being brought up to the piracy discussions ridiculous.
One quick look at the real piracy scene, the torrent sites, the salespeople on the street with their illegal DVDs, it'll show anyone that the "cam thing" is almost non-existent, or limited to the recent theatrical releases. Usually months in advance of the DVD's "legal release" street date there are copies of the perfect dvd-rip, or just cloned dvds (DVD9's!) basically identical bit-by-bit with what will be released in months to come.
I've found on a flea market i.e. Star Wars III dvd for $8 - factory-pressed DVD9 illegal copy, not some DVD-R nor cam crap - more than a month before I was able to buy original, legal DVD in a store. And they are identical in their content down to the last Macrovision's 'quality protection' crappy logo
Thats what is real piracy, and where the MPAA and such ******** as Jack Valenti totally fail to to prevent it. Do not tell me they can't find such pirates, if average Joe like me can find them in about 15-30min on Sunday morning.

EDIT:
many Asian-released illegal DVDs are released better than the original DVDs back here in America. One of the best examples is i.e. "Kill Bill vol2", which not only had unaltered version of the film, but it had real 'star treatment' from those pirates who released it, including 4-page booklet, flaps on an additional hard-cover for the disc, better graphics print on the disc and so on. Kudos this poor original american release to its illegal asian copy LOL!
Forget those "cam things". Real piracy is not there lol. They are legitimate businesses in China and all over south-east Asia.

EDIT2:
and both examples, SWIII and KB2, did well at the box office and aftermarket (merchandising and DVDs). MPAA lied, lies and will lie about the real problem with the movie or music industry - which obviously is lack of good products for sale.
People (again lol!) vote with their money, and thats why most of the crap released in past years gets no attention and no "voting monies" from customers at all, because not even an idiots like to spend money on bad produvts, obviously, and not because some Joe (is or is not) able to backup his legally bought CD/DVD. Do RIAA/MPAA really think and believe that customers will buy 2nd CD for their car player, or 2nd DVD for their cottage etc? Is it some cheap scheme, on assumption that once you are willing to spend mony on a legally released product - thus you should be willing to buy it twice? I still can't understand MPAA/RIAA stance and huge PR on copying legally bought movies and music, while in the same time there is more illegal copies of their products on Asian markets than the entire industry is able to produce in America alone... But as usual, if no one knows what it is about - its gotta be about MONEY.
But thats not the point of course

[BJ_M]

it WAS pretty open here - the selling of bootleg dvds in mostly (in fact all the sales were at Asian malls) the Asian communities of Toronto Canada --

was a HUGE bust this weekend that maybe put a small dent in the supply ...

DVD pirating `everywhere'

Nov. 28, 2005. 01:00 AM
HILDA HOY
STAFF REPORTER

This weekend's massive seizure of pirated DVDs, the largest such haul in Canadian history, is just the tip of the iceberg, in a growing problem, authorities say.

Police seized at least 250,000 bootleg movies in raids carried out at three malls in York Region and Scarborough, including such recent blockbuster titles as Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, which only arrived in theatres on Nov. 18, and Rent, released on the big screen last Wednesday.

But despite the crackdown, police said, it's likely the pirating operations will continue to flourish. "I guarantee that if you go back to those malls, you'll see the guys setting up shop again," said Toronto police Det. Const. Maher Abdel-Malik. "They used to be more discreet, but now they're showing up everywhere."

"The (pirating operations) are like (marijuana) grow houses. You shut one down and another two pop up. It's a lucrative business," said York Region Det. Const. Mark Elliott.

Both officers agreed that public education will go a long way toward helping wipe out the piracy.

Saturday's operation was a joint effort between the RCMP, Canada Customs, York and Toronto police, and motion picture officials. Six merchants at Markham's Pacific Mall were charged with fraud and possession of stolen property, while Toronto police charged a total of 15 people after a raid on a mall near Sheppard Ave. E. and Brimley Rd

the quality of these disks were first class - with booklets, and top notch printing and covers ,, they were all pressed of course ...

they were 8$ each (CND) or 7 for $40

[guns1inger]

Of course, with some many obvious pirates here, you all have this site bookmarked

http://www.talklikeapirate.com/piratehome.html

Only 293 days to go

[ROF]

This message board, and entire website's purpose of existence, is to help people rip commercial DVDs [/b](among other of course).

That's quite interesting. It's pretty much a minority here or at the very least an after thought. I doubt the entire purpose of this site is for theft. As a matter of fact, it's got some of the best and most helpful people who rarely if ever share their thoughts or opinions about what you claim is the web site purpose of existence. Not to mention a look at the left hand column extolls the opposite virtues of your impression of the existence of this site

[DereX888]

it WAS pretty open here - the selling of bootleg dvds in mostly (in fact all the sales were at Asian malls) the Asian communities of Toronto Canada --

was a HUGE bust this weekend that maybe put a small dent in the supply ...

DVD pirating `everywhere'

Nov. 28, 2005. 01:00 AM
HILDA HOY
STAFF REPORTER

This weekend's massive seizure of pirated DVDs, the largest such haul in Canadian history, is just the tip of the iceberg, in a growing problem, authorities say.

Police seized at least 250,000 bootleg movies in raids carried out at three malls in York Region and Scarborough, including such recent blockbuster titles as Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, which only arrived in theatres on Nov. 18, and Rent, released on the big screen last Wednesday.

But despite the crackdown, police said, it's likely the pirating operations will continue to flourish. "I guarantee that if you go back to those malls, you'll see the guys setting up shop again," said Toronto police Det. Const. Maher Abdel-Malik. "They used to be more discreet, but now they're showing up everywhere."

"The (pirating operations) are like (marijuana) grow houses. You shut one down and another two pop up. It's a lucrative business," said York Region Det. Const. Mark Elliott.

Both officers agreed that public education will go a long way toward helping wipe out the piracy.

Saturday's operation was a joint effort between the RCMP, Canada Customs, York and Toronto police, and motion picture officials. Six merchants at Markham's Pacific Mall were charged with fraud and possession of stolen property, while Toronto police charged a total of 15 people after a raid on a mall near Sheppard Ave. E. and Brimley Rd

the quality of these disks were first class - with booklets, and top notch printing and covers ,, they were all pressed of course ...

they were 8$ each (CND) or 7 for $40

thats what I'm talking about.
Quarter million illegal copies on some 3 malls only, somewhere uptown, in a country with 30+ million people only. Wow.
THAT'S PIRACY.
What this has to do with people making backup copies at home, for their own use (in another house, or just for kids - so they won't damage the original), as some morons like ROF, Jack Valenti and others want us to believe?

Now, imagine what you are going to see in the stores of Hong Kong, Shanghai, Beijing, etc etc (I've been there, I wrote about it year or more ago here as well)... Should I say billions of pirated copies? Since some shadowy small malls in some small country had 250,000 perfect silver-pressed copies...
Anyone else still want to compare legitimate owners of DVDs copying them for their own use at their own households to pirates? Just f*ck off, idiots, with your DMCA and other crap, lol!

[vitualis]

"Ripping a DVD" is not "theft". It depends on the setting. It may be breaching the DMCA (though this has never been tested) and its international equivalents. You are correct that this is far from the "entire website's purpose of existence".

Regards.

[ROF]

"Ripping a DVD" is not "theft". It depends on the setting. It may be breaching the DMCA (though this has never been tested) and its international equivalents.

Murder isn't illegal either unless you get caught.

[DereX888]

This message board, and entire website's purpose of existence, is to help people rip commercial DVDs [/b](among other of course).

That's quite interesting. It's pretty much a minority here or at the very least an after thought. I doubt the entire purpose of this site is for theft. As a matter of fact, it's got some of the best and most helpful people who rarely if ever share their thoughts or opinions about what you claim is the web site purpose of existence. Not to mention a look at the left hand column extolls the opposite virtues of your impression of the existence of this site

Youre an idiot, sir, and I won't go to any further discussion with you.
See the viewership of the guides posted here on vhelp, see how many guides are DVD BACKUP RELATED, and then f*ck off, you moron.
BTW:
Quit insulting me (such as by implying that Im a pirate because I backup my legally owned DVDs and CDs) and then I'll quit insulting you. I follow the "eye for an eye rule", and I won't give you my other cheek for slapping as some good christians would. Comprehende, moronicus?

[ROF]

This message board, and entire website's purpose of existence, is to help people rip commercial DVDs [/b](among other of course).

That's quite interesting. It's pretty much a minority here or at the very least an after thought. I doubt the entire purpose of this site is for theft. As a matter of fact, it's got some of the best and most helpful people who rarely if ever share their thoughts or opinions about what you claim is the web site purpose of existence. Not to mention a look at the left hand column extolls the opposite virtues of your impression of the existence of this site

Youre an idiot, sir, and I won't go to any further discussion with you.
See the viewership of the guides posted here on vhelp, see how many guides are DVD BACKUP RELATED, and then f*ck off, you moron.
BTW:
Quit insulting me (such as by implying that Im a pirate because I backup my legally owned DVDs and CDs) and then I'll quit insulting you. I follow the "eye for an eye rule", and I won't give you my other cheek for slapping as some good christians would. Comprehende, moronicus?

HAHAHAHAHA! I didn't know trolls had eye patches and peg legs.

BTW, you own the DVD, not the content. You purchased a license to view the content.

[Noahtuck]

"Ripping a DVD" is not "theft". It depends on the setting. It may be breaching the DMCA (though this has never been tested) and its international equivalents.

Murder isn't illegal either unless you get caught.

Just like when you kept arguing that it was illegal to make backup's of music cd's you bought
Which sony's themselve's pretty much proved you wrong

Well, if you were not allowed to make 2 BU copies of an audio cd you owned then my thinking is "Sony" would have made their "Copy Protection" to only allow you to make 1 backup or 0 backup's, not limit you to 3 8)

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1411721#1411721

BUt i'm sure you are correct that backing up a dvd you own is illegal just like you are correct about it being legal to back up a music cd you paid for (think about what sony's themselve's did) :P

HAHAHAHAHA! I didn't know trolls had eye patches and peg legs.

Seeing as we are on the subject of "trolls"
Oop's... guess i should not insult trolls like that

[rkr1958]

"Ripping a DVD" is not "theft". It depends on the setting. It may be breaching the DMCA (though this has never been tested) and its international equivalents.

Murder isn't illegal either unless you get caught.

Huh?! I think murder is probably illegal whether or not you get caught ... but what does that have to do with ripping a DVD you own?

How is ripping a DVD that I've already bought theft? As vitualis stated it might be a breech of the DMCA ... but it's certainly not theft since I already own the DVD. Anyway ... I choose to backup most of my DVDs and put the originals up in a safe place. I do this for two reasons ... to protect my original purchase and for convenience. I keep all my backups in DVD wallets ... this makes storage easy (24 per wallet) and when we go on vacation and I can take the one or two wallets (usually movies for my 4-year old son) and not worry about losing the originals.

[ROF]

"Ripping a DVD" is not "theft". It depends on the setting. It may be breaching the DMCA (though this has never been tested) and its international equivalents.

Murder isn't illegal either unless you get caught.

Huh?! I think murder is probably illegal whether or not you get caught ... but what does that have to do with ripping a DVD you own?

How is ripping a DVD that I've already bought theft? As vitualis stated it might be a breech of the DMCA ... but it's certainly not theft since I already own the DVD. Anyway ... I choose to backup most of my DVDs and put the originals up in a safe place. I do this for two reasons ... to protect my original purchase and for convenience. I keep all my backups in DVD wallets ... this makes storage easy (24 per wallet) and when we go on vacation and I can take the one or two wallets (usually movies for my 4-year old son) and not worry about losing the originals.

I understand the convenience factor or even the idea of media shifting where you have a portable 100GB video player filled with a bunch of DVD rips and home movies. I also understand the idea behind wanting to back up media you've purchased. It's still violating the law without leaving the privacy of your home. Is it theft? It depends on who you are in the situation of you being able to violate the law instead of purchasing a second copy.

[DereX888]

HAHAHAHAHA! I didn't know trolls had eye patches and peg legs.

BTW, you own the DVD, not the content. You purchased a license to view the content.

Look in the mirror if you want to see how the troll look like.
Or an MPAA/RIAA running dog.


Movie is on the DVD. buy DVD = I buy movie, "for my personal experience". I can and I do whatever I want to do with it as soon as I've paid for it, same as what I can do with CDs, and same as with anything we buy. When you buy the car you own the car, including its engine, transmission and every piece and part of it down to the last screw, and no DMCA (if there was one for car industry) will tell us otherwise, that by owning my car I don't own its engine! LOL!!
They could push DMCA crap only because average person had no clue what kind of law is forced upon them, but as any "bad law" - it will pass sooner or later. Slavery was also justified by law, and so many other "bad laws", and where are they now?

There is something really badly messed up up under your skull if you think otherwise.
Go to MPAA msg board, cry out to your kindred ******* J.Valenti, he'll understand you for sure

[BobK]

"Ripping a DVD" is not "theft". It depends on the setting. It may be breaching the DMCA (though this has never been tested) and its international equivalents.

Murder isn't illegal either unless you get caught.

Typical ROF piss-poor analogy that means nothing.

A slightly better (and certainly more accurate) one would be "killing isn't illegal unless it's murder". And there are many times when killing isn't murder.

[DereX888]

can't we just get rid of such trolls?
Admins, come on, make a statement!

[smearbrick1]

"Ripping a DVD" is not "theft". It depends on the setting. It may be breaching the DMCA (though this has never been tested) and its international equivalents.

Murder isn't illegal either unless you get caught. :)

Dude... you have to stop comparing DVD backups to murder. I think I've commented on this before on an earlier thread where you made this stupid remark. I hope, for your sake, you never have to experience this type of crime to really understand how much it is not related to backing up a $10.00 DVD.

An opinion is one thing, but pull your head out of your ass.

[Noahtuck]

"Ripping a DVD" is not "theft". It depends on the setting. It may be breaching the DMCA (though this has never been tested) and its international equivalents.

Murder isn't illegal either unless you get caught.

Dude... you have to stop comparing DVD backups to murder. I think I've commented on this before on an earlier thread where you made this stupid remark. I hope, for your sake, you never have to experience this type of crime to really understand how much it is not related to backing up a $10.00 DVD.

An opinion is one thing, but pull your head out of your ass.

Wow!!!!! was that an understatement and putting it noce to him

From a few of his remarks in diff. threads, or lack thereof, he obviously is really ignorant or just always trying to stir 8)

[BobK]

Let's examine the numbers and titles:

http://www.filmsite.org/boxoffice.html - the top 100 Box office films of all times.... adjusted for inflation.

A film made after 2000 doesn't appear until # 33, Shrek 2. All the films listed on the list after 2000 and many for the late 90's have very big similarities....

Looking at it another way- when using the inflation adjusted list, 15 of the top 100 box office films were made after 2000. Starting in 1939, that means over a period of 67 years, 15% of the top money-makers were made in the most recent 7.4% of the years covered. If anything, films since 2000 are over represented.

1.They are primarily aimed at kids, granted some of those films are enjoyable to watch as an adult but I want "The Godfather" Not Harry Potter.

Some of the are inarguably aimed toward kids, but when you say "as an adult, I want to watch", you're really not speaking for adults- you're only speaking for yourself. There are many adults that would rather see Harry Potter than The Godfather.

2. For post 2000 the majority are sequels not originals.

7 out of 15 are sequels. 8 out of 15 are not. 7 is not a majority.

3. There's not an adult film on the list post 2000.

At best that would depend on how you define "adult film". You are correct that there are no porn titles on the list.

Nothing but overated crap being forced upon adults...... all flash no substance.

Who's forcing adults to do see any movie?

At this point I've forgotten what point you were trying to defend, but your argument trying to support it is "all flash no substance".