Canopus ADVC-300 Filter settings

[pharries]

I love my Canopus ADVC-300
Only problem is I am not getting the most out of it
Can any one explain the following:-
1) 2D vs 3D noise reduction?
2) The effect of the Y and C filter settings for each?
3) When to Use Black expoansion, white expansion andWhite Step?
4) Video AGC, I adjust this a lot, it certainly helps. Any quidelines?

I am obviously going to be MPEG compressing subsequently so bear that in mind. Am I wasting my time with some of these settings?
(I use Canopus Procoder Express)
A guide for this would I am sure be appreciated!
Paul

[Wile_E]

I have ADVC-300 too, but I think the Picture Controller software sucks big time. It is really a joke, and Canopus never has updated it. But to answer your questions...

1) 3D NR is usually better, as it uses previous/next frames to calculate noise reduction for the frames. 2D just blurs the picture of all frames. Put 3D NR on low setting. Anything higher may cause artifacts or ghosting in some colors.

2) Y Brightness C Chroma(Color). I believe these settings only affect the composite input. S-Video is already seperated.

3 & 4) I would leave these all at defaults, unless you have a waveform display, to guide you. If you brighten/darken too much, your video could get out of spec. Sony Vegas has a waveform display to show the IRE levels, and you want them between 0-100 IRE (16-235). The default for video AGC on my ADVC-300, seems a little too bright. Whites go up to about 105 IRE. So I usually set this control to manual, and adjust it down.

[Dragonsf]

Had anyone found a setting for the TBC?

I leave all settings to default, besides audio.
Any tweaking with the video filtering resulted in bad captures (no detail, artefacts and so on).

[lordsmurf]

ADVC-300 is all marketing, and little follow through. Most users I've seen/met/read/heard report more flaws if they try to filter. The TBC is also questionable on whether it's truly a TBC, and not some sort of pseudo/virtual/partial TBC-like device. Those sort of things are usually just on/off, there are no "settings" to be had on them.

[pharries]

Very interesting
I have been capturing old U-matic tapes and have noticed that setting the 2D y is either Low or medium is best
I also have noticed the AGC is a little too high and turn it down just a little.

[pharries]

Wile_E
I am getting an oscilloscope. Any guides on how to use it to opttomize the picture?

[edDV]

Wile_E
I am getting an oscilloscope. Any guides on how to use it to opttomize the picture?

What you need is a waveform monitor, and these need to be in calibration.
http://search.ebay.com/waveform-monitor_W0QQfromZR8QQfsooZ2QQfsopZ3QQsbrsrtZl

[edDV]

ADVC-300 is all marketing, and little follow through. Most users I've seen/met/read/heard report more flaws if they try to filter. The TBC is also questionable on whether it's truly a TBC, and not some sort of pseudo/virtual/partial TBC-like device. Those sort of things are usually just on/off, there are no "settings" to be had on them.

The manual is not informative and there are no published app notes.

[pharries]

This is interesting
Has anyone tested the TBC on the unit
I just sold my TBC this week on Ebay thinking I had one in the canopus!

[edDV]

This is interesting
Has anyone tested the TBC on the unit
I just sold my TBC this week on Ebay thinking I had one in the canopus!

Are you seeing any timebase correction?

It seems to have only automatic modes. Reading the manual, I can't tell if TBC is always in the loop or just turned on when composite or S-Video is connected. In fact, I see no mention of TBC in the manual.

Maybe an owner should call Canopus support.

[Dragonsf]

I called Canopus support:nothing is known about the TBC (I didn't find anything in the manual too).

[pharries]

I emailed them asking the same questions as above and invited them to join this discussion as well.
Hope they do

[pharries]

I got this reply from canopus today

Let me start by answering your questions:

01. The 2D Noise reduction blurs the image so that the sharp noise is not very noticeable.
The 3D Noise reduction compares the previous and the next frames for differences, and then removes the noise.

02. The Y and C settings gets a little complicated. Y signal is the Luminance signal (The brightness of the video), and the C signal is the chrominance signal (Color).

03. You use the Black Expansion when the black of the video does not look black. Sometimes, on old videos, they look a little gray. And the same thing is on the White adjustments.

04. The AGC is used to gain some brightness on the video so that it looks comfortable to the eyes. It is also the circuitry that automatically adjusts the gain level providing optimum signal output and preventing potentially damaging circuit overload. AGC circuits are used in cameras and recording devices, and other video devices to maintain proper signal levels without requiring an operator to manually monitor controls.

05. The TBC function of the box is only a Line TBC. It can eliminate some horizontal noise lines on the old video.


The rule of thumb is to connect a TV to the output of the ADVC-300, and view the picture from your TV, and not the VGA monitor while adjusting. The default settings should work for most videos, but you need to know what to adjust before you do it. This ADVC-300 packs a lot of professional features on a consumer box, and therefore, the functions tend to confuse people.

[edDV]

I got this reply from canopus today

Let me start by answering your questions:

01. The 2D Noise reduction blurs the image so that the sharp noise is not very noticeable.
The 3D Noise reduction compares the previous and the next frames for differences, and then removes the noise.

02. The Y and C settings gets a little complicated. Y signal is the Luminance signal (The brightness of the video), and the C signal is the chrominance signal (Color).

03. You use the Black Expansion when the black of the video does not look black. Sometimes, on old videos, they look a little gray. And the same thing is on the White adjustments.

04. The AGC is used to gain some brightness on the video so that it looks comfortable to the eyes. It is also the circuitry that automatically adjusts the gain level providing optimum signal output and preventing potentially damaging circuit overload. AGC circuits are used in cameras and recording devices, and other video devices to maintain proper signal levels without requiring an operator to manually monitor controls.

05. The TBC function of the box is only a Line TBC. It can eliminate some horizontal noise lines on the old video.


The rule of thumb is to connect a TV to the output of the ADVC-300, and view the picture from your TV, and not the VGA monitor while adjusting. The default settings should work for most videos, but you need to know what to adjust before you do it. This ADVC-300 packs a lot of professional features on a consumer box, and therefore, the functions tend to confuse people.

Did you get a name there? I think they should be offering a better explanation of the features for a $450-550 consumer product. Private message the name to me.

[pharries]

PM'd the name to you.
I felt the answer only told me what I knew already, no real guidance.
frankly I have gone this week from being a devotee of Canopus (I have bought 6 of their products) to the point that I will think twice before spending any more money there,
Compare their response with the likes of the creators of DVDlab! My impression is that either the employees are unhappy, there are problems with the company or they have gotten too big I guess!
I have had much better responses from Msoft!!!!!!

[edDV]

PM'd the name to you.
I felt the answer only told me what I knew already, no real guidance.
frankly I have gone this week from being a devotee of Canopus (I have bought 6 of their products) to the point that I will think twice before spending any more money there,
Compare their response with the likes of the creators of DVDlab! My impression is that either the employees are unhappy, there are problems with the company or they have gotten too big I guess!
I have had much better responses from Msoft!!!!!!

Their other products seem to be well supported. The ADVC-300 has never been very well documented, especially the TBC feature. I'll see what I can find out.

[Wile_E]

I got this reply from canopus today
04. AGC circuits are used in cameras and recording devices, and other video devices to b[]maintain proper signal levels[/b] without requiring an operator to manually monitor controls.

"Maintain proper signal levels." Yeah right. Then why does AGC boost the level to over 100IRE? When having everything on default, my videos go up to about 105-107 IRE. And about the black expansion. Black on NTSC is supposed to look dark grey, not total black! It is quite obvious that Canopus is not trying to maintain a pure signal. They have defaults set up to "enhance" the signal. I suppose you can also this "problem" another way...enhance it so it looks similar to current digital formats. So it looks better for the grandkids in the future, when they all have super-high resolution displays. Otherwise grandkids will wonder why black looks grey.

[pharries]

I bought a waveeform monitor on Ebay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7559930770&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWN%3AIT&rd=1
Any advice on how to use it with the Canopus unit?

[pharries]

How do you guys measure IRE anyway?

[themaster1]

Sorry for resurecting an old topic (that should be less work for the mods by the way)
I'm curious about a few things about this advc300:
When you apply the filters 3d noise reduction, brightness,contrast,sharpness,ntsc setup etc.. does it also apply to the s-video out (analog) and not just the digital firewire ouput . As i understand you control these A/V filters with the Picture Controller 300 (so windows Xp only i guess)

I'm thinking to hook up a dvd recorder after the advc300 which would work as a dedicated proc amp (enough for my needs).


Thanks for your help

[DB83]

Now I thought I was seeing a ghost

AFAIK the filters will work in pass-through mode ie analag to analog although I have never tried that.

But the picture-controller DOES work with Win7-64 at least.

[themaster1]

If you can try rapidly (today) that would be great.
On the manual (p.34) they say: Picture Controller 300 lets you adjust the image and sound quality of streams coming from the computer via the DV terminal. So that's confusing

[DB83]

Sorry but I do not have any means of trying it out.

Yes. It does appear confusing but in another part of the manual I recall reading that you can use the unit analog to analog - which is what you want to do - so I see no reason why adjustments are not possible. Else, unless I miss something, what is there to gain by connecting analog to analog ?

I think what you are reading or mis-reading is that the PC controls the Controller via the DV terminal. However the 300 also operates without assistance from the controller by changing a jumper and pushing the buttons on top.

[themaster1]

You're right (i'm reading the manual again) with the Dip switch(2) set to On (adjust) on the bottom of the unit you can adjust various filters (contrast,3dnr brightness etc..) but again,on the left side i read: The settings specified in the image quality adjustment are applied when analog data is converted to DV data. (p.22); nothing specified for analog to analog.
The s-video out seem to be for smpte color bars only but i hope i'm wrong

[DB83]

I was thinking over dinner and I have recently done an analog t0 analog thro the ADVC for capture purposes.

So I set this up again and tested the controller in to the capture window for my hauppuage device. I can confirm that the capture window - not the controller preview window - does react to the sliders.

The tect was with composite but no reason for it not to work with s-video.

[themaster1]

Alright i guess i'll trust your judgement on this, thanks for your input DB83

[DB83]

Well I can see why that is written since the primary purpose of the unit is Analog to DV conversion.

Of course I could, and maybe should, have taken the test one stage further and done a short capture whilst moving the slider(s). Did not consider that to be necessary.

[digicube]

Do you turn on or off noise reduction on advc-300? I thought NR is bad because it makes the picture look softer.

[dvd3500]

Using the software that comes with the device you can adjust how aggressive NR works as well sharpness...