Cam Bitmap Mpeg or avi Video files be traced

[Xabache]

My query is to those with intimate knowledge of inner storage capacities of video file capability only please

Can a bitmap, mpeg, or avi file contain within it any tracking information such as computer serial number, operating system information, ip address, time zone or type of program the file was constucted with or any other information that could be used to trace a video to its source of creation, by anyone with the proper equipment to extract this information. Do video files contain the capacity to record such information about their creation?

I did look into this myself but found no reference to the subject on any site.

[canadateck]

I know VirtualDub has a Filter of somekind that you can Hide info/Messages In.

[Rich_S]

The term is commonly called "Steganography". Here is a starter link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steganography

[redwudz]

Certainly information like you mentioned can be written on or added to a digital file. But someone would have to do it, that's not a normal procedure.

Files do have a creation date, your computer shows you that, and maybe the program that created or edited them, but it seems unlikely they have any data that references the computer used or any real identifying information about it.

You would be more likely to see that on a media disc, tape, or other media and not the individual files.

There possibly is some reference numbers added that could link that media to the computer that created it. Maybe the MAC address of the computer or just the model of the burner if it's a disc, maybe it's serial number, along with the time and date.

Not too long ago, they traced a serial killer who sent a CD to the authorities back to the computer he was using from data on the disc.

For video or digital photographs, you might want to do a search for 'Watermarks'. They are commonly used, especially in photography and may not be easily visible.

[thecoalman]

There was a post here a few months ago where a programmer posted a program for placing small simple text into a AVI. The text was encoded into the video stream and could be read if someone had the same program to decode it.

Interesting I guess if your a spy...

Edit: found it... https://www.videohelp.com/forum/archive/t274373.html

[skeg64]

there is a character string in the header of an MPEG file. It often contains information about the encoder or the editer that created the file. I know that TMPGenc inserts the serial number and version that was used to encode it. MPEG Video Wizard does this too. I would think that this could be used to trace to the person who downloaded the program.

[junkmalle]

Given that just about every printer embeds a serial number (that can be traced to that printer) in everything it prints I wouldn't be surprised if the US government has forced many of the image manipulation programs to embed something identifiable in every image and video!

In case you haven't heard about the printer thing:

http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,118664,00.asp

Why would they do the same with image/video editing software? What about the excuse of tracking down child pornographers and terrorists?

Actually this type of technology is of no use in tracking down criminals, it's used for proving, after they've been caught, that their equipment is the source of the material.

[canadateck]

MicroSoft

[thecoalman]

Now that I think of it images can conatain EXIF info too. Can tell the type od device such as the camera, even the settings on the cam when it was taken.

It can be easily removed though, simply running it through a application that doesn't support EXIF will remove it.

----------

One of the troubles with something like the program I listed above where the data is hidden within the file is that if it's reencoded the hidden data is destroyed. Same for watermarks on images.

[junkmalle]

Also keep in mind that whenever you upload something there may be a record of the IP address the computer that uploaded the file. That can be used to track you down even if the file contains no identifiable information.

[Mister Flonk-Flonk]

My query is to those with intimate knowledge of inner storage capacities of video file capability only please

Can a bitmap, mpeg, or avi file contain within it any tracking information such as computer serial number, operating system information, ip address, time zone or type of program the file was constucted with or any other information that could be used to trace a video to its source of creation, by anyone with the proper equipment to extract this information. Do video files contain the capacity to record such information about their creation?

I did look into this myself but found no reference to the subject on any site.

No.

[redwudz]

Sure, there are ways and programs to put markers on most any file. For the extremely paranoid, there are resources to study........

You can do a Google search for 'Security' or 'hiding your tracks' and probably a few more I can't even think of. Refine your search. Keep looking. They are out there.

If this is really what you are worried about, you can find it. There are 'dark corners' of the internet that will tell you about most anything.

Still, most of us are unconcerned. I've nothing to hide.

[dipstick]

A typical Exif information file from a jpg taken with a digital camera would look something like this:

Make - NIKON CORPORATION
Model - NIKON D70
Orientation - Top left
XResolution - 300
YResolution - 300
ResolutionUnit - Inch
Software - Adobe Photoshop CS Windows
DateTime - 2004:03:19 01:27:10
ExifOffset - 216
ExposureTime - 1/125 seconds
FNumber - 5.60
ExposureProgram - Normal program
ExifVersion - 0220
DateTimeOriginal - 2004:03:18 18:32:54
DateTimeDigitized - 2004:03:18 18:32:54
ExposureBiasValue - 0.33
MaxApertureValue - F 1.74
MeteringMode - Multi-segment
LightSource - Auto
Flash - Not fired
FocalLength - 50 mm
UserComment -
SubsecTime - 0
SubsecTimeOriginal - 0
SubsecTimeDigitized - 0
FlashPixVersion - 0100
ColorSpace - sRGB
ExifImageWidth - 3008
ExifImageHeight - 2000
SensingMethod - One-chip color area sensor
FileSource - Other
SceneType - Other

Information like this is very usefull for determining the settings used to take the shot.

[Xabache]

Thank you for all your replies, It seems in general without to much detail tracing is possible, with the exception of a single resounding No. So let me go into further detail about the film I have produced. As I would like a more definite answer.

It is built entirely of news and private footage downloaded by myself from various P2P servers, none of the footage have I produced myself, so watermarks are out. Then in most cases the footage is then converted using winAVI Video converter in mpeg2 format then dropped into mpeg video wizard and soon adobe premiere, note all copies of said programs are not directly traceable to me (unless perhaps they report in to their masters who’s running what serial number from what computer), where I have then re-edited and arranged, A film built of unlicensed material(mind you this isn’t my concern as I do so in “Fair Use” and not for profit) But the subject matter is very powerful and possibly likely to result in my ultimate termination by the CIA or perhaps far more likely, of the extremely unlikely scenarios these are, just some lone psychopath. Mind you this video is in no real way illegal, however its an expose type production and my first of such type. And could quite frankly get me in a lot of trouble do to its shocking visible fact, lack of editorial voice-overs, simplicity and all around reality shatter nature. And finally yes my upload is of course traceable which is why I wont initially be introducing the file from my computer or home.

This while seeming a paranoid subject should be of concern to any film maker as it may be quite possible for big brother to stick his head in on us and impose his will on our artistic license. We are free are we not? Not if we can be traced we aren’t.

So Downloaded footage > winAVI; converted to mpeg format > mpeg Video Wizard or Adobe Premiere 1.5 > winAVI; converted to avi format > then uploaded to P2P.

Let’s see a show of hands. Traceable to me based on non voluntary information imbedded in the files? Yes, or No.

[thecoalman]

Uh-oh.... you've done it now.




If

It is built entirely of news and private footage

none of the footage have I produced myself,

A film built of unlicensed material

then

(mind you this isn’t my concern as I do so in “Fair Use” and not for profit)

makes no difference, copyrighted material cannot be used in a project inteneded for distribution whether it's for profit or not. Which makes

Mind you this video is in no real way illegal

completely untrue. Having said that the only guys in the black coats that I would worry about coming to get you are the ones that are going to be sitting on the other side of the table representing the people who's copyrighted material you have used.

ohhhhh, them and the mods who are probably going to lock this thread. Discussing illegal activities such as using someones copyrighted material in your own project is against the rules here.

[Xabache]

Yet it hasnt been for one good reason, I am not without basis here

One of the rights accorded to the owner of copyright is the right to reproduce or to authorize others to reproduce the work in copies or phonorecords. This right is subject to certain limitations found in sections 107 through 118 of the copyright act (title 17, U.S. Code). One of the more important limitations is the doctrine of “fair use.” Although fair use was not mentioned in the previous copyright law, the doctrine has developed through a substantial number of court decisions over the years. This doctrine has been codified in section 107 of the copyright law.

Section 107 contains a list of the various purposes for which the reproduction of a particular work may be considered “fair,” such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Section 107 also sets out four factors to be considered in determining whether or not a particular use is fair:

the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

the nature of the copyrighted work;

amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and

the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.
The distinction between “fair use” and infringement may be unclear and not easily defined. There is no specific number of words, lines, or notes that may safely be taken without permission. Acknowledging the source of the copyrighted material does not substitute for obtaining permission.

The 1961 Report of the Register of Copyrights on the General Revision of the U.S. Copyright Law cites examples of activities that courts have regarded as fair use: “quotation of excerpts in a review or criticism for purposes of illustration or comment; quotation of short passages in a scholarly or technical work, for illustration or clarification of the author’s observations; use in a parody of some of the content of the work parodied; summary of an address or article, with brief quotations, in a news report; reproduction by a library of a portion of a work to replace part of a damaged copy; reproduction by a teacher or student of a small part of a work to illustrate a lesson; reproduction of a work in legislative or judicial proceedings or reports; incidental and fortuitous reproduction, in a newsreel or broadcast, of a work located in the scene of an event being reported.”

Copyright protects the particular way an author has expressed himself; it does not extend to any ideas, systems, or factual information conveyed in the work.

The safest course is always to get permission from the copyright owner before using copyrighted material. The Copyright Office cannot give this permission.

When it is impracticable to obtain permission, use of copyrighted material should be avoided unless the doctrine of “fair use” would clearly apply to the situation. The Copyright Office can neither determine if a certain use may be considered “fair” nor advise on possible copyright violations. If there is any doubt, it is advisable to consult an attorney.

FL-102, June 1999

Reading is Important

[jimmalenko]

Cam Bitmap Mpeg or avi Video files be traced

For our own safety, I sure hope so

This while seeming a paranoid subject should be of concern to any film maker as it may be quite possible for big brother to stick his head in on us and impose his will on our artistic license. We are free are we not? Not if we can be traced we aren’t.

Let's not have acceptable standards then - you're free to display whatever you want, at whatever times you want, on TV or in film, with no control exerted by the powers-that-be. And we won't bother giving films a ratings classification either - it's more of a lottery-type forest-gump-chocolate-box situation at the cinema then - you never know what you're gonna get

Whilst in principle I support the notion of free speech, I can also see why there needs to be rules and regulations to stop all sorts of crap from infiltration. Being able to be traced hardly violates your rights as a film-maker IMHO.

[Cornucopia]

IANAL, but depending on the number and proportion of clips, this might fall under the "criticism" or "parody" clauses. If I were doing this, I would sure get original "licensed" versions to work from, though, and not DL stuff if I could help it.

Scott

[thecoalman]

IANAL, but depending on the number and proportion of clips, this might fall under the "criticism" or "parody" clauses.

That's my point, according to his post it's entirely composed of nothing but others copyrighted work. There is no original material.

[Cornucopia]

I'm not sure you got my meaning.

If I were to take 50x 5second clips from other's works and juxtapose them in a certain order as to draw out the irony of the contrast between shots and make some political or other commentary, wouldn't that be parody/criticism? Even if there was no new/original material of my own?

At least, that's what I though the guy was talking about.

Scott

[TBoneit]

sounds to like taken out of context material to prove a point.

Also sounds like the conspiracy type videos flooding the net from people with an axe to grind.

Or in other words for example. Bush lied/covered-up, Mcdonalds is making you fat, big business of your choice lied/covered-up, Big brother is watching etc.

Just like the news broadcasts use sound bites to prove a point, Damn shame they won't show the whole statement, but that might prove the opposite of what they want us to believe. Do I believe the Newscasts/newspapers are biased, of course they are, they're run by humans.

[ranvijaysingh4]

Given that just about every printer embeds a serial number (that can be traced to that printer) in everything it prints I wouldn't be surprised if the US government has forced many of the image manipulation programs to embed something identifiable in every image and video!

In case you haven't heard about the printer thing:

http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,118664,00.asp

Why would they do the same with image/video editing software? What about the excuse of tracking down child pornographers and terrorists?

Actually this type of technology is of no use in tracking down criminals, it's used for proving, after they've been caught, that their equipment is the source of the material.

Do you mean to say that if AVI file contains some information pertaining to PC like serial number etc with the help of which it can be proved that the particular equipment was the source of the material once the suspect is caught...? if yes, then what is such information and where is it stored, is it in an encrypted form?

[ranvijaysingh4]

From this thread I understand that AVI file contains some information pertaining to PC like serial number etc with the help of which it can be proved that the particular equipment was the source of the material once the suspect is caught...? if yes, then what is such information and where is it stored, is it in an encrypted form?