Hauppage PVR vs Standalone DVDR

[strongbad]

Can people who own both a standalone, and the hauppage cap card tell me which produces the best pic quality? I'm assuming the PVR, because you can use CCE at as many passes as you want.

Would like to get some feedback on the pro's and cons

[LCSHG]

[ strongbad ]

I think that your question depends on your opinion of quality, also what you want to acomplish.

I have an ilo DVDRHD04 stand-alone DVD recorder with Hack

I have used the Hauppage card , also an older hauppage card with a chipset that did not react to CP.
I find the atand-alone recorders, LiteOn products, much more easy to acomplish want I want. I find that the quility of the recordings, given a recording time, with reasonable bit rate values is as good as the PC route.

Quality is that which seems best for you, when vewing the result.
If you want an exact and top quality bit rate copy, go with the Hauppage card and software like Decrypter, Shrink, etc

I just want the main program I don't see a difference in vewing the results, when recorded at bit rate reasonably close to that of the PC route.
I'm pleased with the results I get with my stand-alone

[edDV]

Trends:

- Hardware is getting better for limited function specialized mass market tasks like those supported by DVD recorders.

- Computers offer more flexibility, depend on CPU power, and usually take more time and expertise to get what you want.

[RabidDog]

Running CCE many times is no guarantor of quality .. in fact it would have the least effect. Capturing hardware and signal quality plus an insanely high bitrate (16mb/s) is a better idea. CCE cant add back quality that is lost on a bad source. Capturing with a card could give better results but for ease of use, a recorder is probably better..
I have debated this myself and am just deciding which model (of recorder) and whether it should have an added hard disk, with divx and perhaps wireless Lan as well. three tuners really, with about 400gb and DL burning and Hi-def too ...Hmmmm???

[FulciLives]

I've used computer capture cards as well as stand alone DVD recorders. In fact not that long ago I used a Hauppauge WinTV PVR 150. So I will try to answer based on not just the quality issues but other issues as well.

Let's get something out of the way right away. The Hauppauge WinTV PVR 150 is garbage. It has several issues affecting the image and sound quality. It should be avoided. These issues do not seem to burden the older models ... the 250 and the 350 models. If you want to go with Hauppauge then please get the 250 model or the 250 model but not the 150 model.

Having said that my experience quality wise was with the 150 but I have seen many pics and even (very) short video samples of what the 250 model can do and picture quality is very good.

Some things I liked about the Hauppauge is that you can select the exact bitrate you want to use. Most of the good stand alone DVD recorders work the same way mind you but some are limited to 1 hour mode, 2 hours mode etc. so something that is 2 hours 10 minutes must be recorded in a 3 hours mode and some don't even have that ... some skip from a 2 hour mode to a 4 hour mode! ... so if you get a stand alone DVD recorder be sure it has a way to allow you to select the bitrate. They do this with TIME settings. For instance my Pioneer stand alone DVD recorder has "modes" for the minutes you want and they go in 5 to 10 minute increments. There is a 90 minute mode, 95 minute mode, 100 minute mode etc. and the good stand alone DVD recorders are like that. JVC allows for something similiar as do Panasonic models. It seems the favorite amoung stand alone DVD recorders would be JVC and Pioneer and lastly Panasonic.

The one BIG benefit of the Hauppauge is that you can capture MPEG-2 up to 15,000kbps and this is good if you want a "master" capture that you intend to then re-encode using CCE VBR but if the bitrate is high enough you can also just record direct to the bitrate you want and get acceptable results. However some sources can and will benefit from software filters so the ability to capture at 15,000kbps and then re-encode is nice. I know some SONY and PIONEER models have a similiar feature though when it comes to stand alone DVD recorders. It can capture at 15,000bksp then you edit (if need be) then it will re-encode to fit on a DVD-R disc. However you still don't get the control and true multi-pass VBR that you can get on a computer, including specialized filters.

In fact for "hard" sources that need special filtering you can't beat doing a computer capture HOWEVER the Hauppauge tend to be very bad at capturing a "poor" video signal UNLESS you use a Full Frame TBC device (which are about $200 to $300) so keep this in mind. Stand alone DVD recorders (most anyways) have a built-in Line TBC and while this works differently (and often times less good) than a Full Frame TBC it is still better than nothing.

Both offer easy ways to schedule programming but one thing that I found ... it is much nicer recording to the stand alone DVD recorder than always having your computer "tied up" recording. This is especially important if you are recording a lot of TV programs. It is just easier to do it on a stand alone DVD recorder but you really need to get a model with a built-in HDD to get the kind of functionality that you can with a computer. I would not buy a stand alone DVD recorder that didn't come with a HDD built-in. The HDD allows you to record multiple programs while away (without needing to change discs) and you can even do some editing etc.

To me it boiled down to this ... when recording alot of stuff from cable or satellite TV ... stuff in good to excellent quality ... it makes sense to go with a stand alone DVD recorder that has a built-in HDD. For many VHS to DVD conversions this will also give very good quality. However for some VHS to DVD projects and for special cases you can't beat the computer method.

Another thing about the Hauppauge products ... they capture to MP2 audio only whereas stand alone DVD recorders capture to LPCM WAV (in 1 hour mode) or AC-3 in other modes. So with the Hauppauge I would capture MP2 at the highest quality possible (384kbps) then convert to LPCM WAV then convert to AC-3. That takes time however you do have the ability to "play" with the audio i.e., add filters to reduce noise from non Hi-Fi Stereo VHS tapes and/or normalize the audio.

When I was looking for a new capture card I not only tested the Hauppauge WinTV PVR 150 but also the ADS Instant DVD 2.0 and no one ever wants to listen to me on this it seems but the quality of the ADS Instant DVD 2.0 (an external USB 2.0 hardware MPEG-2 encoder) was most excellent. The only "bad" thing abuot it is that you are extremely limited when it comes to scheduling options if you intend to use it for TV recording. However ADS does make the ADS Instant TV Deluxe USB which is another external USB 2.0 hardware encoder with the same exact "guts" as the Instant DVD 2.0 but it also has a TV tuner type input, comes with a cable box and satellite box remote control ... and can work with BeyondTV thus eliminating the TV scheduling problem. The ADS Instant DVD 2.0 also seemed to capture VHS with better quality than the Hauppague when it came to less-than-steller quality VHS tapes.

Again the two ADS products I mentioned above really only do MP2 audio but ADS is comming out with a new product to replace the Instant DVD 2.0 (originally called Instant DVD 3.0 but now called the Instant DVD + MP3) as it can also do audio only in MP3 format for those that want to archive audio in that format. The big deal about the Instant DVD + MP3 is it will also do AC-3 audio recording just like a stand alone DVD recorder. Unfortunately this is not out just yet (but will be very soon). Only weak point is I don't it has the BeyondTV functionality of the Instant TV Deluxe USB.

So in essence the better the quality of the source the stand alone DVD recorder method is most excellent but the worseer the quality of the source then the computer method may well be better. There is aso the time factor involved as well to consider and the difference in sound formats not to mention the possible need of a Full Frame TBC for computer use but not for stand alone DVD recorder use ... although a Full Frame TBC is almost always a good idea for less-than-steller quality video, such as VHS video.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Here is some info on the ADS Instant DVD + MP3 which I very well might get myself for "poor" quality VHS tapes etc. since I can capture 15,000kbps video and then re-encode with CCE VBR.
http://www.usb-ware.com/ads-instant-dvd-plus-mp3.htm

[trhouse]

Having started with the capture card method, here are some differences found.

Recorder Pros:

1. Fast and easy to learn
2. Recorders typically have some form or forms of input processing absent from many capture cards.
3. Time savings in performing common tasks like edits, menus, etc.

Recorder Cons:

1. I could easily adjust color, contrast, etc with my capture software but with the recorder a hardware video corrector is needed. The Pioneer 531 can do a little but it is usually not enough.
2. A computer can for about $40 be updated with a X16, dual or double layer drive but not a recorder.
3. Limited media compatibility. Recorders are often limited in the types media to which they can write like either -r/rw or +r/rw.

Computer Pros:

1. Tremendous flexiblity with lots of software, drive, and media choices.
2. A system can be tailor made for specific needs.
3. It offers the ability to control specific processes in creating a dvd such as two pass vbr or adding second language sound track.

Computer Cons:

1. This is a far more time consuming method.
2. Exercising control over many processes requires learning a lot so the learning curve is steep.
3. Software bugs. I cannot begin to describe the amount of time that can be spent testing and debugging software.

Here is a recent experience to illustrate these points. Some video was transferred to a dvd-r. The recorders limitation is that it will not high speed dub a dvd back to the hard drive for editing but will re-encode it. The computer was used to avoid this. After loading the disk on the computer, the software says "failed, unknown error". Using other software the job eventually got done but it could have been done on the recorder much faster.

[junkmalle]

it is much nicer recording to the stand alone DVD recorder than always having your computer "tied up" recording. This is especially important if you are recording a lot of TV programs.

One little note about the Hauppauge PVR series: you can disable the display while recording with WinTV2000 (you'll just see a black window where you would normally see the picture and you won't hear the sound). This reduces the CPU usage to nearly nothing. You can continue to use your computer without fear of messing up your recording.

[piano632]

I've used both the Hauppauge PVR-250 and JVC DVD recorder and find that image quality is pretty close between the two. But I'd choose the JVC because it has input noise filtering and AC3 audio. Other brands of recorders aren't quite as good as JVC though.

[junkmalle]

I've used both the Hauppauge PVR-250 and JVC DVD recorder and find that image quality is pretty close between the two. But I'd choose the JVC because it has input noise filtering and AC3 audio.

The Hauppauge PVR cards have spacial and temporal noise filtering too. They require the use of (free) third party tweeking software though.