MPEG2 DVD stream video into VCD ??

[plomon]

Using TMPGenc DVD Author, I ripped a DVD and got an mpg file. This file is in mpeg2(dvd) format. Now, i want to convert this mpeg2(dvd) stream file into mpeg1 or mpeg2 vcd stream. in other words, i want to create a vcd from the ripped mpg file(mpeg2 format), without any loss of quality. pls suggest a method.


I tried a few methods like converting the mpeg2(dvd) file into mpeg1(vcd) using blaze media pro, using TMPGenc Plus etc. But, all the methods turned out to be waste. None of them came out with the exact copy of the original - they either lack quality, or loose audio sometimes and so on.


I even burnt an image using Nero to check how does a vcd look like when made from an mpeg2(dvd) file. It's looking dirty - absolutely quality less. So, anyone, pls tell me how to make a vcd out of the mpg file that i got using TMPGenc DVD Author.

[Abond]

Well, this is not possible.
You can make XVCD, not standard vcd, there are chances it will not play properly. Convert the audio to mp2 128 kbps and multiplex with original video as non-standart VCD in TMPGEnc mpeg tools.

[plomon]

Well, this is not possible.
You can make XVCD, not standard vcd, there are chances it will not play properly. Convert the audio to mp2 128 kbps and multiplex with original video as non-standart VCD in TMPGEnc mpeg tools.

u mean to say, using TMPGenc Plus - MPEG Tools, I should demultiplex the mpeg2(dvd) file first into video and audio, then convert the audio into mp2(128kbps) and then again multiplex this audio with the original video file(i.e., mpeg2 dvd stream file) in the non-standard vcd mode. If i do so, can i get the exact copy of the original file without any loss of quality, size and compression ?

[Abond]

If i do so, can i get the exact copy of the original file without any loss of quality, size and compression ?

Try and see. Of course your audio is changed - AC3 for sure will not work. But the video should be the same. Now if you have a garbage at playback - as I said there are good chances it will not play properly.
You can encode the audio also with higher bitrate, but the procedure is the same.

[plomon]

can u tell me the software for converting ac3 audio into mp2.

[Abond]

BeSweet with BesweetGUI

[plomon]

I took a small clip(using MPEG2VCR) from the bigger MPEG2(DVD) file that I got from TMPGenc DVD Author, demuxed it into m2v and ac3 files, converted the ac3 into mp2 audio, again multiplexed it back using TMPGenc's MPEG Tools in the MPEG1 VCD(non-standard) mode.

The file I got has excellent, infact the exact original quality. So, u'r idea worked till there.

But, now comes the actual problem. My purpose is to create a VCD from the file. I again made an image file with the above obtained mpeg1(non standard vcd) file and checked it using the Nero Image Drive. The troublemaker is back again. The video again fails to give the quality, as well as the audio ofcourse.

Now, tell me one thing, demultiplexing the file and again multiplexing it back --> has it got any advantage in making a VCD. Moreover, why did you insist on multiplexing the files in non-standard VCD mode. Does it have any use - like can I use any other burning software(other than Nero) which unlike Nero doesn't encode this obtained file just before the burning process, coz Nero is encoding every video(atleast this video) before burning.

I mean to ask - Is there any burning software which can burn a VCD using this non-standard mpeg1(vcd) file along with the quality retaining factor, and without further encoding before burning.

[Abond]

I mean to ask - Is there any burning software which can burn a VCD using this non-standard mpeg1(vcd) file along with the quality retaining factor, and without further encoding before burning.

VCDEasy with CDRDao. CDRDao is the burning engine integrated in VCDEasy.

Now, tell me one thing, demultiplexing the file and again multiplexing it back --> has it got any advantage in making a VCD. Moreover, why did you insist on multiplexing the files in non-standard VCD mode

The files must be multiplexed as VCD - the multiplexing is different for DVD. And again TMPG will rewrite headers, therefore other applications will recognise the mpeg as mpeg1.
Non-standard - well VCD standard is mpeg1 video with 352x240/288 pixels resolution CBR 1150 kbps encoded with 224 mp2 audio. You have mpeg2 video VBR 720x480/576 pixels resolution encoded with 128 kbps audio. Obviously it is non-standard . Try if you want to multiplex it as standard VCD in TMPG and see what will happen .
Another option might be to use SVCD multiplexing - it is the same as VCD, but can contain mpeg2 video VBR at least.

[plomon]

But, CDRDao doesn't belong to Windows platform i think. Does it?

So, after going through this entire process, what i got is again an mpeg2 video.

Moreover, would you like to conclude by saying that there's no way a VCD can be made out of an mpeg2 video with lossless quality.

If u'r answer is yes, then I guess all my efforts to make a VCD from a DVD(against the conventional methods of converting into AVI etc) will go futile, and again I've to resort to other methods of encoding, like DVDX, AutoGK, EasyVCD etc softwares provide.

But, u know sth, I got fed up of all these softwares which take 4hrs. - 10hrs to encode the DVD rips and later we get another lossy quality VCD. That's the reason, I tried out this new method using TMPGenc DVD author.

Anyways, if you have any kind of idea, pls suggest to me as quickly as possible.

[Noahtuck]

If you are trying to make a standard mpeg1 compliant VCD you are not ever going to keep the same quality as the original dvd.

[lantern]

If you still have the original DVD, you could always use something like Easy VCD. This is basically an all-in-one frontend for several programs that will allow you to create a vcd or xvcd (svcd and xsvcd require a registered copy of Tmpgenc).

[TBoneit]

And since VCD resolution is 352 by 240 NTSC or 352 by 288 PAL @1150 bitrate there is no way to keep 720 by 480 NTSC or PAL Quality . Why not just make a DVD? If you opened it in DVD AUthor it sounds like you already have a DVD burner. It happens to be that My cost per DVD blank is about the same as a CD-R blank costs these days.

Think about it logically, if a VCD could be DVD quality we'd all be watching VCDs not DVDs.

Good Luck

[plomon]

If you are trying to make a standard mpeg1 compliant VCD you are not ever going to keep the same quality as the original dvd.

Think about it logically, if a VCD could be DVD quality we'd all be watching VCDs not DVDs.

I don't think, this is fully true, b'coz, previously, i made a VCD which has almost 90% quality of a DVD. I first encoded the DVD rip into two AVI files using AutoGK(This process takes 5-10 hrs. depending on several factors).

Now, I converted these AVI files into MPEG1(standard) using Blaze Media Pro. Believe me or not, but this converted video has 100% quality as the AVI file, infact an exact copy of the encoded AVI file.

(Remember this quality cannot be obtained if the AVI file is directly used in TMPGenc Plus wizard to make a VCD compliant MPEG1 file. So, as a matter of fact, there's no surprise in saying that, at this stage, Blaze Media Pro did the magic.)

Now, I opened TMPGenc Plus wizard and made a VCD compliant MPEG1 file using the MPEG1 standard file(obtained through Blaze Media Pro). Now, at this point the quality becomes a bit less.

However, unless and until you are unbelievably meticulous in catching mistakes, the difference in quality couldn't be noticed at all.

I know that, in this entire process, the extremely time-consuming step is to encode the DVD rips into AVI. It takes 5-10 hrs. of time. Now, this's the reason why I used TMPGenc DVD Author to directly rip the MPEG2 video from the DVD.

However, as many of you guys say, I guess MPEG2 to MPEG1(standard or non-standard or VCD) conversion without losing quality is impossible, unlike the AVI to MPEG1(standard) conversion using Blaze Media Pro and then into MPEG1(VCD) using TMPGenc Plus which ensures better quality.
But, if anyone of you feel it can be done in some way or the other, and you have any good ideas, pls suggest them to me.

If you still have the original DVD, you could always use something like Easy VCD.

I know about EazyVCD. And there are many other softwares too, for converting DVD to VCD,SVCD and XVCD(like DVD2SVCD, AutoGK etc). But, knowing the fact that all these take a hell lot of time to rip and encode the DVD(they use 2-pass and sometimes 3-pass methods), I resorted to the MPEG2(DVD) video extraction using TMPGenc DVD Author. I hope you understood the entire situation, and now, if possible pls suggest me a method of making an original quality VCD from the MPEG2(DVD) video.

[Noahtuck]

If you are trying to make a standard mpeg1 compliant VCD you are not ever going to keep the same quality as the original dvd.

Ya left out some of what he wrote......

And since VCD resolution is 352 by 240 NTSC or 352 by 288 PAL @1150 bitrate there is no way to keep 720 by 480 NTSC or PAL Quality . Why not just make a DVD? If you opened it in DVD AUthor it sounds like you already have a DVD burner. It happens to be that My cost per DVD blank is about the same as a CD-R blank costs these days.

Think about it logically, if a VCD could be DVD quality we'd all be watching VCDs not DVDs.

Good Luck

Pretty much sums it up... if you want a COMPLIANT vcd in the VCD specs. you can not have DVD resolution... you can get close with a svcd... but still below dvd specs.

I have also encoded vcd's that were far superior to any manufactured vcd i own and they looked damn good!!! but still NOT dvd quality.....

And if someone can't tell the diff. they either need glasses or way better equipment to view it on 8)

However, unless and until you are unbelievably meticulous in catching mistakes, the difference in quality couldn't be noticed at all.

That would be the wife, the GF, a few friends... i would spot it in a second

[Abond]

But, CDRDao doesn't belong to Windows platform i think. Does it?

It works in windows so far, so I don't care. VCDEasy comes with CDRDao.

So, after going through this entire process, what i got is again an mpeg2 video.

The process I described should give you VCD. Of course the elementary video file is still mpeg2. Maybe it is not bad idea to describe your process and how you come to mpeg2 video at the end.

Moreover, would you like to conclude by saying that there's no way a VCD can be made out of an mpeg2 video with lossless quality.

VCD - yes, XVCD - you see it already. Lossless - I don't know what you realy mean: exactly like the source or with acceptable quality.

If u'r answer is yes, then I guess all my efforts to make a VCD from a DVD(against the conventional methods of converting into AVI etc) will go futile, and again I've to resort to other methods of encoding, like DVDX, AutoGK, EasyVCD etc softwares provide.

Somehow this say me that you want to watch it on computer (because converting DVD to VCD is also quite conventional). So stick with avi's you don't need VCD at all.

But, u know sth, I got fed up of all these softwares which take 4hrs. - 10hrs to encode the DVD rips and later we get another lossy quality VCD.

Agree.

I don't think, this is fully true, b'coz, previously, i made a VCD which has almost 90% quality of a DVD. I first encoded the DVD rip into two AVI files using AutoGK(This process takes 5-10 hrs. depending on several factors).

The logic and the procedure is absolutely false. In fact you loose the quality two times.

Now, I converted these AVI files into MPEG1(standard) using Blaze Media Pro. Believe me or not, but this converted video has 100% quality as the AVI file, infact an exact copy of the encoded AVI file.

You are completely wrong. Probably the mpeg1 obtained from blaze is far from VCD mpeg1

(Remember this quality cannot be obtained if the AVI file is directly used in TMPGenc Plus wizard to make a VCD compliant MPEG1 file. So, as a matter of fact, there's no surprise in saying that, at this stage, Blaze Media Pro did the magic.)

With the wizard - yes. Then I never use the wizard in TMPG. And I repeat again - the mpeg1 produced by blaze is not vcd mpeg1.

Now, I opened TMPGenc Plus wizard and made a VCD compliant MPEG1 file using the MPEG1 standard file(obtained through Blaze Media Pro). Now, at this point the quality becomes a bit less.

No wonder, using the wizard you ASK TMPG to re-encode the files. In this step you should use simple multiplex from Mpeg Tools.

However, as many of you guys say, I guess MPEG2 to MPEG1(standard or non-standard or VCD) conversion without losing quality is impossible, unlike the AVI to MPEG1(standard) conversion using Blaze Media Pro and then into MPEG1(VCD) using TMPGenc Plus which ensures better quality.

AVI to MPEG1 (1150 CBR 352x240/288) is as loosy as mpeg2 to MPEG1 (1150 CBR 352x240/288) and it is not software dependent.

But, if anyone of you feel it can be done in some way or the other, and you have any good ideas, pls suggest them to me.

If you watch the movies on computer stay with avi's. If you want to watch on settop DVD Player use DVD's or SVCD's. If you insist to make VCD (for unknown reason) use TMPG with mpeg1 VBR average 1150 (non-standard VCD). Don't use the damned wizard. The last, but not the least learn Avisynth.

[plomon]

If you insist to make VCD (for unknown reason) use TMPG with mpeg1 VBR average 1150 (non-standard VCD).

Keeping all other factors you discussed in the above Reply aside, since all my efforts are to convert an MPEG2 file into MPEG1(VCD), I tried out a few methods of which one of them has been suggested by you(quoted above).

Before proceeding to the description of the procedure that I followed to create an MPEG1(vcd) file, let me tell one thing, that, unfortunately, I wasn't able to get the original quality.(by quality i mean to talk about the sharpness, color, blur, resolution and audio clarity)

Coming to the method suggested by you, when I attempted it, these are the step-by-step incidents which happened in the process:

1.) Initially I've an MPEG2 video, ripped from DVD using TMPGenc DVD Author.
2.) Now, I demultiplex this video into .m2v and .ac3 files for video and audio resp.
3.) Then, I convert the ac3 audio into mp2 audio with a bitrate of 128kbps.
4.) Taking these .m2v and .mp2 files as video and audio inputs, I create an MPEG1(non-standard VCD) file using the MPEG Tools of TMPGenc Plus(not wizard).

Now, at this point I was very excited that what I got is an MPEG1(VCD) file and I could burn it using VCDEasy.

Unfortunately, when I opened VCDEasy, and started adding this multiplexed file, it popped out a window saying that MPEG2 files cannot be added, and to make a VCD an MPEG1 file is required. It also suggested to use TMPGenc for this purpose. However, it was already clear that the TMPGenc's "Simple Mutliplex" option simply gave me back the original MPEG2 video, this time with an MP2 audio.

Not only that, but also another point that I noticed is --> When I multiplex(.m2v and .mp2 files) in any one of the follwoing MPEG1 modes in the MPEG Tools of TMPGenc Plus i.e.,

1) MPEG1 System(Automatic)
2) MPEG1 System(VBR)
3) MPEG1 Video-CD
4) MPEG1 Video-CD(non-standard)

what I get is again the same MPEG2 file.

Why this happened, even I don't know. But it happened, that much I know.

For further confirmation, I even opened this newly multiplexed file with AVIDemux which clearly popped out a window saying that the file is in MPEG2 format and the audio is MP2 format.

After practising similar methods(not exactly the same) with a combination of a few softwares like AVIDemux, Blaze Media Pro & MPEG2VCR, all I came to know is that it's better to convert any MPEG2 video into AVI, and then keep quiet, coz further conversion will do no good at all, no matter whatever software is used. So, the TMPGenc methods of AVI to MPEG1(VCD) using wizard or without using wizard etc... are also of no good to server the purpose.

Anyways, currently I've a new problem. Pls check out the following situation, and suggest a solution if possible:

After getting MPEG2 video from DVD, I cut certain favourite scenes from it using MPEG2VCR call the cut scene file - call this file clip1. I cut certain other scenes from main MPEG2 file, and like clip1, I created clip2 clip3 so on upto clip5. So, now I have totally 5 MPEG2 video clips named as clip1 to clip5. Then I joined all these using MPEG2VCR again to form a final MPEG2 video - call it final1.mpg(containing all fav. scenes). Now, I opened AutoGK - gave final1.mpg as mpg input and created final1.avi file.

Like final1.avi, previously final0.avi was created using another set of fav. scenes(whose final file is final0.mpg - an MPEG2 video again). Now, in order to join final0.avi and final1.avi, I used a software called as AVI Joiner, and this is what it showed:



Before you guys think anything, let me tell you that, both the avi files are created with autogk using mp3 vbr mode only, and the final0.mpg and final1.mpg files are not subjected to any further demultiplexing. Also, upto the creation of final0.avi and final1.avi no problem was encountered, and both the videos are playing absolutely fine.

[Abond]

The reason for this I think is the vbr mp3. Make it cbr mp3.
Which version of VCDEasy? I have 1.1.4 and it makes vcds with mpeg2 simply flawlessly. If you are using some very new version I am not surprised - they claim it has better compatability authoring engine (or something like that) - so it recognises mpeg2 under mpeg1 headers.

[plomon]

The reason for this I think is the vbr mp3. Make it cbr mp3.
Which version of VCDEasy? I have 1.1.4 and it makes vcds with mpeg2 simply flawlessly. If you are using some very new version I am not surprised - they claim it has better compatability authoring engine (or something like that) - so it recognises mpeg2 under mpeg1 headers.

my version is 3.0.2. This is how it appears after adding an mpeg2 video(multiplexed as told by you):

[Abond]

Aha, exactly what I thought. Then use 1.1.4 or 1.1.5 - the last you can download from this site.

[plomon]

Aha, exactly what I thought. Then use 1.1.4 or 1.1.5 - the last you can download from this site.

where can i download v1.1.4....the original website doesn't provide this version, as only the latest version is made available in the site i.e., v3.0.2...can u help me in any way - like posting the setup file on rapidshare or sending a mail to me.

[Abond]

As I said 1.1.5 you can download from this site where we are.
https://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=VCDEasy

[Nelson37]

First, get a handle on What Is A VCD and What Is A Mpeg1 file, they are completely different. One is limited and one is not. One will likely play in a standalone and one will not.

M2V file will be Mpeg2 video. M1V file will be Mpeg1 video.

A true VCD will look nowhere as good as a DVD except on a small screen.

A modified VCD will approach DVD quality as filesize approaches DVD size. Also will get less likely to play and less useful.

50% size reduction is usually considered too much for Shrink users.

Suspect early in your process you are making an Xvid or Divx. This is only real way to approach 1 movie per CD and even then 2 is more common. Need compatible player for these codecs. The major smoothing inherent in these codecs will allow re-encoding to a small MPEG which closely resembles the Divx (or Xvid) AVI, but is VERY different from the original DVD.

If you think you have made a VCD with 90% of DVD quality, this is extremely unlikely, if not downright impossible.

[plomon]

As I said 1.1.5 you can download from this site where we are.
https://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=VCDEasy

I did as u told...downloaded the VCDEasy v1.1.5 from the above link. Now I opened the same file with this to find this:



If you can infer anything important from the above picture, then tell me what's the next alternative ??

[Cornucopia]

Ok, here we go...

#1--You CAN create an MPEG1 System stream which contains M2V and MP2 (or even MP3) files. I have successfully done this on a number of occasions. Yes, with TMPGEnc. You have to use Multiplex, not Simple Multiplex. You also have to add your M2V and MP2 BEFORE selecting the Stream type--VERY IMPORTANT, because TMPGEnc will switch back if it recognizes an M2V stream being added in after. (You can verify this with Manzanita's MPEG ID app)

#2--There is ONE and ONLY 1 way where (to spec) VCD or SVCD quality equals DVD quality, and that is Still Pictures/Menus. EVERYTHING else will never be as good, even with limited color use or no motion. There's resolution and there's bits-per-pixel and DVD outshines in both. Audio--to some extent--is in the same boat. I can tell the difference--drunk, any day of the week, with both hands tied behind my back!

#3--Using great source material (e.g. Better than DVD quality), you can get GREAT looking VCD output, provided you decode, resize, and frameserve correctly, and provided you tweak TMPGEnc. I have dozens of shows I've done as examples. But you have to remember that DVD MPEG2 is ALREADY compressed alot, and you're adding more compression on top of that--any way you go, and using any software available out there. Still, never rely on defaults/wizards if you want the best quality. And I don't put much stock in Blaze.

#4--There is no use going to AVI if you ultimately want it on VCD. You could do Uncompressed AVI or HuffYUV/otherLossless compression if you had to have an intermediate file, but you can just as easily load up the MPEG2 in VDubMod and frameserve that directly into TMPGEnc. And any other type of AVI is just adding to your compression woes.

#5--But do you need to go to VCD? As has been said, why not DVD? Why not AVI/Divx and keep on computer? What's your ultimate goal here?

#6--There is a setting in VCDEasy that allows you to turn off some of the compliance/error checking. That might help you. Also, try it again after having corrected your multiplexing, re: #1 above.

Scott

[plomon]

I have a lot of queries:

Query1:

You also have to add your M2V and MP2 BEFORE selecting the Stream type--VERY IMPORTANT, because TMPGEnc will switch back if it recognizes an M2V stream being added in after.

You've caught the mistake made by me man. I did the same mistake. But, now I rectified it. All this time I changed the stream before adding. Now, I changed it after adding the files.

But, the story doesn't end there. Situations have become more and more complex now. I request Abond to read this too :

I added the .m2v and .mp2 files to the Multiplex option of MPEG Tools in TMPGenc Plus.
I changed the stream/mode to MPEG1(non-standard) VCD
(Now, this is a combination of both Cornucopia and Abond's ideas)
The multiplexed file is ready.

Now, comes the shocking part. I played the video, and noticed to my surprise that the audio is playing but the video is lost - i couldn't see any video frames at all. The screen is blank and black, but the audio is running.

The same thing is happening when I multiplexed m2v and mp2 files in any one of the modes present in the Multiplex or Simple Multiplex option of MPEG Tools in TMPGenc Plus. The modes I tried are:

1.) MPEG-1 System(automatic)
2.) MPEG-1 System(VBR)
3.) MPEG-1 Video-CD(non-standard)

In all the above modes, when I multiplexed the m2v and mp2(in the same order as told by Cornucopia), I got the respective MPEG1 stream videos, but when played are showing up blank & black screens with only the audio present.

Now, you guys must be having a doubt whether I really got the MPEG1 stream or I got the MPEG2 stream again. For this purpose I used Abond's idea of testing with VCDEasy v1.1.5. Take a look at the screenshot:



So, VCDEasy is accpeting an MPEG1 file, but, with a warning message. Hence, the doubt of whether I got an MPEG1 or MPEG2 file after multiplexing is clarified now. So, that's it, now forget about the warning message etc, coz that's not the topic of interest here. We'll discuss it after solving the current problem.

(Remember VCDEasy accepts MPEG1 files ONLY when the VideoCD type option is changed to VCD 1.1 - this is very important - Abond, for you especially, coz if VCD 2.0 is left, then the same old message appears saying that it wouldn't accept MPEG2 files)

So, now anyone of you two guys tell me where did I go wrong and why am I not getting the picture but getting the audio only.


Query2:

#2--There is ONE and ONLY 1 way where (to spec) VCD or SVCD quality equals DVD quality, and that is Still Pictures/Menus.

I didn't understand what does that mean. Pls explain to me more elaborately.

Query3:

#3--Using great source material (e.g. Better than DVD quality), you can get GREAT looking VCD output, provided you decode, resize, and frameserve correctly, and provided you tweak TMPGEnc.

All I have is a DVD. That's it.

Firstly, what do you mean by this great source material.
Secondly, pls explain more clearly man - what do u mean by saying decode, resize and frameserve correctly. Pls explain the procedure you follow to decode, resize and frameserve.
Thirdly, I don't know anthing about frameserving. If you can, take some time and explain it to me.
Fourthly, what do u mean by tweaking TMPGenc

#5--But do you need to go to VCD? As has been said, why not DVD? Why not AVI/Divx and keep on computer? What's your ultimate goal here?

By now, you should know the answer, all I want is a VCD with acceptable quality, infact almost equal to the DVD quality if possible. Moreover, you yourself mentioned that there is ONE and ONLY1 way. So, as asked before pls elaborate on that point.[/b]

[Abond]

Well, here:
http://www.soft-ware.net/multimedia/video/dvd/download.asp?code=cfbcg&pro=p02867&js=tr...etscape&vers=5
Sorry, the page is German.

[plomon]

Well, here:
http://www.soft-ware.net/multimedia/video/dvd/download.asp?code=cfbcg&pro=p02867&js=tr...etscape&vers=5
Sorry, the page is German.

I already told you that I've v1.1.5. It's time to go forward towards solving some new problems I guess. Pls read my previous post and suggest any solution if possible.

[Abond]

Listen, with 1.1.4 I have no problems. 1.1.5 I didn't even see, but I read that it is roughly the same. Take in mind that I never installed any newer version - than I don't know if they come with something new that can screw older versions if they co-exist.

[plomon]

Mr. Abond, pls do me a favour - Read my previous post, and then talk. Read the post where I wrote about three different queries.

I'm not asking you to solve the problem, but, just read it once to know that I came up with a new theory about VCDEasy, and explained that specially for you.

So, once again I say, pls read my previous post, and then reply.

[plomon]

There is no use going to AVI if you ultimately want it on VCD......you can just as easily load up the MPEG2 in VDubMod and frameserve that directly into TMPGEnc.

Pls explain this method in more detail. I feel it would help me in a better way.