Tv Tuner Questions noob?

[thedown90]

Couple of questions about this. First what is a good TV Tuner Capture Card? I want one without spending alot of money. Also a program to convert or compress files after capturing them? I have heard alot of bad things about compression programs, ruining quality and such. So any good program that doesnt take away from the quality. Now as of right now i have satelite express vu canadian satelite. I want to know if there is a card specially for satelites, or a tuner that works good with satelites.
Thanks for helping me out.

[redwudz]

ATI All In Wonder Radeon is about $50 US. That's a AGP card. For PCI, maybe a AVerMedia AverTV Studio; about the same price.

You get what you pay for, though. If you are looking for quality at a low price, capture to AVI, maybe Huffy or PicVideo.

Then using a stand alone encoder like TMPGEnc, convert to MPEG-2.

For satellites, it depends on the output of the converter. Some are already MPEG. What is the final destination of your video; DVD?

IMO, there are two ways to quality; spend a lot of money on cards or devices or spend a lot of time in conversion. Time is the better investment if you are short on funds.

BTW, you can search the 'Capture Cards' to the left with about any combination of wanted features. There are owner recommendations there, also.

[mats.hogberg]

If your end product is a DVD, I recommend Hauppage 250/350 cards. They capture to a format that can be authored directly to VCD/SVCD/DVD without further processing, and doesn't take all your computer resources (none, in fact) in demand while capturing.

/Mats

[thedown90]

Well i want everything i capture to go to .avi. I will make a DVD later on with more shows. On an average for half hour show how large is the avi. I have been hearing HUGE file sizes. I want quality w/o the funds, ill take a look at the cards. Thanks let me know of any other info

[mike909]

I too am on the verge of buying a capture card, and want the capability of capturing to avi. I also want the ability to do hardware encoding to mpeg2 if I choose....this is where I'm stuck. Only card that will capture and encode to mpeg2(in hardware) yet still be able to allow me to capture to less compressed format .avi is the new ati tv wonder Elite ( I think). I'm still not actually sure that it allows both, but trying to figure that out. I also heard the software it comes with is crap, so was hoping someone who had it could tell me how it works with 3rd party software (like beyondTV). I asked for comments on the card but recieved no responses...maybe it's too new.

[thedown90]

Also to add to mine All in wonder is out due to the fact i have a GC already.

[mike909]

I also have a GC allready so don't want an AIW. This brought me to look into the TV Wonder VE. Far as I can tell, it's similiar to the older AIW cards, except without the GC. Can find them on ebay for about 20$. I was gonna go that route for experimentation, but now I'm gonna hold out to see if the Tv Wonder Elite is the answer to my 'want best of both worlds (avi & hardwre-mepg2)' needs.

[junkmalle]

Well i want everything i capture to go to .avi. I will make a DVD later on with more shows. On an average for half hour show how large is the avi. I have been hearing HUGE file sizes. I want quality w/o the funds, ill take a look at the cards. Thanks let me know of any other info

AVI is a container, a box you put things (usually video and audio) in. The video and audio in an AVI file can be uncompressed or compressed with any number of compression schemes (codecs).

Here are some rough file sizes for full 720x480, 30 fps captures:

uncompressed RGB: 112 GB/hr
uncompressed YUY2 (most raw capture cards): 75 GB/hr
losslessly compressed YUY2 (huffyuv): 20 to 40 GB/hr
DV (digital camcorder): 13 GB/hr
MPEG2 (for DVD): 2 to 4 GB/hr
Divx/Xvid/MPEG4: 1 to 2 GB/hr

Lossy compression schemes like MPEG, Divx and Xvid can deliver different file sizes depending on the source (still scenes compress better than action scenes) and how much image quality you care to loose.

[thedown90]

I have been looking at tv tuners on here and saw this one Hauppauge WinTV GO . Can anyone tell me there opinion on whether this is a good one or not? Can i do avi with this or not? and with those compression numbers, how do you make them smaller with good quality? Also how do you do the audio? im not sure how you record audio. Last question i promise!! Will this allow me to watch TV on my PC while piddiling around? if not what would be a good one that will suit all my needs Thanks for everyones help

[mike909]

which one are you speaking of?

[thedown90]

https://www.videohelp.com/capturecards.php?CaptureCardRead=9#comments

this one was in the reviews

[mike909]

Does not do hardware mpeg2 encoding, which is not a requirement for you, but eliminates it for me. Your options are open, and this seems as good a solution as any...if you don't care about mono audio that is.

[thedown90]

prefer stereo or better i will be recording from satelite so..... im open to any suggestions.

Any opinions on these 2?

Hauppauge WinTV PVR-150
Hauppauge WinTV PVR-150MCE

[mike909]

Well i want everything i capture to go to .avi.

Both those are hardware mpeg2 encoder cards 'only'. My research tells me that it is impossible to capture to avi with these. For more info on them look here http://www.hauppauge.com/pages/compare_pvr.html

[junkmalle]

Amazon has the WinTV Go for $15.

[edDV]

I also have a GC allready so don't want an AIW. This brought me to look into the TV Wonder VE. Far as I can tell, it's similiar to the older AIW cards, except without the GC. Can find them on ebay for about 20$. I was gonna go that route for experimentation, but now I'm gonna hold out to see if the Tv Wonder Elite is the answer to my 'want best of both worlds (avi & hardwre-mepg2)' needs.

With the exception of the HD wonder and possibly the Elite, the ATI TV wonder line does not have any hardware MPeg assist. That is only in the AIW cards and is only an assist. There is still significant CPU activity with AIW MPeg2 encoding. Cards like the PVR-250 are self contained MPeg2 encoders. The only CPU activity is for preview.

Couple of questions about this. First what is a good TV Tuner Capture Card? I want one without spending alot of money. Also a program to convert or compress files after capturing them? I have heard alot of bad things about compression programs, ruining quality and such. So any good program that doesnt take away from the quality. Now as of right now i have satelite express vu canadian satelite. I want to know if there is a card specially for satelites, or a tuner that works good with satelites.
Thanks for helping me out.

For satt receiver you normally record directly off your tuner box in S-Video/audio. The tuner section of the card is unused unless you also connect a OTA antenna.

Some specific tuners are available for direct tuning some satt channels. Consider this an advanced topic and Google + DTV forum files are available to get you started.

[edDV]

If you get a MPeg PVR-150/250 plus a direct capture WinTV then you can have both options. I doubt you will use the WinTV much after you produce your first 5-12 hour (time consumed) DVD.

[mike909]

Ed, Thanks for chiming in here...you seem to be very knowledgable on the topic. I am sure you are rite about the PVR 150, I would love it for tv capturing and it would do me just fine...however I would need the WinTV option for capturing stuff I want to edit (i.e. vhs wedding videos). If I can't figure out the tv wonder elite, I will likely go this route, but wouldn't it be nice to have the capability on one card? If you have a minute take a look at this: post # 1182. http://forums.hexus.net/showthread.php?p=437626&highlight=avi#post437626
I just need to make sure this applies to all cards with the theatre 550 pro chip.

[edDV]

As far as I know, there is no one card.

The ATI AIW comes closest I suppose. It can capture YUV uncompressed or with HuffYUV and can encode MPeg2 with a combination of hardware and CPU.
(see http://digitalfaq.com/dvdguides/capture/atimpeg/atimpeg.htm )

With Hauppauge it takes two cards, but you get a true hardware encode with their PVR.

The third way to go is to analog capture to DV format with a device like the Canopus ADVC* and later edit in DV format. You can also realtime encode. Using a fast computer (>2.4GHz) and Mainconcept's software MPeg2 encoder ( I've have best results with ULead Video Studio's version) you can realtime MPeg2 encode to 8Mbps CBR or 7Mbps average VBR. More compression takes a faster CPU.

Three ways to skin the cat.

*or DV camcorder pass through

[junkmalle]

ATI TV Wonder Elite info:

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1307430#1307430

[winifreid]

Both of you shoppers have fast computers, so unless you plan on multitasking while you capture, there is little need for hardware mpeg cards. I use windvr with a 878 card and capture to full mpeg fine and I have about half the computer ya'll have. I can also capture to avi with no problems.

[thedown90]

Thank you for a reply. Im sorry for my stupidity, but i do not know anything about this. Is there anyway you could tell me a Tuner that will do all what i want?

Watch while i piddle around.

Record Tv Shows when im not here, into a format that i can save a bunch of shows then convert them so they will fit on a DVD.

Will work with satelite, doesnt matter if i can change the channel with it or not as long as i can watch satelite through it.

Record home VHS tapes onto DVD's.

sorry that im such a noob at this i just need to know 1 or more cards that will do all this with good quality.
Thanks

[edDV]

Thank you for a reply. Im sorry for my stupidity, but i do not know anything about this. Is there anyway you could tell me a Tuner that will do all what i want?

Watch while i piddle around.

Record Tv Shows when im not here, into a format that i can save a bunch of shows then convert them so they will fit on a DVD.

Will work with satelite, doesnt matter if i can change the channel with it or not as long as i can watch satelite through it.

Record home VHS tapes onto DVD's.

sorry that im such a noob at this i just need to know 1 or more cards that will do all this with good quality.
Thanks

Any of the above.
Sat needs tuner supplied from "express vu canadian satelite". Record it through S-Video and audio to computer. For VHS use composite in.

[thedown90]

Can i not just use coaxial cable to hook up to my Tv Tuner? Will this not give audio as well as video? If not could i not just go from my TV tuner to my onboard surround sound system, with my audio in? Will this not work?

I have an
MSI K8N Neo 2 Platinum
AMD 3500 64bit
1GB of corsair ram
80GB HD
Asus radeon 9800 Pro 256MB

[edDV]

Can i not just use coaxial cable to hook up to my Tv Tuner? Will this not give audio as well as video?

It will work for a TV antenna, or analog cable yes. Sat no way, unless your sat tuner has RF out (Ch3 or 4).

[thedown90]

ok this is where im getting confused. my sat reciever does have the rf out, rf allowing me to use coaxial cable. Right now i have a splitter that goes from my sat rf out then i have my coaxial cable from that to a VCR in my room the same room as the computer. I want to take it out of the VCR and hook it directly up to my computer. Will that allow me to do it?

[Nelson37]

1. coax cable gives you the worst video quality of the three you have available.

2. the tuner on the card will NOT be able to tune in premium (encrypted) or digital channels.

3. the tuner on the card will often introduce undesirable signal degradation or artifacts.

on-board tuner is relatively useless. Use S-video from source. audio cables from source, split thru two y-cables. output from y-cables, one set to amp, other set to capture card.

ATI has hardware-assisted mpeg encode, SFAIK this is available ONLY thru ATI software. Some have issues with this software, true. Some people have trouble with automatic coffee makers, as well.

Hauppage has true hardware MPEG encoding, but no avi. I have read reports that it is possible to record avi with these cards, but have not tested this as I do not have one.

[edDV]

Agree, recommend S-Video and audio connection over RF.

Use RF only if you don't care. Same with VCR. Use composite over RF for VCR.

Radio Shack sells an audio DA if you don't have enough audio outputs..
http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&product%5Fid=15-1172

[thedown90]

ok then can you tell me a good TV tuner with that information. One for good price.
Thanks

[lordsmurf]

There is still significant CPU activity with AIW MPeg2 encoding.

I wouldn't say that. Some activity, yes. Significant, not really. Especially not on any computer bought within the past 4-5 years. P4 1.5 systems are really the lowest you can go and be able to run not only Full D1 MPEG-2 interlaced, but even pile on VideoSoap filters (more software work, optional).

Cards like the PVR-250 are self contained MPeg2 encoders. The only CPU activity is for preview.

Yes. Hardware MPEG-2 encoders still access the CPU, so it's still possible to have problems. Glad you mentioned that. It's an bad myth to think hardware = no CPU needed.